Nice '74 Zenith combo in OR

[drh4683]

Looks mint, with space command. I always liked this model. A little too far for me though otherwise I'd grab it.

http://salem.craigslist.org/atq/2286580976.html

[sampson159]

i got a call from this guy.his name is ron,also.he said he would sent pics via email.i never got them.looks very nice.400.00 is a little much but he told me the story and i am sure its a great piece.his mother passed away and he is clearing out her house.looks nice,just too expensive and far away

[rca2000]

WHY OH WHY????

THIS is THE ONE I have long wanted!! Pretty sure it has the "flat chassis" tv set and I KNOW it has the "nice amp" stereo--the LAST of them!!

If ONLY it was not so darn far away--or expensive!!

[drh4683]

Tell me about it. This is one of my favorite combos for the very reasons you mentioned. When I found the ad, I was hoping it was West Salem, Illinois! But no, its West Salem, Oregon. NOOOOOO!

[rca2000]

Yes--the "ultimate" Zenith SS combo--according to my HF-29 manual. The 25EC58 Chassis, the 6AT24 and/ 29AT24 stereo, Space command, and varactor tuning ( I think.) SE2595P model.

It only was closer and cheaper.

SOMEONE in that area HAS to save this...and that Zenith Emperor in Idaho too!!

[radiotvnut]

According to the chassis number of the stereo components, they were a 1970 design and carry-over. Is that correct? Am I also correct in assuming that the stereo components were also hand wired and not built on a PC board?

I fixed a '79 Zenith console stereo for a customer and talk about a let down in quality. The chassis was a cheap imported PC board POS, probably from Korea or Taiwan, and used a couple of small IC's (which were bad) for the audio outputs. I tried to talk the owner out of fixing it; but, they had to have it fixed. Whatever, it was their money.

[rca2000]

That would be correct!!

It has the big amp chassis with the BIG sinks on TO-3 outputs and a large tranny. The receiver is also hand--wired with touch-controls for function changing. And do not forget--the 25EC58 TV chassis--the BEST of the SS ones--as far as many of us here feel!!

As I say....IT DESERVES a nice, safe, caring home!! SOME HERE should be able to
give it one hopefully, and hopefully for a lesser price too.
I do not think the 1975 models had that stereo chassis anymore. And like you say--by '79..even Zenith went to single (cheap) board, imported crap stereo chassis.

[Carmine]

I'd love it too, but Doug is closer to Oregon than me! If only it were Oregon, OH (Just outside Toledo)

Just curious if there were other cabinet styles offered with the same internals? It seems like Zenith didn't offer many style choices once you got to the top-of-the-line. For example, I don't understand why only the Emperor's higher powered amp was only offered in the Italian Provincial style.

What if I had bucks, appreciated fine electronics, but had a room full of Danish Modern furniture?

[drh4683]

I agree Chris. Zenith seemed to have dropped the ball when it came to offering a top notch set in different cabinet styles. You could get a danish modern console from Zenith but like you said, it would still be a step down from the italian provincial styled emperor. This is where RCA really had them beat as they had high end sets of the same quality in all cabinet styles. I think most of us can agree too that RCA generally had better looking cabinets for the most part, especially in the danish modern department. Zenith seemed to have compromised on the cabinets by deciding that the electronics and build quality came first for the TV/stereo component while the cabinet design/quality was the second most important. I can't argue with that though. Few companies were engineering oriented and thats what I like best. I think of Chrysler in the 1960's as an engineering oriented company when it comes to cars for example.

As far as this cabinet on this set, it was first offered in 1970 with the 12A12C52 and again was the only "high end" set you could get from then up till 1975. It was more or less the "emperor" of the early to mid 70's...

[Carmine]

Originally Posted by drh4683

I agree Chris. Zenith seemed to have dropped the ball when it came to offering a top notch set in different cabinet styles. You could get a danish modern console from Zenith but like you said, it would still be a step down from the italian provincial styled emperor. This is where RCA really had them beat as they had high end sets of the same quality in all cabinet styles. I think most of us can agree too that RCA generally had better looking cabinets for the most part, especially in the danish modern department. Zenith seemed to have compromised on the cabinets by deciding that the electronics and build quality came first for the TV/stereo component while the cabinet design/quality was the second most important. I can't argue with that though. Few companies were engineering oriented and thats what I like best. I think of Chrysler in the 1960's as an engineering oriented company when it comes to cars for example.

As far as this cabinet on this set, it was first offered in 1970 with the 12A12C52 and again was the only "high end" set you could get from then up till 1975. It was more or less the "emperor" of the early to mid 70's...

All those thoughts have rolled through my head as well Doug, including the styling/engineering auto/electronics comparisons. RCA did some very nice danish modern designs, but then you get up close and the wood is very thin... Tops are usually warped from something being set on top. I can sit on top of many of my Zenith sets and they don't budge.

It reminds me of 1960s GM building 4-5 different auto transmissions that would just barely serve the power/weight needs of the car, and Chrysler doing just two versions for the same spread of power/weight ratios.

When either GM or RCA decided to put the bucks into it, the engineering departments could really make the "impossible" a reality. Yet smaller Chrysler or Zenith could start industry trends too, whether it was alternators or space-commands!

[drh4683]

Originally Posted by Carmine

All those thoughts have rolled through my head as well Doug, including the styling/engineering auto/electronics comparisons. RCA did some very nice danish modern designs, but then you get up close and the wood is very thin... Tops are usually warped from something being set on top. I can sit on top of many of my Zenith sets and they don't budge.

It reminds me of 1960s GM building 4-5 different auto transmissions that would just barely serve the power/weight needs of the car, and Chrysler doing just two versions for the same spread of power/weight ratios.

When either GM or RCA decided to put the bucks into it, the engineering departments could really make the "impossible" a reality. Yet smaller Chrysler or Zenith could start industry trends too, whether it was alternators or space-commands!

I was thinking about this topic after typing my last reply. Indeed we can claim Zenith was "engineering oriented" but in a way, I tend to take that back. RCA was actually at the top of their game. Remember that Zenith chose to stay out of the color TV race in the early days. Indeed they had R&D in the subject, that prototype color TV from '54 or whatever is proof, but they didn't make any daring bold moves in the consumer market. They waited to see the outcome of their competitors before entering the field. They didn't even start building their own color CRT's until 1963. RCA introduced (Im only comparing the two giants, RCA and Zenith here) solid state TV first, they had the electronic remote control which could control more functions. Things RCA had like a motor driven volume control simply blows the volume stepper relay concept away. UHF tuning via remote control was also an RCA advantage until the ultramatic tuner came out for the '69 models. Zenith was much more electro-mechanical with their equipment where as RCA (and Motorola) was finding ways to control these electronically much earlier in the game.
Zenith would catch up though, but it seems that Zeniths biggest claim to fame was remote control invention but that was an inevitable idea though, Zenith just happened to get there first. Zeniths other big advantage was the chromacolor picture tube which indeed changed industry standards. Im not bashing Zenith in any way, I just try to look in depth as to how and why Zenith operated the way they did when the competition seemed to favor being cheaper and using technology more to their advantage.

Zenith was a little more archaic and I think its because they didn't really want to sink money into R&D and "modernize" their plants. They kept riding the wave as long as they could with basically the same technology in their color TV's for many years. There would be improvements to the chassis each year, The TV's employed solid state devices by '68. They kept up, but at a seemingly slower pace. They just didn't come out with anything to blow the consumer away like RCA did with TV's like the G2000 for example. Not only was Zenith using similar technology for many years, but they chose to continue producing TVs with the laborious hand wired chassis. (from a TV collector standpoint and one who appriciates robust quality, I think this is great). We all know the benefits to this construction, especially in tube TV's and Zenith exploited that in their advertising, but sometimes I wonder if Zenith was somehow hiding the real truth as to why they stuck with the old ways. They didn't have to invest much into their various plants in Chicago to keep producing handwired TV's and Radios. Their plants were essentially all labor hands. They must have done the math and determined that it was cheaper (and or easier) to just keep producing a hand wired chassis. Who knows, perhaps CEO's at Zenith were on the rare side, meaning they were not greedy, money was flowing in, consumers loved their products, so why modernize and lay off a huge workforce in favor of cost cutting technology when ultimately the company had an outstanding reputation and a good profit margin? Like I said, I think they were riding the wave as long as they could without having to change things. Think about it, they didn't scrap the handwired chassis until 1978 when the system 3 was introduced! If you read the Zenith Transoceanic book, it also talks about life at Zenith and how in the 70's Zenith didn't want to get involved in designing a digital read out TO while the asian and european competitors were. They instead introduced a technologically obsolete radio that was higher in price but bragged that the quality was better than the rest. This seemed to have been the theme at Zenith for many years.

Either way, the profits were still high and Zenith appeared to be happy with the way things were. Zenith also chose not to get involved in semiconductor R&D and production like Motorola and RCA after they discussed the idea of doing so in the early 70's. Why get involved in a game that was well under way between two pioneers in the field? They also realized they were not going to be too competitive in the computer industry with a failed attempt in the mid to late 80's with Zenith Data Systems. They simply designed and built good quality consumer entertainment electronics.
So was Zenith at the forefront of engineering advances? Yes and no, but building a quality product was apparently the overall key ingredient to Zenith's success.

[sampson159]

zenith quality was still top notch until 1980-81?those last vertical chassis sets were awesome.when they went to the one piece chassis and inline crt,the end was near.as far as zenith radios,they were a little ancient but still very good performers.i recently talked with an old,old tv repair guy.he said zeniths downfall was that they made a product that was too good.you only bought it once.no repeat customers for 15-20 years.i know of many older folks back in the 90s who bought zenith because of past experiences.they werent happy with the new zeniths and many were thrown out in disgust.after having a set that lasted 20-25 years,they expected the same high quality piece.didnt happen.i just hated to see the name being denigrated.but we have our memories of those great zenith products.as i write this i am listening to my 12s370 radio.

[rca2000]

Maybe it is true...that Zenith just did not want to "modernize", but one way or another...I cannot think of ANY other consumer electronics products that were built like the hand--wired Zenith stuff was. It just says" quality built" ALL OVER the chassis of that stuff!! Probably one of the biggest that the Zenith HW chassis stuff is some of my most sought--after items.

And we should try and save all of them that we can. It is VERY, VERY likely that we will NEVER see anything built in American consumer--grade electronics with anywhere near this kind of build quality EVER again!!

[RobtWB]

you can add ANY consumer grade item to the list of poor to mediocre crap - not just electronics any longer that suffer from mediocre build quality - virtually every item now produced - whether here in the states or abroad is disposable
no more quality vacuum cleaners, coffee pots, electric fans, counter top appliance, stoves and ranges, washing machines and dryers, refrig's, furniture, automobiles ... the list goes on... you can blame the manufacturers and accountants for wanting huge profit margins from slave or near slave labor - and the walmart/big box mart consumer who happily buys the junk - seems fewer and fewer people demand quality as time goes on

on a happier note - that is one fine looking Zenith combo, it looks to be in as good of condition as that Frederiksburg I recently purchased

[drh4683]

Ok everyone, I did a crazy thing. I actually bought this combo and am having it sent out here. It'll be going a nice 2100 mile trip back to Chicago. I talked to the seller and he gave a deal on it as he wants it gone and I was able to find a guy delivering a motorcycle to Oregon from Wisconsin on uship and he's going to bring the set back for a real deal. I think the cost of gas will be higher than what this guy bid on the job for, but he figured its an easy trip and on his way back home to make a few extra bucks. The seller sent me a ton of extra photos in which to pursuade me to buy it. Everything supposedly works great, he even sent me a video of it with the stereo and TV working so I knew he was being honest. Its like brand new and has every peice of original documentation from when it was bought. Having a big combo like this is the last thing in the world I need, but its just too mint not to save this one. I should have it by April 21. Lets see how this goes...