Music Copy Rights On TV

[balddor]

This I don't understand. I bought Season 1 of Happy Days and ALL the original music is there, which is great! But, I'm a big fan of WKRP and their only DVD is season one with many original songs cut out because of music copy rights. Pure and simple this sucks. I know money is the sticky point but come on! I would gladly pay more for the DVD if the music tracks were original. Also, some of the dialogue has been redubbed by voice impersonators, usually when the actors were speaking over the music. TV shows on DVD are a lucrative market. I know they would make a hell of alot more $$$$ if the shows had its original music. So whats your take on this? If Happy Days can do it then why not WKRP!!!!!!!!!

[daveyh]

Sounds like a fake or bootleg copy.

[tentoze]

Originally Posted by daveyh

Sounds like a fake or bootleg copy.

Not true at all. If the owner of the show's rights don't want to pay the cash for the music royalties, no music. The Northern Exposure dvd's are the same way, and no doubt there are other examples.

[daveyh]

No wonder I am not getting my royalities!

[electroking]

The problem is that if the publisher is unwilling to include the original music due
to copyright considerations, can he still claim that what he is selling to you
is a DVD of the original show? This would be nearly fraudulent in my book!
I know of a successful Canadian movie (C.R.A.Z.Y.) that was not released
on DVD on international markets due to this kind of problem.

[Eric H]

In the case of WKRP it was money that kept the music off the DVDs.
It was some staggering five figure amount per episode for the music rights so they did without. Happy Days was probably a safer bet to recoup the investment.

The Bootlegs of WKRP actually have the original music, at least that's what I've been told.

The 1966 Batman series will probably NEVER see the legit light of DVD because the rights are so tangled up.

[leadlike]

I luckily only have one DVD that does this. It's the show Wiseguy and the finale uses Nights in White Satin to great emotional effect. Well, it did, but the DVD makers thought a sweet Jamaican beat would be sooo much better. That was a very expensive DVD set too.

We used to watch TBS (I think) for fun as ALL of their syndicated programs had the music removed in favor of some really muddy recordings all done by one guy. This meant that this one slob had to come up with dozens of new songs, and it shows. The two shows that suffered the most were China Beach, which used a ton of 60s music and had Paint it Black for a theme song; and Get a Life, which used REM's Stand for a theme as well as at least one other song per episode. As I said, we watched these for fun as it was done so poorly. Literally at the music cue, you could hear a tape recorder click on, and China Beach lost almost all sound as an awful psuedo-version of All Along the Watchtower would kick in. The worst original song ever belongs to an episode of Get a Life, where instead of playing the Money Money Money song, it was just that guy saying "I've got a fiiiiive dollar billllll" over and over.

It's my understanding that the series the Wonder Years is facing the same problems, and may never see a full DVD issueance. It's so sad-music publishers need to figure out a cheap "DVD rate" for this music, as they are really missing out on some serious revenue here.

[dew042]

Its the same way with the Northern Exposure DVDs, really detracts from the feel of the original show.

You have to remember that DVDs are a lucrative new revenue stream and the original contracts did not account for them. I know if I made something, I would want my rights protected against future profiteering.

dew.

[Eric H]

Originally Posted by dew042

Its the same way with the Northern Exposure DVDs, really detracts from the feel of the original show.

You have to remember that DVDs are a lucrative new revenue stream and the original contracts did not account for them. I know if I made something, I would want my rights protected against future profiteering.

dew.

True enough but is it really worth $50,000 for 30 seconds of one song?

I would think the record companies would be thrilled to get the exposure for their old catalog and would allow them to use it for a reasonable fee.

[KentTeffeteller]

Would you be willing to pay 4-9 times the price for a DVD set with the original music? Licensing on something like WKRP in Cincinnatti is a nightmare. That's assuming that the music copyright holder is willing to license said music. Also, some series used production library music cues. Some of those cues got licensed from other sources on the libraries used. Some of those music cues are in limbo as to ownership. Music clearances on films and TV series can be a logistical nightmare at best.

[andy]

Originally Posted by Eric H

True enough but is it really worth $50,000 for 30 seconds of one song?

I would think the record companies would be thrilled to get the exposure for their old catalog and would allow them to use it for a reasonable fee.

It's funny, but most companies have to PAY to get their products seen in TV shows, but not the record companies. You would think that once you paid for the rights to use a song it would be come part of the TV show forever, but record execs clearly don't think like normal people. It's no wonder why the recording industry is in so much trouble...

[treserious]

Originally Posted by andy

It's funny, but most companies have to PAY to get their products seen in TV shows, but not the record companies. You would think that once you paid for the rights to use a song it would be come part of the TV show forever, but record execs clearly don't think like normal people. It's no wonder why the recording industry is in so much trouble...

Agreed.

there is a separation from reality type of mentality with some of these organizations.

Just like the authors guild, basically forced amazon to neuter the kindle, and in another swoop, basically gave google the rights to sell orphaned works, which should be public domain...but apparently now arent...

copyright law, and its interpretation right now in regards to intellectual property, such as all medias, is really messed up.

they're enforcing the copyright claims in a draconian manner, completely disregarding the rights of the public domain, and fair use.
and trying to put a damper on the future of technology, out of their fear of new technologies, and their reluctance to evolve their business model with the times.

trying to figure out the copyright mess with regard to TV shows is near impossible.
copyright law is a mess, every copyright holder is bickering and fighting for their piece of the pie, and consumers suffer.

instead of this BS, they could just hammer out a deal for royalties, where they get paid per unit sold, the producers of the shows get to sell their DVDs, and the consumer gets to go to bets buy or wherever and buy them.
everyone wins.


I would like to see a collapse of all big media companies, and all their copyrights dissolved.
hand the copyrights back to the artists that actually created the works, and start from scratch.
all orphaned works, and works from deceased artists handed to the public domain.

[poohsan]

the original wayne's world movie - the scene in the music store when wayne plays about the first four notes of stairway - completely different in the dvd/vhs release. Four notes that weren't even played by page - removed. pretty darn silly if you ask me.

[treserious]

Originally Posted by poohsan

the original wayne's world movie - the scene in the music store when wayne plays about the first four notes of stairway - completely different in the dvd/vhs release. Four notes that weren't even played by page - removed. pretty darn silly if you ask me.

maybe there they had a license for the actual music, but which disallowed derivative works?

[dew042]

Originally Posted by treserious

copyright law, and its interpretation right now in regards to intellectual property, such as all medias, is really messed up.

they're enforcing the copyright claims in a draconian manner, completely disregarding the rights of the public domain, and fair use.
and trying to put a damper on the future of technology, out of their fear of new technologies, and their reluctance to evolve their business model with the times.

I just can't see allowing for new profit, DVD reissues being the same as on air, one time playback on a broadcast TV show - its not the same. The original public broadcast framework that these songs were licensed for is vastly different than the new releases for private home viewing.

Lets remember that most of the instances we are talking about are from era in which the internet and digital reproduction did not exist, or were budding.

New contracts clearly lay out the options for future usage, like they should. Artists, and copyright holders have a right to profit from the things they make, whether you like their industry or not.

dew.