Here's some more pics my daughter took of it. Besides being filthy, the biggest thing that I can see is the speaker is missing. Interesting that all the attaching hardware was put back.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/IMG_2063a_zps7pi29wcp.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/IMG_2063a_zps7pi29wcp.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/IMG_2064a_zpstpknzanu.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/IMG_2064a_zpstpknzanu.jpg.html)

Here's some more pics my daughter took of it. Besides being filthy, the biggest thing that I can see is the speaker is missing. Interesting that all the attaching hardware was put back.

The dirt, I can handle, it's the rust I dont like!
The CRT might be good, no brightner. :thmbsp:

This table version is apparently a somewhat scarce set. I had trouble finding pictures of another one on the internet.

Closest I can come is the console version. The control door is missing here as well. Very common with these Admirals. Courtesy: TVHistory site.

-Steve D.

Closest I can come is the console version. The control door is missing here as well. Very common with these Admirals. Courtesy: TVHistory site.

-Steve D.

Steve,
What model number is your attachment?

Thanks.

The dirt, I can handle, it's the rust I dont like!
The CRT might be good, no brightner. :thmbsp:
Yeah, the dirt will clean off. The AMC 116T TV was filthy, but cleaned up real nice. I'm thinking this one will too. Yeah, I was glad to see no brightener. I'll see her in about a week so I'll report back on the CRT and any other findings.

Steve,
What model number is your attachment?

Thanks.

The console model # is 24R12 with 14" screen. I also found this Admiral console listed as a 14R12: http://www.auctionzip.com/auction-lot/ADMIRAL-14R12-TELEVISION_1E84A96A0D/. A bit confused

-Steve D.

The dirt, I can handle, it's the rust I dont like!
The CRT might be good, no brightner. :thmbsp:

Rust don't bother me especially when it is only on the inside. Most sets rust where it don't count (chassis surfaces), and you can get the circuits working as good as new, leave the rust and never have a problem...

I've been wanting another Bakelite TV since selling my last ones, so I almost went for this...Then the guy that got it chimed in, and I decided to back off and let him have it.

I've been wanting another Bakelite TV since selling my last ones, so I almost went for this...
I know of a place where you could find some of those Admiral Bakelite consoles...

.

The console model # is 24R12 with 14" screen. I also found this Admiral console listed as a 14R12: http://www.auctionzip.com/auction-lot/ADMIRAL-14R12-TELEVISION_1E84A96A0D/. A bit confused

-Steve D.
The set shown is Bob Casey's set, as shown on his website. That one's a 16" model.
The model numbers that I listed, in an earlier entry for the model in question, were taken from the Rider's volume six, coverage on that model and chassis.

Guys,
Had a chance to look deeper into this TV. It is indeed a 14R12 with a 20T1 chassis.
The CRT tested very low on my BK 476 tester. Below the green. I did a "Clean" on it and it didn't improve much. The rest of the chassis looks pretty good. A little rust on 2 of the mounting feet. Looks like one of the electrolytics has been replaced. Otherwise very much unmolested.

The cabinet has no cracks but certainly needs worked on. No deep scratches or anything like that.

A few of the tubes tested bad but most tested well into the green.

Looking forward to restoring this one.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/IMG_5566a_zpsywjpkexh.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/IMG_5566a_zpsywjpkexh.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/IMG_5567a_zpseyu6ynao.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/IMG_5567a_zpseyu6ynao.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/IMG_5570a_zpswjfxj6dd.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/IMG_5570a_zpswjfxj6dd.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/IMG_5550a_zpsu82rs3a9.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/IMG_5550a_zpsu82rs3a9.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/IMG_5515a_zpscogl3b0z.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/IMG_5515a_zpscogl3b0z.jpg.html)

Guys,
Had a chance to look deeper into this TV. It is indeed a 14R12 with a 20T1 chassis.
The CRT tested very low on my BK 476 tester. Below the green. I did a "Clean" on it and it didn't improve much. The rest of the chassis looks pretty good. A little rust on 2 of the mounting feet. Looks like one of the electrolytics has been replaced. Otherwise very much unmolested.

The cabinet has no cracks but certainly needs worked on. No deep scratches or anything like that.

A few of the tubes tested bad but most tested well into the green.

Looking forward to restoring this one.
It looks like a rebuilt CRT. The set appears to have been used, well into the 60's, judging from the replacement tubes. :scratch2:

Can you go into more detail as to why you think it is a rebuilt CRT and also what tubes gives you the clue to say that the set was used well into the 60's. I'm thinking maybe I could learn something.

Thanks.

60s style 5u4 and horizontal output tube may be why he said that

HV rect looks to have very sharp edges to the top glass...That did not come till the mid-late 60's I believe.

60s style 5u4 and horizontal output tube may be why he said that

The original CRT, usually had an Admiral run number and their name stamped in orange ink or paint stamped on the CRT.
The great pictures you furnished don't show a brand name on the CRT base.
The CRT's in a set that age, wouldn't make it past about five years. :no:

Thanks guys for the insight on dating when the TV was serviced!

Since this has gone from a "set for sale" thread to a repair thread I decided to move it to this forum. I left a redirect for one week so everyone can find it.

I have this set too. Very thick Bakelite and heavy as can be. Mine is actually a copper plated chassis. Chassis 20T1. I also have the 14" console to match. Extremely well made and great sets once restored.

Since this has gone from a "set for sale" thread to a repair thread I decided to move it to this forum. I left a redirect for one week so everyone can find it.

Eric,
Thanks for the relocation. I was going to shut down the For Sale thread and start a restoration thread.

I have this set too. Very thick Bakelite and heavy as can be. Mine is actually a copper plated chassis. Chassis 20T1. I also have the 14" console to match. Extremely well made and great sets once restored.

I'm looking forward to restoring this TV. This is my first Admiral and you're right. The cabinet is stout!

I'm looking forward to restoring this TV. This is my first Admiral and you're right. The cabinet is stout!

An Admiral, like the one you have, will respond very well to new components. It is very rewarding when you apply power and it just works.

Good luck, please make sure to document and post pictures.

Just to let everyone know, this set uses a 14CP4 CRT. It is a model 14R12 with a 20T1 chassis. Brown Bakelite cabinet.

Just to let everyone know, this set uses a 14CP4 CRT. It is a model 14R12 with a 20T1 chassis. Brown Bakelite cabinet.

I misquoted the CRT type number as a 14CP4. Must have been thinking of a 17BP4. I was right with the model and chassis number, per Riders eight.
This model doesn't use the audio output, as the voltage divider, like the 20Z1, a year earlier. :scratch2:

I misquoted the CRT type number as a 14CP4. Must have been thinking of a 17BP4. I was right with the model and chassis number, per Riders eight.
This model doesn't use the audio output, as the voltage divider, like the 20Z1, a year earlier. :scratch2:

I think you said 14BP4 in the classifieds post. Looking at the specs for 14CP4 and 14BP4 they look very close. Both spherical faces I believe.

I think you said 14BP4 in the classifieds post. Looking at the specs for 14CP4 and 14BP4 they look very close. Both spherical faces I believe.

Poor proof reading again! I meant 14CP4. I knew, there was a 14BP4, RCA used a 14EP4, which is similar. It all depended on the manufacturer, who made the tube, which number they assigned to it.
It's probably 50 years ago, since I bought and installed one. :scratch2:

Today I started on the restoration for reals. I again checked the CRT on my BK 467. All I could get is a .45 reading. Still into the red even after about a half hour. I then decided to try it in my 16" AMC TV. So I swapped the CRT's and the 14" gives a decent picture. Now it was a little out of focus, but it was bright enough! My shop is well lit and the picture showed up real good with all the lights on. So I'm proceeding wit the restoration.

Next up is to check the transformers and coils etc.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4299a_zps53aspq4o.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4299a_zps53aspq4o.jpg.html)

Earlier in this thread, there was a discussion on the CRT. It looks like it is a replacement. It has not been rebuilt. It is a CBS Hytron 14CP4. I couldn't read the date code.

This CRT has 2 getters. One on each side of the neck between 2 bands of the internal aquadag.

I'm including some pictures of the label and what the getters look like.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4300a_zpstqejh88s.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4300a_zpstqejh88s.jpg.html)

After a good look over, I pulled the HV rectifier tube and the lead off the 1B3GT tube then powered up the chassis using my variac and meters. No problems and all the tubes lit up. I used my meter to check the HV rectifier and 1B3GT tube heaters. All checked ok.

Why did you pull the 1B3 ? No harm is gong to come from leaving it installed.

Why did you pull the 1B3 ? No harm is gong to come from leaving it installed.

You're right. Seeing the rectifier tube was pulled. Just being overly cautious and still being new to this.

Sure, I understand. What I typically do is pull the 5U4 rectifier tube for the first power up. That will kill B+ to the entire set and only the filaments get power. Then I put my DMM in AC mode and probe the 5U4 socket. Should have around 5 VAC for the filament and 700-800 between the plates. That's a quick way to see if the power transformer is any good without risking damaging anything.

You're right. Seeing the rectifier tube was pulled. Just being overly cautious and still being new to this.

If you are worried about protecting the flyback while testing other stuff the better tube to pull would be the Horizontal output.

If you are worried about protecting the flyback while testing other stuff the better tube to pull would be the Horizontal output.
Pulling the rectifier tube is the first thing I do!
On the horiz out, remove the entire tube, not just the plate cap. Just lifting the plate cap, can still destroy the H.O, because of no plate voltage. :thumbsdn:

All good stuff. Thanks guys for the tips. I'm going to check for the high voltage from the transformer at the 5U4G tube. I didn't do that yet.

612vac at the 5U4G tube pins 4 and 6. Riders says 310vac each side.

Guys, I could use a little help. I am checking the mica caps as to their location in the chassis and their values to compare them to the schematic. I think one of them isn't the value as shown on the schematic, both Sams and Rider's. I've taken close ups of the micas and would like some help in reading the dot codes. I've got the Radio Daze color page describing how to read them.

What I would like is for you guys to confirm their values from the pictures. Just to see if I'm reading them right.

The 1st one is C403. Yellow, violet, black, brown, silver, orange
The 2nd one is C404. White?, yellow, violet, red, silver, black
The 3rd one is C413. Grey, red, black, white?, silver, green
The 4th one is C420. Yellow, violet, black, black, silver, blank
The 5th one is C421. Yellow, blank?, black, red, silver, black

Thank you for your help.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/C403_zpsgfpnsvz9.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/C403_zpsgfpnsvz9.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/C404_zpsyoylgjyt.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/C404_zpsyoylgjyt.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/C413_zpsxuhaxtxz.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/C413_zpsxuhaxtxz.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/C420_zpstoikpbhv.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/C420_zpstoikpbhv.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/C421_zps4wempfav.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/C421_zps4wempfav.jpg.html)

Here are my best guesses

1st 47 pF (might be 4700 ?)
2nd 470 pF
3rd 82 pF
4th 47 pF
5th 1000 pF

Remember most schematics don't reflect some or all production changes (Admiral had MANY), schematics (especially Sam's) had errors/typos, and that if it was factory wired the way it currently is then it is likely to work better being left alone than it will if you make it match the schematic. So it is most advisable to leave the factory wiring config alone till you finish recap and other avenues of troubleshooting.

Also you probably know this, but micas rarely fail and often are in circuits that require re-alignments after cap change (sometimes even lead dress changes can upset it). Leave micas under 1000pF alone unless you have good reason to believe they are bad. Ones over 1000pF often are not really micas, but paper caps in mica's clothing, and as a matter of policy I normally change them.

Here are my best guesses

1st 47 pF (might be 4700 ?)
2nd 470 pF
3rd 82 pF
4th 47 pF
5th 1000 pF

Bob, Thanks for taking the time to reply. It's appreciated.

#1 is listed as C403 .0047mfd mica or 4700pf
#2 is listed as C404 .006mfd mica or 6000pf
#3 is listed as C413 82mmfd mica or 82pf
#4 is listed as C420 470mmfd 5% mica or 470pf
#5 is listed as C421 .001mfd 5% mica or 1000pf

Both Sams and Rider's agree on the values. As you can see #1 and #2 differ. #3-5 agree with both parts lists. BTW the part designators are from Rider's.

I then remembered that my multimeter can check the values of capacitors. Both #1 and #2 measured out to 4.70nf or 4700pf.

I really don't know why the color code is so difficult to determine the value of these caps.

Looks like I'll be using 4700pf 5% 500V Silver Micas for their replacement.

I'm including the schematic from Rider's.

OK. I can see the 2nd one has a red multiplier dot I thought was brown earlier. As for the first. I think it's a variant that has three digits (yellow. violet, black) then a X10 multiplier (brown).

As Tom mentioned, Admiral did many production run changes. You should have a run # stamped somewhere on your chassis.

I dug up a whole page of 20T1 production changes in the Wallace Teleaide for Admiral. Click for a larger version.
https://c5.staticflickr.com/9/8032/29218665364_20cb3d8a3c_n.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/LvXifu)


No mention of C404 but this may explain it. There were parts shortages due to the Korean conflict and high consumer demand so substitutions were made.
https://c3.staticflickr.com/6/5231/29732889722_e979182e6d.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/MioQeG)

Wow, Thank you Bob. Is there anyway that I can save those prints? I tried to save them as an image and the resolution was bad. But I can view them very clearly.

Thanks again.

Clicking on them should take you to Flickr where you'll have options to save it in a variety of resolutions. Here's a link to the full size version.

https://c5.staticflickr.com/9/8032/29218665364_7eb897ea12_o.jpg

Got it!

Thanks Bob.

As I do with the radios and TV's I restore, I label all the components using the SAMS designators. This allows me to see what is in the TV, part-by part. Also I check the component against Sams schematics. When done, I compile my resistor and capacitor parts lists.

Next up is to order what I need.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4519a_zpstik9fqwi.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4519a_zpstik9fqwi.jpg.html)

The parts are ordered.

I ordered my E-Caps from Digikey and they will be here in a day or so. So I thought that I would start on re-stuffing the 2 E-Caps. 1 E-Cap is a 4 section and the other is 3 sections. Basically what I do is to remove both cans from the chassis, cut them at the base, clean out the cans, and build up the E-Caps using a new base from a donor E-Cap. This way the terminals are nice and new, but more important, the twist lock tabs are new and shouldn't break off when installing the re-stuffed E-Cap.

1) The first thing I did was dig out my donor cap for the new base. I got a bunch of these at an auction for almost nothing. The E-Caps are all 4 sections. This way I can use their bases on anything I should need on my TV's and radios.

2&3) I cut the bases off using my band saw. I cut just above where the smaller diameter can meets the base. Once the base is cut off, I true up the base using a flat piece of 80 grit sandpaper to bring the edge of the can down to nothing so only the base is left. I then drill a 5/32 hole in the center for the wires to pass through. I suppose you could drill a hole by each terminal and then 1 for the ground wire.

4) I then take some 1" schedule 40 PVC sprinkler pipe and true up 1 end using my disc sander and 90 degree guide. Once trued up I mark that end with an arrow using a Sharpie. I then mark off a 1 inch mark and again cut off the 1 inch piece using my band saw. I then true up the end of the remaining stock using my disc sander and 90 degree guide. Then I mark off 1 inch and cut another piece of PVC pipe. I then clean up the edges using my hobby knife and some 220 grit sandpaper.

5) Then I mix up some 15 minute epoxy and apply it to the end marked by the arrow using a flat toothpick. I then place it on the base and then again using a flat toothpick, I apply a small amount of epoxy around the inside perimeter. Once that is done, I make sure there is no epoxy on the outside of the PVC tube. This would cause a problem when the can from the original E-Cap is placed over the PVC pipe and pushed down.

6) I let them assembly to dry overnight.

I'll then add the new E-Caps to the new base assemblies. Then using the original E-Caps I'll cut off the cans from their bases and true up the cans to be placed over the new re-stuffed bases.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4525a_zpshnbaynwy.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4525a_zpshnbaynwy.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4522a_zpse3dffais.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4522a_zpse3dffais.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4524a_zpskxctp09i.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4524a_zpskxctp09i.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4526a_zpstmbqrwuk.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4526a_zpstmbqrwuk.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4530a_zpsowjyrwlz.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4530a_zpsowjyrwlz.jpg.html)

My E-Caps came in today so I decided to build them up.

I use hot glue to hold them together and some 600 volt solid wire for the leads. I color code each cap and make notes as to what cap, wire color, goes to each symbol. I want to match the originals.

On the C2 which has only 3 caps, I used some balsa to from some spacers for the lower cap. This help stabilized the whole thing.

The pics speak for themselves.

Later tonight, I cut off the original cans, clean them and then the E-Cap re-stuffing will be finished and they'll be ready to install into the chassis.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4532a_zpsdwyiydj6.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4532a_zpsdwyiydj6.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4534a_zpskwtkktm3.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4534a_zpskwtkktm3.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4536a_zpsxmpa5s8r.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4536a_zpsxmpa5s8r.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4537a_zpsaydcv7qi.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4537a_zpsaydcv7qi.jpg.html)

Nice very nice :-) All the best,Tom.J

Thanks Tom.

Both E-Caps are soldered into the chassis. Now on to getting the wires back on.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4540a_zpsu3acucpw.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4540a_zpsu3acucpw.jpg.html)

That's a very neat E-cap rebuilding method you have. :thmbsp: I need to get me some of that schedule 40 PVC tubing. One obvious short cut would be to saw the tops off the cans while the bases are still mounted and wired to the chassis. Unfortunately some times they land in locations too tight to get a jewelers saw and sanding block in there.

Thanks Kevin.

I wired in the E-Cap cans and tacked in the 2 other E-Caps. I then carefully powered up the chassis. At 110V mains, I got 208V B+ ( 238 listed in Sams), and a raster. No audio though. Though the "hash" went up and down with the volume control. Looks like all the front panel controls did something. After about 2 minutes, I heard a "pop" from under the chassis. I quickly powered down and did a visual. Didn't see anything. So I powered it back up and still no audio and this time no raster. No HV either. So I shut it down till I can replace all the paper caps and such.

When looking this thing over when I first got it, I was amazed that there weren't any shorts because of the way the components were wired in. When replacing the caps and resistors, I do a complete and through job on lead dress.

I'm expecting my order from Just Radios to get here early next week.

Just don't change IF lead dress...You may need to do an alignment afterwards if you do.

Just don't change IF lead dress...You may need to do an alignment afterwards if you do.

Yeah, the IF section is nicely done. It's the other part that needs a lot of TLC.

Guys, I need to replace the wire from the cap of the 6BQ6GT to the flyback. The cap connector came off and when I stripped the wire back some, it was all green and the green just powdered off. Not good. I need to replace this wire that is about 6 inches long. Looks to be about 20 awg. I'm thinking the some UL1015 600 volt stranded wire would work.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4551a_zpsceaksjkv.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4551a_zpsceaksjkv.jpg.html)

The insulation on the wire you are thinking of using will not last very long due to the 3kv to 4.5kv pulse on that lead. I do not have the Belden type number in front of me but I would use a bit of focus lead from a BPC junker for that lead. All the best, Tom.J

The insulation on the wire you are thinking of using will not last very long due to the 3kv to 4.5kv pulse on that lead. I do not have the Belden type number in front of me but I would use a bit of focus lead from a BPC junker for that lead. All the best, Tom.J

A couple of layers of shrink sleaving will work in a pinch. :scratch2:

I have a junker 19" B&W tv I got off the curb one day. I'll get the wire off of the HV anode wire from this tv.

I didn't know what kind of voltages to expect. Now I do.

If you have an old CRT monitor kicking around, you could steal its high voltage wire off it. Those monitors also usually have a fair amount of high voltage caps of the sort useful in TV restorations.

If you have an old CRT monitor kicking around, you could steal its high voltage wire off it. Those monitors also usually have a fair amount of high voltage caps of the sort useful in TV restorations.

Good idea, but no old monitors laying around. I'll get the HV wire from the 19" TV.

Well, I just stripped the wire back another 3/8 inch and it was good clean wire. I cleaned up the plate cap connector and re-soldered it back on to the wire. All is well now. I do have some 20K wire I salvaged from the 19" TV.

I've started on changing a few resistors that were basically stand alone. I'm waiting for my Just Radios order to come in. Then the recapping will take place in earnest.

My order from Just Radios came in! Full speed ahead. I placed the order last Monday night the 26th. Great service. Just less than a week to get here.

Changed some resistors and caps that were easy just to get into it.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4569a_zps9uaorv9j.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4569a_zps9uaorv9j.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4570a_zps1w2htghe.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4570a_zps1w2htghe.jpg.html)

Changed some resistors and caps that were easy just to get into it.
That really is a labor of love. :thmbsp:

Recapping continues. I replaced the 1.5K 10W Candohm resistor with a 1.5K 50W chassis mount resistor. I was going to use a 25W resistor but the 50W was less than a buck more and I feel it will work better to dissipate the heat.

I'm using 1W resistors to replace the 1/2W carbon composition ones. I'm staying with replacing 1W with 1W and so on. In one instance, I used a 3W resistor instead of a 2W.

When I replace a component, I check it off my list, and then highlight it on the schematic. Helps keeps track of what was replaced and a "visual" of my progress.

I'm also checking each removed resistor for its value and the value of its replacement. If interested, I'll publish that list when done.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4578a_zpszow5sqmf.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4578a_zpszow5sqmf.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4579a_zpsrdmveswb.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4579a_zpsrdmveswb.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4580a_zps4cawny3h.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4580a_zps4cawny3h.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4581a_zpsz935jyxt.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4581a_zpsz935jyxt.jpg.html)

I think I found out why I lost HV on the power up. Looks like R82 a 6.8K resistor is open. I'm redoing V16 a 6BQ6GT Horizontal Output tube. This resistor was buried way down.

The resistor has a couple of small cracks on one end. Other than that the resistor looks normal.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4583a_zpsuba88bae.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4583a_zpsuba88bae.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4605a_zpssyqbaqix.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4605a_zpssyqbaqix.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4581b_zpsooym0ds9.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4581b_zpsooym0ds9.jpg.html)

Well, I got V15 and V16 done. It was a bit tight! I like the way Admiral did the 3 resistors on V15!

Here are some before and after pictures.

Looks like VK won't allow me to upload any more pictures. I'll have to contact the Admin.

I decided to power it up again to check my progress so far. The good news is that it powered up nicely and my B+ is 244 volts. Sams lists 238 volts. I also have a raster and each control seems to do something. Like Brightness does control the brightness and so on. I only have a low level buzz coming through the speaker which can be varied with the volume control. Also no video.

I tried wiggling each tube but that didn't help. On a few like the sound IF amp it clicked pretty loud in the speaker. Seeing I haven't gotten to the IF stages yet, I'm not surprised.

What's left to do is the 3 IF stages, Video Detector, a little in the Video Amp, Sound IF amp, Ratio Detector, Sync Amp-Sync Separator, and the Sync Clipper.

Once these are done then I'll have to get into the troubleshooting phase. So far so good.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4626a_zpsptpisiym.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4626a_zpsptpisiym.jpg.html)

I recapped the Video Amp, Sync Amp-Sync Sep., and Sync Clipper. I powered it up and still no audio except some hash which goes to a loud buzz when I touch the center wiper on the volume pot. Basically the same thing as before. I'm thinking that the trouble lies in the IF stages or tuner.

BTW, the tuner inserts have numbers on them that seem to correspond to channel numbers. Does the ones with "4F" on them equal channel 4? I need to know so I can be sure I'm on channel 4 because my CD player and RF modulator are set to Channel 4.

Another thing, I remember seeing something about hooking up a CD player directly to the video section? thus bypassing the tuner. Can this be done?

Recapping that's left are the 3 IF stages, Sound IF Amp, and the Ratio Detector.

Thanks.

If you have a source with separate audio and video (not RF) output, you can temporarily connect that video source to the video input of your TV. Typically, this is a spot directly after the video detector, where it sends the video signal to the grid of the video amplifier tube. This diagram is for a different TV, but it should give you the general idea:

http://antiqueradio.org/art/A-V_AdapterVideoInjection.jpg

If the picture looks dramatically better when you inject the video, that suggests that you have a problem somewhere upstream of the injection point, in the tuner/IF/detector stages.

Phil Nelson
Phil's Old Radios
http://antiqueradio.org/index.html

Phil,
Thanks! I made the box and used alligator clips. I pulled the cap off the volume pot and clipped on the audio. Then I had a spare 6AU6 tube so I bent #1 pin up and soldered on a small extension. I inserted the tube and clipped on the video.

I have both audio and video now. I'll trouble shoot the IF stages now.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4630a_zpsvv2ei408.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4630a_zpsvv2ei408.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4628a_zpsqqj1c3wn.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4628a_zpsqqj1c3wn.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4629a_zpsch9bxiwu.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4629a_zpsch9bxiwu.jpg.html)

I have a question about my problem. It is either in the IF stages or the tuner. Is there a way to substitute the tuner? That way I could really narrow down the problem.

I'd look at the IF stages first. Tuners are comparatively bulletproof in my (limited) experience. Make sure the tuner tubes are good and its contacts are clean.

Yes, there are ways to substitute for the tuner. Back in the day, they sold "tuner subbers," little gizmos that do what they sound like. You can also inject an IF signal (and do many other tricks) with a BK 1077 TV Analyst like this one:

http://antiqueradio.org/BK1077BTelevisionAnalyst.htm

You can also make simpler measurements such as checking the gain of each stage, checking voltages on each tube, etc. If you have a voltage chart, that's one easy way to start.

Phil Nelson
Phil's Old Radios
http://antiqueradio.org/index.html

Phil,
Thanks for the suggestions. I forgot about the voltage chart. I'll do the resistance checks first then the voltage checks.

Success! I did the resistance checks per the chart in Sams and found V5 pins 5 and 6 showed open when they should have had 2.6K to pin 8 of the LV rectifier tube (120V). I checked the schematic and R29, a 1K resistor, was between the tube pins and 120V bus. I then did a visual on the resistor and it looked good. I then bumped it with my finger and a lead pulled out of the resistor! I replaced the resistor and now I have very good audio and video through the antenna terminals.

I have to finish replacing the rest of the resistors and a few micas yet. But getting a good picture and sound is very encouraging.

BTW, the CRT, a 14CP4 tested very low on my BK 467 but played in my AMC TV came up real good with a very good life test when I gave it to my friend who has a Beltron. He rejuvenated the CRT for me.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4633a_zpsmefu4ykz.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4633a_zpsmefu4ykz.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4631a_zpsvnzgy19k.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4631a_zpsvnzgy19k.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4632a_zpsskoxmyun.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4632a_zpsskoxmyun.jpg.html)

Nice bit of troubleshooting! :yes: I stand in awe at the quality of your overall workmanship sir.

Nice bit of troubleshooting! :yes: I stand in awe at the quality of your overall workmanship sir.

Phil was the one that tripped my mind to use those charts in Sams. Thank you for the kind words.

Phil was the one that tripped my mind to use those charts in Sams. Thank you for the kind words.

I looks like one of those foreign made resistors, that Admiral used at the time.
I like the yellow caps for old set restorations. They're so small, compared to the originals and the leads are usually long enough to do a neat job.

Dieseljeep,

Could be. Their leads are very thin. Agree on the yellow caps!

I pulled the entire sub-assembly from the chassis. It was a lot easier to work on. I finished the audio section of V7, V8, and V9. Cleaned up the entire area too.

On to the real IF section on the other side of the sub-assembly.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4659a_zpsw1ozjk4v.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4659a_zpsw1ozjk4v.jpg.html)

The IF section is finished. Now on to the topside to clean it up and re-installation.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4667a_zpsbo1jykay.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4667a_zpsbo1jykay.jpg.html)

Those sure are some mighty small ceramic caps. Can you notice any change in alignment after doing that work?

Those sure are some mighty small ceramic caps. Can you notice any change in alignment after doing that work?

I used the same caps for my AMC 116T and didn't see any change. I'll let you know how these work out. They are the correct value, and 630 volt caps, and COG.

It looks like you cleaned all the old solder and lead bits from the terminal strips and tube socket terminals.
I used to have patience like that, but you still have me beat.
The kits I built, look like your work. That's why they still work well 52-55 years later.
Mostly Knight-Kits and a few Heaths.

Yeah, I clean up all the terminals where I can. Once "cleared out", I clean them with alcohol, then it is as if I were assembling the TV for the first time.

I'm all done replacing the caps and all the resistors except one in the tuner. It was buried and I didn't want to dig that deep into the tuner. The rest of the tuner's resistors, mica caps, and the sole dual disc cap were replaced.

I did a quickee test with the 14" CRT. Everything works. Excuse the quality of the picture that's because the CRT was just set in the tv and hooked up. The yoke and the focus coil weren't adjusted yet, that will come later when the final assembly takes place.

Now on to finishing cleaning up the chassis and bits to ready them for final assembly.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4681a_zpsz3udn1ex.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4681a_zpsz3udn1ex.jpg.html)

I remembered that I needed to change out the resisitors in the deflection yoke.

There are 3 of them. 1 is a 1K and the other 2 are 560 ohms. The 1K measured out to 1030 Ohms, while the other 2 measured out to 670 Ohms and 736 Ohms. They were replaced with 1W 5% resistors.

I wish I could have found a 47pf 1500 volt cap to replace the one in the yoke.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4690a_zpsxbmh0dcw.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4690a_zpsxbmh0dcw.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4691a_zps1sft3atl.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4691a_zps1sft3atl.jpg.html)

I finished the chassis and assembled it today. there are a few details that have to be worked out, but basically its done. It's playing as I type to "burn it in". Tomorrow I'll hook up my Eico 369 and BK O'scope to start the alignment. Tonight I'll attach my NTSC pattern generator and see if I can get the picture squared up.

Then on to the cabinet.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4704a_zpsxxslrram.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4704a_zpsxxslrram.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4707a_zpsu7kkj5pa.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4707a_zpsu7kkj5pa.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4708a_zpsvf2zgwpg.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4708a_zpsvf2zgwpg.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4709a_zpssdzuxihd.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4709a_zpssdzuxihd.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4710a_zpsobckvguj.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4710a_zpsobckvguj.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4711a_zpsykavede8.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4711a_zpsykavede8.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4712a_zpsd2odscqi.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4712a_zpsd2odscqi.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4713a_zps2qfsja7j.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4713a_zps2qfsja7j.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4715a_zpss8d1aap3.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4715a_zpss8d1aap3.jpg.html)

I have the pattern generator hooked up and this is where I am. It looks like both left and right side of the picture is blurry. What causes this?

I did have both the yoke and focus coil off the chassis and then reassembled the whole shooting match. Can a misalignment of either of these cause this?

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4718a_zpsggn7hmbh.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4718a_zpsggn7hmbh.jpg.html)

You mentioned it was out of focus earlier in the thread. It could simply be the combination of a tired electron gun and it being over driven to achieve what seems like normal brightness and contrast. The further the beam deviates from center the harder it is to maintain focus. You may be able to tweak the ion trap and get the outer edges a little better, at the expense of less focus in the center.


I kind of miss the plated chassis. ;) I thought it looked really nice after you cleaned it up, not that it looks bad now, I guess I just prefer the plated look.

You also might want to double check that the dag contact spring is making good ground contact through the painted chassis.

Yes, the position of the focus coil could effect it. Also your ion trap magnet looks to be too far back on the neck. Usually they are an inch or more away from the base rather than right up against it.

Another thing to consider is that if it is a flat faced CRT it could have poor edge focus by design...Early rectangular and large screen tubes had flat faces which was quickly moved away from by makers...You see as the beam is swept the physical distance the electrons travel increases as you move away from center. Curved screens were designed to keep electron travel fairy constant at all points of the screen during scanning....Some makers tried to apply sweep derived AC to the focus on flat faced tubes to reduce that effect, but on sets that lacked that you kinda have to live with what you have (which usually involved setting focus for a compromise between edges and center).

You mentioned it was out of focus earlier in the thread. It could simply be the combination of a tired electron gun and it being over driven to achieve what seems like normal brightness and contrast. The further the beam deviates from center the harder it is to maintain focus. You may be able to tweak the ion trap and get the outer edges a little better, at the expense of less focus in the center.


I kind of miss the plated chassis. ;) I thought it looked really nice after you cleaned it up, not that it looks bad now, I guess I just prefer the plated look.

Kevin,
I'll play with the ION trap a bit to see if it improves.

The plated chassis had a lot corrosion, not rust, but corrosion. I tried to rub it off but then that area was "polished" and still had the discoloration from the corrosion on it. I think at one time somebody spilled something down into it or most likely sprayed something into it.

You also might want to double check that the dag contact spring is making good ground contact through the painted chassis.

Good idea! I'll clean that area up to make sure I have good contact.

Yes, the position of the focus coil could effect it. Also your ion trap magnet looks to be too far back on the neck. Usually they are an inch or more away from the base rather than right up against it.

Bob,

I'll try and re-position the focus coil. I'm guessing the it should be centered on the neck of the CRT when the adjuster is also centered?

When I got the TV the ION magnet was positioned all the way back. I'll move it forward to see what happens. though I did move it around when I first powered it up.

Another thing to consider is that if it is a flat faced CRT it could have poor edge focus by design...Early rectangular and large screen tubes had flat faces which was quickly moved away from by makers...You see as the beam is swept the physical distance the electrons travel increases as you move away from center. Curved screens were designed to keep electron travel fairy constant at all points of the screen during scanning....Some makers tried to apply sweep derived AC to the focus on flat faced tubes to reduce that effect, but on sets that lacked that you kinda have to live with what you have (which usually involved setting focus for a compromise between edges and center).

Thanks Tom for that info. Maybe there might be a better compromise.

Guys, thanks for your comments. I'll try what was suggested. Your help is appreciated.

Well, I just lost HV and now no raster. I'm getting about 600 volts at the 2nd anode connection. I was messing around with the H freq. adjustment and then looked up and a dark picture tube! I tried to "undo" the adjustment but that didn't help. There was no popping sound or anything.

Guys, thanks for your comments. I'll try what was suggested. Your help is appreciated.

Well, I just lost HV and now no raster. I'm getting about 600 volts at the 2nd anode connection. I was messing around with the H freq. adjustment and then looked up and a dark picture tube! I tried to "undo" the adjustment but that didn't help. There was no popping sound or anything.

If you have a scope check the osc. waveforms and frequency against sam's. A guick check to see if your osc is working close to right is to check the grid voltage at the H out tube.

The plated chassis had a lot corrosion, not rust, but corrosion. I tried to rub it off but then that area was "polished" and still had the discoloration from the corrosion on it. I think at one time somebody spilled something down into it or most likely sprayed something into it.

If that 'corrosion' was green/white-ish green(sometimes yellowy) and fairly even then it is not corrosion, but rather Cadmium plating. It is natural for cad plating to turn green-ish with age, and it does not hurt anything when in that state. Best not to polish cadmium...It is rather toxic. I always leave the metal on cad plated chassis alone.

If that 'corrosion' was green/white-ish green(sometimes yellowy) and fairly even then it is not corrosion, but rather Cadmium plating. It is natural for cad plating to turn green-ish with age, and it does not hurt anything when in that state. Best not to polish cadmium...It is rather toxic. I always leave the metal on cad plated chassis alone.

Tom,
This chassis didn't seem to have the CAD plating on it. The corrosion consisted of many, many small dots. It wasn't an even coating. Some areas even left some small pits in the metal.

I really like the appearance of your painted chassis, but I was always afraid that paint may interfere with good chassis ground connections. And most (radio) restorations with a painted chassis looked bad because it left all the other visible pieces looking old/cruddy. I wonder what will happen with those tubes so close to the high voltage cage. One looks like it has got only 1/8" clearance. Are they going to cook, burn, or blister your paint job? And the possible smell...

.

I've done some troubleshooting.

I did a voltage check on the 3 tubes V15 a 6SN7GT Horizontal AFC and Osc., the 6BQ6GT Horizontal Output, and the 6W4GT Damper tube. Here are my findings. 2nd values are my readings:

6SN7GT
1 -2.8v -25v I thinks SAMS made a mistake here. Riders shows -40v.
2 100v 105v
3 -22v -16v
4 -60v -59v
5 235v 190v

6BQ6GT
4 140v 128v
5 -8.6v -8.6v
6 220v 190v
8 5.6v 6.3v

6W4GT
3 320v 250v
4 320v 250v
5 220v 190v
6 310v 255v

The voltages don't look too bad. Most are a little low.

I did hook up my scope to the grid (pin 5) on the 6BQ6GT tube and here is what I got:

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4722a_zpsnwuyb8u1.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4722a_zpsnwuyb8u1.jpg.html)

I then checked point "C" on L19 per Sams on adjusting the Horizontal Sweep Circuits. This is what I got after I adjusted "B3" on L19.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4720a_zps44twtgse.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4720a_zps44twtgse.jpg.html)

I don't know what the frequency was but the time dial was set 10us.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4721a_zpshndtcaft.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4721a_zpshndtcaft.jpg.html)

Here is a picture of the schematic showing the area:

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4724a_zpsoxqorgru.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4724a_zpsoxqorgru.jpg.html)

I also ohmed out the fly-back and it checked out pretty reasonable.

EDIT! I remembered that I can hook up my frequency counter to my O'scope and I then adjusted the Horizontal Frequency "B2" to get 15,734 cps.
Another EDIT! I added the voltage on the 6BQ6GT Pin 8.

Is there any way to test what's going on with the flyback? Like seeing the voltage from the 6BQ6GT plate cap? Like measuring the voltage there? Everything I've checked so far checked good. I'm getting about 3Kv right now and have a faint raster. So I am getting some HV, just not enough. I don't have a flyback checker. How can I check the door knob cap? I'm trying to find out why my HV is so low.

Thanks for your help.

Your horizontal drive signal basically looks good, but your boost voltage is 70 volts low originating at pin 3 of the damper, which is why some of your other voltages are low. What is your scopes volts per division setting when you measured the signal at the grid of the horizontal output? Have you by chance tried another damper and HV rectifier?

How does your 210 volt supply read at the fuse(M2)?

[edit] Don't forget to make sure your dag coating is grounded good, as I don't see any other HV filter cap going to ground.

Have you subbed the 6BQ6 yet? You van sub it with a 6DQ6 in a pinch. The 6W4 can be subbed with 6AX4 or 6AU4.

You failed to list voltage on pin 8 (cathode) of the 6BQ6. But on the schematic you indicate 5.6V. Are you still getting 5.6V there? If not, the tube is not conducting (or if it's too high, the tube is conducting too much).

Also try this - with the plate connector disconnected from the HV rectifier, use an insulated screwdriver and see if you can draw an 'air arc' from the connector. If the fly is putting out, you'll get an arc of a quarter inch or more. But don't short it to ground.

Have you subbed the 6BQ6 yet? You van sub it with a 6DQ6 in a pinch. The 6W4 can be subbed with 6AX4 or 6AU4.

You failed to list voltage on pin 8 (cathode) of the 6BQ6. But on the schematic you indicate 5.6V. Are you still getting 5.6V there? If not, the tube is not conducting (or if it's too high, the tube is conducting too much).

Also try this - with the plate connector disconnected from the HV rectifier, use an insulated screwdriver and see if you can draw an 'air arc' from the connector. If the fly is putting out, you'll get an arc of a quarter inch or more. But don't short it to ground.
We'll start with this one first.
I added the voltage on pin 8. Listed voltage is 5.6v and I measured 6.3v.

Will do that arcing test next.

I have subbed the 6BQ6GT and the 1B3GT. Not much change in the HV. Actually what is installed is a 6DQ6GT. When I had good HV, I subbed a NIB 6QB6GT and the HV was lower, so I put the 6DQ6 back in.

I also subbed the 6W4 with no help.

How does your 210 volt supply read at the fuse(M2)?

[edit] Don't forget to make sure your dag coating is grounded good, as I don't see any other HV filter cap going to ground.

I got 190v at the fuse. Earlier I cleaned the dag grounding wire mount and just ohmed it out and it shows zero ohms from the wire and from the dag.

I just tried the HV rectifier cap connector and I got a very healthy purplish 1/4 to 3/8 long arc.

So it looks like my problem might be with the 1B3GT or its connector. There are 2 resistors under the connector.

Could the door knob cap be bad?

Your horizontal drive signal basically looks good, but your boost voltage is 70 volts low originating at pin 3 of the damper, which is why some of your other voltages are low. What is your scopes volts per division setting when you measured the signal at the grid of the horizontal output? Have you by chance tried another damper and HV rectifier?

I think the volts per division were 5v.

I tried another damper and HV rect.

Where does the boost voltage come from? It looks like it might come from the flyback. What would cause it to be low.

Just trying to understand and get the voltages where they should be.

Could the door knob cap be bad?

There's a slight possibility it could be bad and dragging the HV down, just disconnect it to test, the CRT has a Dag coating and performs the same function so it shouldn't be essential.

There's a slight possibility it could be bad and dragging the HV down, just disconnect it to test, the CRT has a Dag coating and performs the same function so it shouldn't be essential.

Eric,
I just tried what you suggested and disconnected the lug from the bottom where the white/red wires are connected. When I powered up the set, all I got was some arcing sound from the base of the HV rectifier. I moved things around but each time I got the arcing sound so I put it back together. Still only about 3Kv.

BTW, I used my multimeter to measure the door knob cap. It measured out to 630pf but is listed as a 500pf cap.

Everybody I do appreciate your help with this stubborn problem. I'm sure we'll get it fixed. I just wanted to say thanks for your help.

...I moved things around but each time I got the arcing sound....
If you darken the room, it may be possible to see where the arc is.

Have you changed or tested the 1M resistor that's mounted under the 1B3 socket? Those often go very high in value/intermittent, or open. It's the 1M shown in series with the HV lead on the Sams schematic.

The boost voltage is derived by combining the 210 volt supply with the voltage of the lower flyback winding during horizontal retrace. It's a free source of energy during retrace, and so provides a boost to the 210 voltage supply that gets filtered and used for some circuits that work better with the higher voltage.

That was my oversimplified explanation of how boost voltage is generated. It's the best I can do while drinking Jack and Coke at 12:30am. :D

Have you changed or tested the 1M resistor that's mounted under the 1B3 socket? Those often go very high in value/intermittent, or open. It's the 1M shown in series with the HV lead on the Sams schematic.

The boost voltage is derived by combining the 210 volt supply with the voltage of the lower flyback winding during horizontal retrace. It's a free source of energy during retrace, and so provides a boost to the 210 voltage supply that gets filtered and used for some circuits that work better with the higher voltage.

Kevin,
The the 1meg resistor was changed and still measures 1 meg.

Thanks for the explanation for boost voltage.

If you darken the room, it may be possible to see where the arc is.

Just might do that if I have it apart again.

Well I changed out both resistors (R85 and R86) that were in the connector base of the 1B3GT and used heat shrink everywhere to assure no problems.

I then powered it up with the door knob cap (67) out of the circuit and I still have about 3Kv. I then reassembled the connector and cap and the same thing, 3KV.

I substituted the 1B3GT and still the same thing. I substituted the 6W4GT damper and still the same thing.

Right now I'm at a loss as to what could be the problem

I am thinking of removing the white/red wire that feeds to #1 on the yoke assembly to isolate the yoke assembly. Can I do that without causing other problems?

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4733a_zpsbrnepcmv.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4733a_zpsbrnepcmv.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4734a_zpstge3mkyx.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4734a_zpstge3mkyx.jpg.html)

I removed the white/red wire to isolate the Horizontal wings on the yoke and then checked the voltage.

With the white/red connected 205v
With the white/red wire disconnected 245v

I disconnected the wire from one of the terminal on the flyback. #8 on the schematic.

Still have to do the Vertical windings.

Your HV rectifier socket looks charred on one side. Or is that dark black some liquid tape? Or possibly it's just the lighting. It might be normal for the voltages to come up without the load of the yoke on the horizontal fly winding.

I separated the vertical windings from the VOT and still no HV.

I'm at a loss right now.

I do get a 1/4 long purple arc on the top cap of the 1B3GT tube. So does that mean I have good HV to that point?

Thanks.

Your HV rectifier socket looks charred on one side. Or is that dark black some liquid tape? Or possibly it's just the lighting. It might be normal for the voltages to come up without the load of the yoke on the horizontal fly winding.

Kevin,
The 1B3GT socket is in great shape. It must be the lighting.

Any chance there's a carbon trace that's formed from your CRT's second anode button to the dag? It's a little strange how this problem showed up after switching from the test CRT to the original. I'd even be tempted to check the HV with lead disconnected from the CRT, although I'm not sure it that's a good idea. Maybe old_coot88 can chime in on that thought.

Any chance there's a carbon trace that's formed from your CRT's second anode button to the dag? It's a little strange how this problem showed up after switching from the test CRT to the original. I'd even be tempted to check the HV with lead disconnected from the CRT, although I'm not sure it that's a good idea. Maybe old_coot88 can chime in on that thought.

Kevin,
I switched back to the test CRT a while ago. It was easier to flip the chassis over to get to test points and to help isolate things. With both the regular and test CRT's I get the same result.

I appreciate you hanging in here with me and offering suggestions. Thanks.

It's very unlikely that this problem is related to the yoke (if it was, you wouldn't have gotten that healthy arc off the 1B3 connector).

More likely there's a leakage path from the HV source to ground that's lugging down the HV.

First try disconnecting the anode connector from the CRT. Does the HV come up any? If not, then the leakage path is from the 1B3 socket area to ground (and is probably the source of that arcing you heard).

What is the highest Resistance (ohms) range on your multimeter? If it'll go to 20 megohms or higher, try measuring from the 1B3 filament winding to ground. It should show infinite resistance (open circuit). Any indication at all would indicate leakage sufficient to drag down the HV.

Sometimes the insulation on the 1B3 filament winding will break down and arc through to the flyback frame. (The filament winding is one or two turns of thick wire wrapped onto the frame). Or possibly a leakage path has developed in one of the 1B3 socket mount standoffs.

It's very unlikely that this problem is related to the yoke (if it was, you wouldn't have gotten that healthy arc off the 1B3 connector).

More likely there's a leakage path from the HV source to ground that's lugging down the HV.

First try disconnecting the anode connector from the CRT. Does the HV come up any? If not, then the leakage path is from the 1B3 socket area to ground (and is probably the source of that arcing you heard).

What is the highest Resistance (ohms) range on your multimeter? If it'll go to 20 megohms or higher, try measuring from the 1B3 filament winding to ground. It should show infinite resistance (open circuit). Any indication at all would indicate leakage sufficient to drag down the HV.

Sometimes the insulation on the 1B3 filament winding will break down and arc through to the flyback frame. (The filament winding is one or two turns of thick wire wrapped onto the frame). Or possibly a leakage path has developed in one of the 1B3 socket mount standoffs.

I disconnected the anode connector from the CRT and the voltage did not go up at all.

I check the filament winding to ground with the 200M setting on my multimeter. It read infinite ohms.

I'm including 2 pictures of how the 1B3GT is mounted and the filament windings.

Is there anyway to test if the filament windings are breaking down? I don't hear any arcing or buzzing or smell any ozone.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4738a_zpsqyx9hmma.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4738a_zpsqyx9hmma.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4737a_zpsnaif0bm6.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4737a_zpsnaif0bm6.jpg.html)

At this stage I would try to determine whether the 1B3 filament is lighting. In a darkened room, looking upward from the underside of the tube, the filament should be visible glowing a ruddy orange. If it isn't, one of the filament pins may not be making connection in the socket.

Another possibility - the 1B3 may be gassy. Is there a hazy blue glow filling most of the tube? Does it feel hot to the touch after running a few minutes?

In a darkened room, I looked up into the 1B3GT and saw the ruddy orange glow of the filament. Also there was a ring of blue haze just below the top metal piece that's inside.

I have a bunch or other 1B3GT tubes and I tried at least 4 to 6 others. They all had the ruddy glow and the blue hazy ring.

Because I can draw a 1/4 inch purple arc off the top of the 1B3GT tube, does that mean I have good HV? I'm thinking so or we would be looking elsewhere.

Again, thanks for all your help.

The blue haze could mean it's got a load on it, I would be suspicious of a short inside the metal cup on the bottom of the socket, my Zenith Porthole uses the same setup and it was tricky to get it back together without problems.

If the new resistors are too fat they might be arcing, also not sure if metal film resistors will work the same as carbon comp in that application.

You might try just popping the socket out of the cup and see if it works.

...Because I can draw a 1/4 inch purple arc off the top of the 1B3GT tube, does that mean I have good HV?

It means you've got at least 10-12 KV of unrectified pulse going to the 1B3, which is good. And there should be 12 KV or more of rectified DC coming out of the 1B3, which isn't happening for some reason.

After a few minutes running, is the 1B3 hot to the touch, like uncomfortably hot? If so, there's gotta be a leakage path to ground that's not showing up with the ohmmeter check.

Try removing the doorknob cap so the socket floats free and see what happens.

OK guys here is the latest checks.

I took the socket out of the metal housing which is attached to the top of the door knob cap. I then used a craft stick to hold it up away from the metal. I also had to unsolder and disconnect the lead from pin #7 that is soldered to the cup. I made a small extension so I could clip it back to the metal cup. I had no difference in my HV.

I then disconnected the wire lead from the metal cup, thus taking the door knob cap out of the circuit and when I tried it, my HV jumped up to about 6800v. There was also a small "squealing" coming from the flyback area, but no arcs were seen in a darkened room. Also I didn't see the blue haze in the 1B3GT tube either. I didn't want to run it much like this. BTW, these tests are done with the test CRT so I don't have the capacitance from the standard 14" tube.

I'm beginning to suspect the door knob cap.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4744a_zpswhuwc50q.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4744a_zpswhuwc50q.jpg.html)

It was the doorknob all along, looks like. Good sleuthing bro. The squealing may be the hor. frequency is off. HV may increase further once that's corrected and the doorknob replaced.

Yeah, I had lots of help with this one. Thanks everybody.

Now I gotta find a new 500pf 20Kv cap!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/LOT-of-TWO-NOS-Door-Knob-Doorknob-HV-Capacitors-2-each-Sprague-500pF-20kV-/112151977376

If you want, you can run the big CRT without the doorknob temporarily, since the dag already provides a few hundred pf of capacitance. There'll be a slight voltage drop across the 1 meg resistor, probably not enough to notice.

Looks like you found the problem. :thmbsp:

Can anybody explain to me why they reference the bottom of that doorknob to the plate of the damper? I know some of the older sets had it going to ground, so it was in parallel with the dag coating. So if the doorknob is leaking, there's effectively leakage between the HV and the 210V supply.

If you want, you can run the big CRT without the doorknob temporarily, since the dag already provides a few hundred pf of capacitance. There'll be a slight voltage drop across the 1 meg resistor, probably not enough to notice.

I just might do that. I'd like to work on the alignment next.

...Can anybody explain to me why they reference the bottom of that doorknob to the plate of the damper?
Seems like the only advantage is that the voltage across the doorknob is a bit lower (by the B+ value). But it shouldn't make any difference in the grand scheme of things.
I know some of the older sets had it going to ground, so it was in parallel with the dag coating.
In the old sets with metal bell CRTs, there was no dag system to filter the HV, so doorknobs served that purpose.

But when all-glass CRTs with inner & outer dag came along, doorknobs weren't strictly needed but were sorta "grandfathered" along by convention for a while. Seems like, anyhow.:nerd: In the set being worked on here, the doorknob serves mostly as mechanical mount for the 1B3.

One way to further account for that grandfathering is that many makers used the same chassis to drive a wide variety of screen sizes, and for a while there was a mix of types (by screen size) available...IIRC one of the later metal tubes to be in use was the 24".

Seems like the only advantage is that the voltage across the doorknob is a bit lower (by the B+ value). But it shouldn't make any difference in the grand scheme of things.

I was thinking the B+ also adds in series with the 1B3 rectified pulses, for a B+ boosted HV? Not sure it they were that hard up to get an extra 210v to the CRT anode, but it sure seems like the rectified flyback pulses are being stacked on top of the B+, relative to ground.

But the HV value itself isn't gonna change whether the filter cap is grounded to chassis or to B+. Remember, it's an RF ground either way (the spikes being filtered are RF).

With the cap grounded to B+, the DC across the cap will be lower by the B+ value. The HV itself willl be unchanged.

One way to further account for that grandfathering is that many makers used the same chassis to drive a wide variety of screen sizes, and for a while there was a mix of types (by screen size) available...IIRC one of the later metal tubes to be in use was the 24".

Rca built a 27" set, using the metal rectangular 27MP4 around 1954. IIRC, the rebuilt CRT was $66.00, with only a 6 month warrantee. There was also a 30BP4 available for $76.00, with the same 6 month warrantee. :thmbsp:

There was also a 30BP4 available for $76.00I could use a couple of those NOW!

.

Rca built a 27" set, using the metal rectangular 27MP4 around 1954. IIRC, the rebuilt CRT was $66.00, with only a 6 month warrantee. There was also a 30BP4 available for $76.00, with the same 6 month warrantee. :thmbsp:

That's probably why there are so few of those sets around today. :yes:

There was a 27" all glass tube in the later 50's, Magnavox made quite a few sets with them.

On the subject of doorknobs, plain filtering wasn't the only purpose they were used for. They were also used in doubler and tripler HV supplies, e.g., the projection sets of the late 40s, etc.

While I'm waiting for the door knob cap I thought I'd do a little cleaning up on the cabinet.

I washed it inside and out with some Dawn dish washing liquid and water using a small terry hand cloth.

Then I wanted to polish it up, right? Well I looked at different videos and so on and tried these products to get that high shine on this Bakelite cabinet.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4746a_zpstr2uajin.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4746a_zpstr2uajin.jpg.html)

I tried the Brasso, followed by the Gorhams followed by the wax and it didn't seem to help with the shine. I know the top layer is where you wnat to shine and I didn't go through that. Here is a picture of one side where I tried several products.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4748a_zpshipgohkn.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4748a_zpshipgohkn.jpg.html)

the largest circle was just using the wax, the next smallest was using Mothers and wax, and the smallest was using Gorhams and wax. In reality, not much difference between the three.

Here is a picture of the top. Yeah, it has a water stain. I tried Brasso, Gorhams, followed by 2 coats of wax. The finish is disappointing.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4749a_zps8wjccn4r.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4749a_zps8wjccn4r.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4750a_zpsa1vuqyae.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4750a_zpsa1vuqyae.jpg.html)

My big question is how much "elbow grease" does it take to shine this thing up? Am I not rubbing long enough? I usually go about a minute using medium light pressure with each product. Do I have to rub like 5-10 minutes on each section?

What am I missing? I do not want to use any sandpaper at all. I find it really hard to believe that I'm rubbing though the top layer.

Any ideas from those who have polished Bakelite to a high shine?

Forget brasso. It has ammonia in it and can dull the bakelite. It's the old brasso in a metal can that works well. I've used novus #2 and simichrome with good results. Also Maguire's cleaner wax with contains a mild abrasive. Brown shoe polish or stain can help bring some color back to faded bakelite

Forget brasso. It has ammonia in it and can dull the bakelite. It's the old brasso in a metal can that works well. I've used novus #2 and simichrome with good results. Also Maguire's cleaner wax with contains a mild abrasive. Brown shoe polish or stain can help bring some color back to faded bakelite

Bob,
Did I do harm to the Bakelite using the wrong kind of Brasso?

OK, I'll stick with the Maguires.

Thanks.

I doubt the ammonia will harm anything once you cleaned it off with some other polish. Bakelite resins aren't easily dissolved, but years of sun exposure can really take it's toll. Too much sun slowly oxidizes away the surface resins, which then leaves the Bakelite filler material somewhat exposed on the surface, and that leaves a grainy wood like appearance.

I doubt the ammonia will harm anything once you cleaned it off with some other polish. Bakelite resins aren't easily dissolved, but years of sun exposure can really take it's toll. Too much sun slowly oxidizes away the surface resins, which then leaves the Bakelite filler material somewhat exposed on the surface, and that leaves a grainy wood like appearance.

Here is a close up picture of what I'm up against. The nice area was behind the plastic bezel for the knobs on the front of the set. This one used the flash:
http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4757a_zpssgrf2la2.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4757a_zpssgrf2la2.jpg.html)

This one there was no flash:
http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4756a_zpsyqzzkeuj.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4756a_zpsyqzzkeuj.jpg.html)

Here is a general overview of that area:
http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4754a_zpsxurosaql.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4754a_zpsxurosaql.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4753a_zpscpfomh3z.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4753a_zpscpfomh3z.jpg.html)

Another close up:
http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4752a_zpscohr4uum.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4752a_zpscohr4uum.jpg.html)

I'm going to try a little Meguires on the bezel area. I'm guessing it'll shine up nice.

Yeah, that does look rather sun faded, but it's not to the point that the fillers are exposed. I suppose if a guy wanted a super glossy surface, one could wet sand the entire cabinet and have it clear coated with an automotive urethane. Maybe even lacquer would work, at least with lacquer you could dissolve that off if you didn't like the looks. Ive never tried it, but I'm guessing some toner lacquer would even darken the finish.

Remember that the glossy layer in Bakelite is thin. If you get too aggressive with abrasives, it's possible to polish all the way through it, and then you are down into the pulpy under-layer which no magic potion or process will polish to a shine.

Some Bakelite cabinets will polish up nicely, and others are just too weathered (or whatever-ed). This comes up all the time in the radio collecting world. You can spray on clear coat to make a weathered cabinet shiny. Some people also use wax, but I consider that a temporary solution.

Phil Nelson
Phil's Old Radios
http://antiqueradio.org/index.html

Thanks guys on the comments on the Bakelite. To get a real good shine on this one, it looks like I'll have to spray some clear lacquer on it and go from there. I did this on a Zenith table radio and it turned out real nice.

I replaced the door knob cap tonight. Success! I now have about 10Kv at the 2nd anode with 1 HV tester and about 13Kv with the other.

I've hooked up my pattern generator to it and I am starting to straighten out the picture.

I adjusted the ION trap for max brightness and centered the focus coil. I do have a question on the adjustment lever for the focus coil labeled Centering. I'm guessing I move the lever around to "center" the picture on the CRT. My question is there are 2 screws on each side of the Focus Coil that allows it to move up and down and from side to side. Do I loosen them to move the centering lever around and once the picture is centered I tighten those screws along with the 1 screw on the Centering lever? This is the first time I've done an Admiral and this lever is new to me.

Next problem. It seems that the H width and H lineraty adjustments do very little. There is some adjustment but the picture is past full screen. I've read the Sams on adjusting the Horizontal sweep circuit adjustments but very little happens. Is this normal? Any clue as to where to look? Remember I just replaced all the caps and resistors. I ohmed out the coils too.

Thanks.

BTW, my 210 volt line going into the fuse is now measuring 238 volts.

Width and linearity controls have a very subtle effect. The drive control will have a much bigger effect

It's playing a DVD now and it looks pretty good. I know it can be better. I'll let it play for an hour or so to "burn it in" some.

Width and linearity controls have a very subtle effect. The drive control will have a much bigger effect

OK. Thanks. I'll let it finish playing then I might mess with it. I did notice that as I varied the 117vac input, the picture size changed too.

Today I'm going to work on the alignment. I have both Riders and Sams to go by. I'll report back on how it goes. This is pretty new to me.

OK. Thanks. I'll let it finish playing then I might mess with it. I did notice that as I varied the 117vac input, the picture size changed too.

Yes, that's normal. These old sets have no voltage regulation in the power supplies so things like picture size and focus will vary with the line voltage.

Thanks Bob.

Well I tried aligning the TV this afternoon and evening. Didn't go so good. Using my Eico 221 VTVM and RCA 167A signal generator, I adjusted the Video IF stages by adjusting A1 thru A4 for maximum value on the VTVM. I then adjusted A5,A6, and A7 for the sound alignment.

I then hooked up my Eico 369 and my BK 2010 O'scope. The waveform looked like this:

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4758a_zpsrd5droku.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4758a_zpsrd5droku.jpg.html)

I then adjusted A1 thru A4 again to get his waveform:

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4760a_zpsd3krulul.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4760a_zpsd3krulul.jpg.html)

Then I tried playing my DVD. The picture was awful and the sound was very fuzzy even after turning the "Fine Tuning" knob all the way to one end.

I went back and started all over again and made the adjustments and go the same results.

The waveform is centered on 25.MC where it should be on 24.3MC. I am getting about 8 or 9 MC bandwith on my sweep. The frequency for the waveform seems to be off all around. I used my digital freq. counter to set the frequency generator.

I did notice that the peaks and central valley seem awful narrow compared to the picture in Sams.

Any Ideas?

You only align radios (and other sound IFs) for max output from slugs. TVs you align the video IF for frequency response, output level be damned. There should be an alignment procedure in the philco manual if you can't undo your work consult the philco procedure. You will need both sweep and marker generators working to see the response curve and know what frequencies important features correspond to.

This is why I always advise not touch video IFs unless you really are prepared to do so. I've not done a video IF alignment yet, but have been grabbing equipment to try it. When I do I plan to do it on a set I don't care about for this exact reason.

You only align radios (and other sound IFs) for max output from slugs. TVs you align the video IF for frequency response, output level be damned. There should be an alignment procedure in the philco manual if you can't undo your work consult the philco procedure. You will need both sweep and marker generators working to see the response curve and know what frequencies important features correspond to.

This is why I always advise not touch video IFs unless you really are prepared to do so. I've not done a video IF alignment yet, but have been grabbing equipment to try it. When I do I plan to do it on a set I don't care about for this exact reason.

Tom,
I was following the procedures from Sams and Riders on this Admiral TV.

The Eico 369 is a sweep/post marker generator.

I'm doing this so I can learn something about TV alignment. I knew it wouldn't be easy.

I'm posting the procedures below so we can see what I'm trying to do. Of course I'm only doing the Video IF and Sound sections for right now.

I do appreciate everybody's comments and willingness to help.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/117-2%20pg6a_zpsvycdu4at.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/117-2%20pg6a_zpsvycdu4at.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/117-2%20pg6aa_zpseb4jntta.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/117-2%20pg6aa_zpseb4jntta.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/117-2%20pg7a_zpsrc5pahwd.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/117-2%20pg7a_zpsrc5pahwd.jpg.html)

Remember that in a TV set, the IF stages are stagger-tuned rather than tuned 'on-peak' (as in a radio). Stagger tuning is for a wide bandpass which is necessary to render fine detail in the pic.

Also the signal level from the genny should be attenuated as much as possible while maintaining a stable trace.

This IF design uses over coupled IF transformers rather than stagger tuned. One stage is peaked to 25.3 and the other to 23.1. That's an economical design that flattens out the response somewhat but not as good as a real stagger tuned with multiple stages each peaked to a different frequency.

Did you follow all the setup directions including replacing the converted tube (6J6) with one that has pin 1 clipped off ? As mentioned above, it's important to use as low a signal level as possible

Remember that in a TV set, the IF stages are stagger-tuned rather than tuned 'on-peak' (as in a radio). Stagger tuning is for a wide bandpass which is necessary to render fine detail in the pic.

Also the signal level from the genny should be attenuated as much as possible for a stable trace.

I remembered that the Eico 369 manual talked about stagger tuned IF and sure enough the manual talks about adjusting each IF for its own frequency. I looked on Sams schematics and sure enough, there is a frequency marked by each IF coil! However there are only 2 freq. used. Yup, the 25.3 and the 23.1. Which corresponds to the Sams alignment chart.

Hmm....still puzzled on how to actually align the video IF section.

This IF design uses over coupled IF transformers rather than stagger tuned. One stage is peaked to 25.3 and the other to 23.1. That's an economical design that flattens out the response somewhat but not as good as a real stagger tuned with multiple stages each peaked to a different frequency.

Did you follow all the setup directions including replacing the converted tube (6J6) with one that has pin 1 clipped off ? As mentioned above, it's important to use as low a signal level as possible

Bob,
I just saw this when I posted just above.

Yes, I followed the procedure and uses a known good 6J6 with pin #1 clipped off.

I'll redo the procedure and pay very close attention to having the signal generator turned down as low as possible.

One quick question. In the Sams it says that the dummy antenna terminals should be "Direct" connected. What is a dummy antenna? I'm thinking it really doesn't matter because there are no signals being transmitted anyway. I could be wrong though.

Dummy antenna is your hook up to the RF signal generator. Often you put a cap in series with the positive lead and ground the other. I'm thinking that by direct they mean you don't use a cap. It would be helpful to see the whole Sams section in question. You should be injecting your signal to an ungrounded shield over the converter tube.

You should be injecting your signal to an ungrounded shield over the converter tube.
You can also do it with a turn or two of wire taped around the conv. tube. I always liked to disable the oscillator by bumping the tuner up between detents.

Dummy antenna is your hook up to the RF signal generator. Often you put a cap in series with the positive lead and ground the other. I'm thinking that by direct they mean you don't use a cap. It would be helpful to see the whole Sams section in question. You should be injecting your signal to an ungrounded shield over the converter tube.

Bob,
I did show the whole SAMS alignment section a few posts above.

Yes, I'm injecting the signal through an ungrounded shield over the converter tube and through a .01uf cap.

Something else I might mention. I have my meter set on the -DC volts and I am adjusting for maximum needle going up the scale. Is this correct?

Bob,
I did show the whole SAMS alignment section a few posts above.

Yes, I'm injecting the signal through an ungrounded shield over the converter tube and through a .01uf cap.

Oh sorry, I didn't realize that was the Sams. Direct coupling for the dummy antenna means don't use a capacitor.

Something else I might mention. I have my meter set on the -DC volts and I am adjusting for maximum needle going up the scale. Is this correct?

Yes, if the meter is showing a peaking response. By that I mean there is definitely a peak as you adjust the slug. I've worked on many sets where the maximum was a negative voltage. Annoying that they never mention that in the alignment instructions.

Oh sorry, I didn't realize that was the Sams. Direct coupling for the dummy antenna means don't use a capacitor.



Yes, if the meter is showing a peaking response. By that I mean there is definitely a peak as you adjust the slug. I've worked on many sets where the maximum was a negative voltage. Annoying that they never mention that in the alignment instructions.

Bob,

Yes, it seems on the -DC volts is where I get a definite peak. +DC volts setting there wasn't any real peak. IIRC, the needle would go go up but never down.

I've adjusted the Video IF using my VTVM and a signal generator turned almost all the way down. Next I'll hook up the Eico 369 and O'scope to see the response curve.

Here is what I have. The waveform looks pretty much like the ones I have already gotten.

Total width is 28.6 to 21
Central trough is at 25.6
Left "peak" is at 26.5
Right "peak" is at 24.5

Vertical graduations is at .2 volts
Horizontal graduations is at 5 volts

I've included a picture of the controls on the Eico 369.

It seems that the frequency isn't where it supposed to be as in the trough should be 24.3.

Also midway on the "high" slope is 27.25 instead of 25.75.

It kinda looks like the waveform is about 1.5 high?

BTW, I'm using the marker to determine the freq of the waveform which is connected to my freq. counter.

Any ideas? I'm not going to do anything till I hear back as to what is going on.

As always, your help it is appreciated.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4764a_zpsgmr6eqnh.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4764a_zpsgmr6eqnh.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4767a_zpsjvmmh6rd.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4767a_zpsjvmmh6rd.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4766a_zpsypr0potn.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4766a_zpsypr0potn.jpg.html)

I suspect you RCA RF generator is off. Using a modern frequency counter with an old RF generator can give weird results. How about doing the alignment visually ?

I find that adjusting the scope / sweep gen settings so that each division is 1MHz to be very helpful.

I suspect you RCA RF generator is off. Using a modern frequency counter with an old RF generator can give weird results. How about doing the alignment visually ?

I find that adjusting the scope / sweep gen settings so that each division is 1MHz to be very helpful.

Good point. But I failed to mention that I'm using a totally rebuilt Eico 322 generator and the freq. counter is attached to another BNC which I've added. Sorry for the confusion.

I'll tweak the coils to see if I can align it visually.

How do you set the scope up so each division is 1mhz?

Thanks.

have you looked at the output of the Eico 322 on your scope ? Is it a pure sign wave or is it "lumpy"? Make sure modulation is turned off too.

Adjust the display width on your scope or sweep width while observing markers 1 Mhz apart.

Adjust the display width on your scope or sweep width while observing markers 1 Mhz apart

Of course! Duh!

OK, I did a visual alignment. In reality, it didn't take much to get the waveform shown.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4769a_zpsaucslb6i.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4769a_zpsaucslb6i.jpg.html)

The PIP is at 24.3 which is where the trough should be. I looked around and tweaked some more but I couldn't shift the trough to freq. of 24.3. BTW, each H division is 1MHz.

I would think it is important to have that trough at 24.3, right? I'm just guessing that the 24.3 is midway between 25.3 and 23.1, hence the trough. Any ideas as to how to shift that trough? Or do I need to?

When I say shift the trough, I really mean the whole waveform.

Yes, it's important. It can be very frustrating when doing it visually when things are way off because you have four slugs to adjust.

Have you calibrated the 369 marker generator ? I think it's possible to use the 369 as a fixed frequency RF generator. Maybe use it for the alignment instead of the Eico 322.

Yes, it's important. It can be very frustrating when doing it visually when things are way off because you have four slugs to adjust.

Have you calibrated the 369 marker generator ? I think it's possible to use the 369 as a fixed frequency RF generator. Maybe use it for the alignment instead of the Eico 322.

Yes, I calibrated the 369. I know my freq. counter is cal'd also.

I think I can use it for alignment. But I'm not sure of where to get the signal out from the generator. Also I'm wondering how to attenuate the signal so I can use the least possible.

I'll look into it.

I tried using the 369 but it won't work. I still have the waveform as above. The frequency of the waveform is still off by the same amount. I'm at a loss.

What determines the frequency of the waveform? If I knew, then maybe I could change it by changing a component or something like that. I know if I had a better grasp of the theory behind the IF circuits I might be able to figure this out.

IIRC, Dennis Carter goes into theory on the IF sections of a very similar Admiral chassis. I'm going to watch those few videos and see if that will help.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m1xVe1_e5bY Starts at 4:16

It's a bandpass filter and the adjustable coils determine the frequencies that get through. You don't need to change any components. You need to adjust the slugs so they let the right frequencies through. What exactly happens to the response curve as you adjust A1 through A4 ? The response curve should distort and shift around. You're going to need to adjust all four to gradually shift it over and get it looking like it should.

It's a bandpass filter and the adjustable coils determine the frequencies that get through. You don't need to change any components. You need to adjust the slugs so they let the right frequencies through. What exactly happens to the response curve as you adjust A1 through A4 ? The response curve should distort and shift around. You're going to need to adjust all four to gradually shift it over and get it looking like it should.

What happens when I A1 - A4 is that mostly the peaks rise and fall and one gets smaller while the other gets bigger.

I'll tweak them to see if I can get the right shape at the right freq.

Thanks for hanging with me on this.

Right that's what should happen when you adjust one coil. Adjust A1 so that one side is bigger and the other smaller. Then move on to A2 and adjust it so that they level off. The response should be shifted over now.

Bob and everybody,

I did it! My curve doesn't quite look like the one in Sams, but close. What I did was look at the curve from my AMC 116T that I just did and it didn't have a large flat in the curve. I never touched the IF's on that TV. Sorta for a reference.

I then hooked up the Admiral and using the generator and VTVM, I again peaked the 4 coils.

Then on to the 369 and O'scope. From here I did just what Bob said to do. Adjust each coil and finally got this curve. I also spent some time doing some little tweaking till I got the pips where they were supposed to be. Also the curve bandwidth and shape. Bob was right, I had to go back and forth among all 4 coils and at times it was a bit frustrating. But I knew I would get it at one time the 24.3 pip was now lower when before it was higher. This gave me the indication that what Bob said about moving the peaks to get the pips where they needed to be. I suppose I could have tweaked a little more here or there, though I'm not too sure. I concentrated on getting the pips on the curve in the right position and frequencies.

Here are my results. The pips start at the left of the curve and work their way to the right and to a lower frequency. I flipped over my curve printout (from Riders) and traced the curve and markings just to keep from going nuts.

I did hook up my DVD player and sure enough I have good video! I tweaked the audio a bit and the rest will wait till tomorrow.

A big thanks to Bob and the others who helped me through this. I learned a lot and next time it will be a lot easier!

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4777a_zpsc5gpaaz8.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4777a_zpsc5gpaaz8.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4773a_zpsmqf4be1z.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4773a_zpsmqf4be1z.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4772a_zpssi3kt46f.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4772a_zpssi3kt46f.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4774a_zpsyt1v4xix.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4774a_zpsyt1v4xix.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4775a_zpsi662agkt.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4775a_zpsi662agkt.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4776a_zpsrx1ep0zi.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4776a_zpsrx1ep0zi.jpg.html)

Congratulations! I'm glad you got the hang of it :)

Thanks Bob. At times it looked impossible. Thanks for keeping me going.

That's looking very good. If you wanted too I'm sure you could tweak your two humps a little further apart and regain that slight dip and flatten the pass band. Here's the video IF of an Admiral 20Z1 chassis(very similar to your sets IF) that I aligned using an HP digital sweeper complete with 5 digital markers simultaneously intensity modulated utilizing the Z axis input on the scope. Crazy overkill but very fun to play with.

http://i452.photobucket.com/albums/qq245/Kuehn/HP%208662A%20Repairs/HP208662A20Sweep20011_zpsbzf555dm.jpg?t=1476991455

That's looking very good. If you wanted too I'm sure you could tweak your two humps a little further apart and regain that slight dip and flatten the pass band. Here's the video IF of an Admiral 20Z1 chassis(very similar to your sets IF) that I aligned using an HP digital sweeper complete with 5 digital markers simultaneously intensity modulated utilizing the Z axis input on the scope. Crazy overkill but very fun to play with.

http://i452.photobucket.com/albums/qq245/Kuehn/HP%208662A%20Repairs/HP208662A20Sweep20011_zpsbzf555dm.jpg?t=1476991455

Looks like when I reply the link shows up. I'll look at it now.

EDIT: the link doesn't show up.

EDIT EDIT: I removed the img in brackets and now the link shows up.

EDIT EDIT EDIT:The link doesn't work.

http://i452.photobucket.com/albums/qq245/Kuehn/HP%208662A%20Repairs/HP208662A20Sweep20011_zpsbzf555dm.jpg?t=1476991455

Kevin,
I was thinking of tweaking it a little more to see if I can get a flat and 2 humps. It'll depend on the mood I'm in.

Bottom line is if it looks and sounds good don't mess with it, unless of course you enjoy banging your head against the wall, which I tend to favor most days. :D

Not sure what's up with the link, it should show a picture as part of the post. It's working for me here.

Yup, the picture shows up now.

I thought there would be a link to the video showing you doing the alignment.

That is a nice curve! Hoe did you get the 5 pips?

The HP 8662A actually has 5 programmable markers. Every time it gets to a marker frequency it sends out a signal that modulates the Z axis(brightness) of the scope trace. So what you are seeing is it steping through the sweep, and the marker frequencies are simply brighter points on the sweep, not really a pip.

[edit] Here's a close up of that same scope screen shot so you can see how it's actually a series of dots.

http://i452.photobucket.com/albums/qq245/Kuehn/HP%208662A%20Repairs/HP208662A20sweep20close20up_zpssdytevkb.jpg?t=1477 000283

Now that's cool. A lot better than my $10 Eico 369, that's for sure!

The last 2 days were spent working on the cabinet. As you know, it was pretty faded and there was some water stains from a flower pot on the top and sides.

I decided to clear coat the cabinet.

What I did was first used some Prep-Sol to remove any wax, dirt, etc from the cabinet. I then used some 600 grit wet sand paper to sand down the entire cabinet. I then concentrated on some scratches on the top and also the water stain being very careful not to sand through the top layer. I sanded enough of the light scratches out along with most of the water stain. I then went over the cabinet with 800 grit wet. The water stain was still visible. I didn't want to refinish the cabinet and have a water stain on the top.

So when it came time to shoot the clear, I wiped down the cabinet with some rubbing alcohol and used a craft stick that was pointed off with my hobby knife to get into the corners and along the ridges. Once that was done I took a can of Mohawk Perfect Brown Toner and lightly went over the water stain. After a few very light coats, I put one light coat over the entire top, just to blend in the water stain area. After it dried in like 5 minutes, I could barely see the water stain but I could also see the markings of the Bakelite. Good enough.

Time for the clear coats. I used Mohawk Instrument Clear Gloss. I use a cheapie Harbour Freight HVLP Touch Up gun. I reduce the clear using Mohawk reducer by at least 50/50. I spray at 20 lbs and a swath of about 3 inches. I like the touch up gun because I can get close to the work and I feel I can control the paint better.

After tack ragging the cabinet, I shoot a coat of clear lacquer. I wait 5 minutes to see how it flowed out and then shoot another coat with the adjusted thinned lacquer. Usually I add more reducer. Then another coat is shot and so on without messing with the reducer/thinner ratio. Yesterday I shot about 8 coats. Now remember that when I shoot a coat, it is pretty thinned out. I really hate orange peel. When shooting, the lacquer looks like it will orange peel, but within a few minutes, it flows out nicely.

Last night I lightly sanded the lacquer with some 800 grit wet to "level" the lacquer and have a very smooth surface for the final coats.

Today I again wiped down the cabinet with rubbing alcohol, tacked and was ready for the final coats. These final coats are thinned even more and were thinned probably to about 30% lacquer and 70% thinner. The cabinet was shot like before till I ran out of the thinned lacquer with an extra coat on the top. BTW, painting conditions were about 70 degrees and below 50% humidity. The lacquer flowed out great.

I'll wait for at least 2 weeks and probably 3 till it gets wet sanded, rubbed out and waxed.

In the meantime I'll do some work on the knobs and the escutcheon, and the chassis. Getting close to finishing this project.

Here are a couple of pics of the cabinet. I hope they show up real well, but you'll get the "picture".

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4795a_zpss6jguont.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4795a_zpss6jguont.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4796a_zpsdkdjvtet.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4796a_zpsdkdjvtet.jpg.html)

The video saga continues. I messed around with the response curve some last night and today. I got the double hump and the pips were at the correct frequencies per Sams and Riders. I then hooked up my D to A converter and I got audio, but no video. I tried my DVD player with my RF converter but got the same thing.

So I went back to my pictures that I took when I got the TV and placed the slugs about what they were in the picture. I hooked up my 360 and O'scope and I had just a single peak curve. Hmm......

I then hooked up my D to A converter and now I was getting video and audio! I then tweaked the slugs to get the best picture and the audio slugs to bet the best sound by ear.

I then went back to the 369 setup and tweaked the curve to the one in the picture below. The pip at the peak is at 20.3 and not at 24.3 but it is playing nicely.

I then hooked up my DVD player RF converter and sure enough I have a pretty decent picture.

Back to the DtoA converter and I took the picture below. I realize I need to adjust the focus coil, linearities, etc.

I checked my frequency counter by inserting the 10.7Mc crystal into the 369 marker slot and turned off the variable marker. The frequency counter read 10.690067 or something very close to that. So I'm pretty sure that the 369/frequency counter are good.

Any explanations as to why it works on 20.2 instead of 24.3?

Could there be anything that the tuner would cause this? I did replace the resistors and some caps in there. I did pay attention to lead dress, though they couldn't go any other way.


http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4799_zps3sndrpvp.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4799_zps3sndrpvp.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4798a_zpsipzjql2s.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4798a_zpsipzjql2s.jpg.html)

That seems really strange. I think someone mentioned earlier that most service grade sweep generators won't produce a pure sine wave, and also there's no way to get an accurate frequency reading if there's any frequency modulation(sweep) turned on. So it's very possible your counter is picking up on a false harmonic. Another thought is it's possible that your local oscillator is producing something other than the correct IF frequency. But if the IF slugs are back to their original positions that's not very likely, not unless someone else had that thing incorrectly aligned long before you got your hands on it. But at any rate the fact that you're getting the best video and sound with a single peaked frequency response is very strange.

That seems really strange. I think someone mentioned earlier that most service grade sweep generators won't produce a pure sine wave, and also there's no way to get an accurate frequency reading if there's any frequency modulation(sweep) turned on. So it's very possible your counter is picking up on a false harmonic. Another thought is it's possible that your local oscillator is producing something other than the correct IF frequency. But if the IF slugs are back to their original positions that's not very likely, not unless someone else had that thing incorrectly aligned long before you got your hands on it. But at any rate the fact that you're getting the best video and sound with a single peaked frequency response is very strange.

Kevin,

The frequency I'm measuring is the maker frequency, not the sweep frequency. My Freq. Counter is "tapped" off the Marker Osc. tube. It is rock steady when varying the sweep frequency. It should be because they use different oscillators.

Is there a way to measure the local osc freq? It does look like it is half of the 6J6 tube. If so what would I expect from channel 3. That's what my D to A converter and my RF modulator are set to.

There's a lot of variables involved in simply connecting your counter into that circuit. Same reasons you don't hook your scope prob into a high frequency oscillator circuit without expecting it to de-tune the circuit.

Does your 369's marker dial track your counter's reading at various locations on the dial?

There's a lot of variables involved in simply connecting your counter into that circuit. Same reasons you don't hook your scope prob into a high frequency oscillator circuit without expecting it to de-tune the circuit.

Does your 360's marker dial track your counter's reading at various locations on the dial?

OK.

Yes, the marker dial does track the counters readings across the dial on all bands.

When you had the IF aligned to 24.3MC, did you try adjusting the oscillator slug for channel 3 (Sams reference A19) while you had your DVD player playing through the rf modulator? Also A8 is the master oscillator adjustment that will offset all channels equally. If you look at the schematic you will see A8 is a trimmer cap in parallel with the fine tuning control. A9-A20 are the individual slugs for each channels oscillator coil. Those adjustments combined are what sets the correct oscillator frequency that in turn is mixed with the input rf, and is sent into the video IF. Another possibility is that if someone had the tuner coils out they may have gotten them mixed up and not installed back in the correct order, in which case channel 3 may not really be creating the correct oscillator freq for channel 3.

When you had the IF aligned to 24.3MC, did you try adjusting the oscillator slug for channel 3 (A19) while you had your DVD player playing through the rf modulator?

No. Maybe I should try that?

I think so. Also see what I just added to my last post. If the tuner is goofed up there's no way it can send out the correct IF frequency for the channel you think you're receiving.

Does this turret tuner look right to you? I would think the inserts would go numerically in order.


http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4802a_zpsx2k2ktx6.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4802a_zpsx2k2ktx6.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4803a_zpska2hexff.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4803a_zpska2hexff.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4804a_zpsipuhhh48.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4804a_zpsipuhhh48.jpg.html)

I looked at some other pictures of turret tuners and their inserts are all numerically in order.

Looks like I have to redo the order?

A few are definitely out of order. Are 2,3, and 4 in correct consecutive order? Is one section missing? At any rate they should be in the same order as the channel knob on the front. And since someone was in there messing with them it's even possible they're not all working correct.

A few are definitely out of order. Are 2,3, and 4 in correct consecutive order? Is one section missing? At any rate they should be in the same order as the channel knob on the front. And since someone was in there messing with them it's even possible they're not all working correct.

Right.

I got them in order. Channel 10 is missing the forward insert. Also there are a few that are not numbered but they went with the ones in that channel number. After reassembling the tuner, I have a decent picture on channel 3 and my bar generator works on channel 6 as it is supposed to. Tomorrow I'll work at getting the double hump curve with the proper freq where they belong. I'm not sure the tuner inserts are the problem because Sams says I can use any channel.

We'll see what happens.

So were the channel 3 coil modules already in the correct location? I'm not even sure if that A8 adjustment can cause the tuner IF to be out by 4MC. Something sure seems to be throwing your tuner IF output off.

So were the channel 3 coil modules already in the correct location? I'm not even sure if that A8 adjustment can cause the tuner IF to be out by 4MC. Something sure seems to be throwing your tuner IF output off.

I'm not really sure if they were in the correct position on the turret. I lost the metal insert that goes into the plastic channel dial so I can't use the correct dial. I'm using another dial just to be able to turn the channel selector. I looked into the tuner and when the channel 3 inserts were making contact with the wipers, then I used some masking tape to mark the dial. I know it's a bit hokie, but my friend has a metal piece I just haven't gotten to go over his house.

So were the channel 3 coil modules already in the correct location? I'm not even sure if that A8 adjustment can cause the tuner IF to be out by 4MC. Something sure seems to be throwing your tuner IF output off.
Referring back to the screen shot in post# 197, if he's getting pic and sound correctly with the fine tuning around mid-range, then the osc. frequency is correct. The osc freq varies with the fine tuning, and has no bearing on the IF response curve. In fact the osc should not even be running during the alignment procedure.

(I don't have the schematic.) The tuner may or may not have a mixer plate coil adjustment. If there is, it may have some effect on the IF response curve.

Crist, was there a particular reason you opted to do an IF alignment?

Referring back to the screen shot in post# 197, if he's getting pic and sound correctly with the fine tuning around mid-range, then the osc. frequency is correct. The osc freq varies with the fine tuning, and has no bearing on the IF response curve. In fact the osc should not even be running during the alignment procedure.

(I don't have the schematic.) The tuner may or may not have a mixer plate coil adjustment. If there is, it may have some effect on the IF response curve.

Crist, was there a particular reason you opted to do an IF alignment?

Yes, I wanted to learn how it was done. After replacing all the caps and resistors I thought it could use it.

Well first off, your set uses the old 24 mc IF (vs. the later standardized 45 mc IF). Superhet theory dictates that your set's local oscillator (LO) has to run at 24 mc above the received signal's frequency. Channel 3 video carrier is 61.25 mc. So, 61.25 + 24 = 85.25 mc for the LO. The two signals are mixed, yielding the 'beat' or Intermediate Frequency of 24 mc.

Since the video information on the carrier occupies a wide band width, the IF response must also be broad band, occupying a wide swatch on either side of 24 mc. That's why the IF strip is stagger tuned with an extra stage or two of amplification.

In contrast, a radio's IFs are tuned 'on peak' since audio bandwidth is all that's needed. Since the IFs are not staggered, less amplification is needed.

In a typical AM radio, the LO tracks 455 kc above the received signal, yielding the 455 kc IF. Most all FM radios use 10.7 mc for the IF, meaning the LO tracks 10.7 mc above the received signal.

Most all consumer gear uses 'high side' LO injection, meaning the LO runs above the received frequency. Some specialized communications gear may occasionally use low side injection.

Here's a listing of TV channel frequencies.. http://wiki.radioreference.com/index.php/Television_Frequencies

Referring back to the screen shot in post# 197, if he's getting pic and sound correctly with the fine tuning around mid-range, then the osc. frequency is correct. The osc freq varies with the fine tuning, and has no bearing on the IF response curve. In fact the osc should not even be running during the alignment procedure.


Agree with all that. I was simply suggesting that the beat frequency that the tuner is generating may not be what the IF is looking for(something other than 24MC). If I'm not mistaken Crist thought he had his IF aligned to a center frequency of 20.3MC, which he's based on what his marker generator is telling him. When he aligned it to where it's suppose to be he's not getting video. He also mentioned that he has changed caps and resistors in the tuner circuit.

Agree with all that. I was simply suggesting that the beat frequency that the tuner is generating may not be what the IF is looking for(something other than 24MC). If I'm not mistaken Crist thought he had his IF aligned to a center frequency of 20.3MC, which he's based on what his marker generator is telling him. When he aligned it to where it's suppose to be he's not getting video. He also mentioned that he has changed caps and resistors in the tuner circuit.
OK I see what you're saying now. I shoulda re-read those prior posts closer.

Be good if he could post the tuner schematic showing the parts that were replaced.

I can post a scan of the tuner from Sams later tonight, gotta run now. It's really close if not the same as the 20Z1 chassis tuner which is available on the ETF.

Here is the schematic.

I replaced all of the resistors except R9. It was too buried to get to. I also replaced C15A and C15B. Then the only other cap that was replaced was C17, a mica cap. C17 was replaced with a 120pf 500v mica cap. C15A/B was replaced with 2 of these:

https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/tdk-corporation/FG26C0G2J102JNT06/445-173405-1-ND/5812010

Just so you know, I used the same type of caps to replace those in the IF section but only with 1500pf for 1500pf and 3900pf for 4000pf caps.

C17 couples the tuner to the IF section.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4821b_zps1zuol9xk.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4821b_zps1zuol9xk.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4673a_zps8jjxyjjc.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4673a_zps8jjxyjjc.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4675a_zpsbkctu2qn.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4675a_zpsbkctu2qn.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4676a_zpsddgrz6rt.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4676a_zpsddgrz6rt.jpg.html)

Great. The two critical frequency-determining caps, C12 and C13, have been left alone. But I would double-check resistors R18 (10K) and R19 (4.7K) for correct value since they could affect LO frequency. (It's not necessary to disconnect those for checking.)

I checked those resistors and here are the pictures of each one installed. The first picture shows R18 a 10K and the second shows R19 a 4.7K.

I keep notes on each resistor removed and installed.

10K R18 was 9.81K and was replaced with a 9.8K
4.7K R19 was 4.92K and was replaced with a 4.64K

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4826a_zpstjvq55xv.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4826a_zpstjvq55xv.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4828a_zps4bg0fzhi.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4828a_zps4bg0fzhi.jpg.html)

Can you verify that by adjusting the Ch 3 oscillator slug, that it will in fact alter your sound and picture tuning? There should be a definite point where both at their best. It's the same effect as adjusting the fine tuning control, only this should have a coarser range.

Can you verify that by adjusting the Ch 3 oscillator slug, that it will in fact alter your sound and picture tuning? There should be a definite point where both at their best. It's the same effect as adjusting the fine tuning control, only this should have a coarser range.

Yes, it does exactly like you said.

I went over to channel 6 and my pattern generator and the video was unsettled. I tweaked the channel slug and got a great pattern. I only tweaked it just about a 1/4 turn or less.

Beings they're that close it's hard to imagine the IF is off as far as your marker generator is indicating. I suppose you could slowly tune your IF back in the direction of 24MC, intermittently checking if you can still get good sound and video by readjusting the Ch 3 oscillator coil. I don't know what else to suggest. Maybe Old Coot will have a suggestion.

OK. We'll see what he has to say.

I was gonna suggest essentially the same thing.. incrementally 'walking' the IF adjustments back, while looking for the best rendering of fine detail in the pic, with no ringing or smearing of fine detail. Probably have to re-tweak the Ch 3 osc slug along the way, to keep the fine tuning range centered.

There was a guy on here two or three years ago, a total newbie with a late 40s Dumont (I forget his name. Phil Nelson probably remembers). The guy did an IF alignment totally by eyeball, no instruments, no nothing. But damn if he didn't end up with a perfect pic, just as good as with a full instrument alignment. That might be the way to go with this one.

If you want to go the eyeball route and have a frequency counter that'll read 85.25 mc, set the Ch 3 osc slug to that frequency. (A turn or two of wire taped around the osc/mixer tube oughta provide a decent pick up.) With the fine tuning at mid range, the osc wants to be at 85.25 mc for a 24 mc IF. That way, you have a 'target' to walk the IF adjustments toward.

(Ch 3 carrier is 61.25 mc.)

I was gonna suggest essentially the same thing.. incrementally 'walking' the IF adjustments back, while looking for the best rendering of fine detail in the pic, with no ringing or smearing of fine detail. Probably have to re-tweak the Ch 3 osc slug along the way, to keep the fine tuning range centered.

There was a guy on here two or three years ago, a total newbie with a late 40s Dumont (I forget his name. Phil Nelson probably remembers). The guy did an IF alignment totally by eyeball, no instruments, no nothing. But damn if he didn't end up with a perfect pic, just as good as with a full instrument alignment. That might be the way to go with this one.

OK, I'll try walking back the IF and tweaking the CH 3 slug.

I've got a pretty good picture now, I know what you mean by doing it visually. We'll see what happens.

Thanks for the suggestions guys.

If you want to go the eyeball route and have a frequency counter that'll read 85.25 mc, set the Ch 3 osc slug to that frequency. (A turn or two of wire taped around the osc/mixer tube oughta provide a decent pick up.) With the fine tuning at mid range, the osc wants to be at 85.25 mc for a 24 mc IF. That way, you have a 'target' to walk the IF adjustments toward.

(Ch 3 carrier is 61.25 mc.)

I was hoping you'd explain to us how to do that. :)

Also a B&K 1076 or 1077 Television Analyst would be really handy right now too. With that he could inject the Analysts IF output directly into the sets IF and manually sweep through 24MC, so he could see exactly where the TV's IF response appears to be optimized for best sound and picture. A very handy and educational tool for anyone planning to stay in the TV restoration hobby.

Deleted. My bad. It's the B&K 415 that's the 'gold standard' for learning IF alignments. With a decent scope, it makes doing IF alignment actually fun. https://www.google.com/search?q=b%26K+sweep+generator+images&ie=UTF-8&sa=Search&channel=fe&client=browser-ubuntu&hl=en#channel=fe&hl=en&q=b%26K+415+sweep+generator+images

The 1077 Analyst is a stablemate to the 415 and does everything under the sun except IF sweep alignment. Phil Nelson refurbished one not too long ago. http://antiqueradio.org/BK1077BTelevisionAnalyst.htm

The BK 415 is for the higher freq. IF TV's. It won't work for mine. Later today I'll get back to this chassis.

The BK 415 is for the higher freq. IF TV's. It won't work for mine.

Unfortunately true. And as far as I'm aware there was never a rival service grade unit made for the old 24MC band.

Unfortunately true. And as far as I'm aware there was never a rival service grade unit made for the old 24MC band.

IIRC the markers on the 415 were crystal based (I need to dust mine off and make it work) so with the right crystals and mods to the sweep section the 415 might be convertible to the older IFs...Could be an interesting project trying to make a 415 mod to switch back and fourth both IF freqs...Though it might be reinventing the wheel.

I recently picked up an example of that EICO generator you were using ($5 at Goodwill)....That makes ~6 pieces of 'as found' IF alignment gear I have sitting waiting for the day I decide to try and teach myself IF alignment...I really need to block off some time for that some summer or winter...

The BK 415 is for the higher freq. IF TV's. It won't work for mine.
By golly you're right. I had to look up the specs just to be sure. Amazing that it doesn't cover the old band.

Though it might be reinventing the wheel.


I looked into that and came to the same conclusion. The correct crystals are very difficult to find, and the project would get very involved before it was all said and done. A better use of time might be to design from the ground up a digital programmable 5 frequency marker generator that could be used as an add on with any of the service grade post marker sweep generators.

Taking a mini-break from this for a few days. Another quickie project has popped up.

Not the first time I heard of "eyeballing" the IF strip. When I was a kid helping at a TV shop, there was a tech that did my Motorola TS905 and a RCA CTC16. Both sets turned out great! Amazed me to watch as he did them. He was a older ham operator who also designed and built a good bit of his gear. As a kid, that shop was a blast!!
I just wish I still had that old Motorola. It's biggest problem was it was huge! My mother was not fond of it in my bedroom. Took up way too much room!

Besides my mini project this week I worked on getting the back reconditioned. Much to my surprise it really didn't fit too good! I know when I got the TV it was barely on the TV and it really didn't fit so good.

I got to looking and the left vertical brace was installed to the back too high. It contacted the upper left mounting screw boss by a lot. OK, so I relocate the brace to match the good right side. I place the back into the cabinet and it is too high! The cutouts for the upper mounting holes won't line up. Hmm....

I decide to mount the chassis into the cabinet to see where the problem is. Well it looks like the outline of the back is correct, but all the holes, etc are about 1/4 inch high! My guess during manufacture, the blank outline wasn't inserted fully into the jig or machine that drills/punches out the holes! I also thought that there might have been some rubber biscuits that go under the chassis but there can't be because the controls shafts are centered on the cabinet holes.

There is no way to locate the elongated holes that mount the back to the chassis. I run out off the bottom edge of the back.

So I drew up a new back using my CAD program. I double check all the mounting holes to the chassis and to the cabinet. Much, much, better. Of course I have to make a new back now.

I've included some pictures of this whole mess.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4876a_zpscdabw5zl.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4876a_zpscdabw5zl.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4878a_zpslybasc7p.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4878a_zpslybasc7p.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4882a_zpsf760guiv.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4882a_zpsf760guiv.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4885a_zpspzoavvch.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4885a_zpspzoavvch.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4890a_zps19xatgvd.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4890a_zps19xatgvd.jpg.html)

Nice job on the drawing. Yes that back design is a bit of a mystery. I wonder if the Masonite actually shrunk to the extent that the top screws pulled the corners off? I also don't understand the need for what appear to be so many extra screw holes, as if that back spent some time on some other cabinet. :scratch2:

That looks like the incorrect back. There also needs to be a lot more ventilation holes near the bottom to get a decent draft on them hot tubes.

It is the correct back. The elongated screw holes and the interlock connector fit perfectly. Also the cutout for the antenna terminals fits perfectly.

Kevin, the extra screw holes in the pictures are for the screws that hold on the 3/4 x5/8 braces which were removed when I was measuring the back. In my drawings, you can see them as dotted lines.

Kevin, the extra screw holes in the pictures are for the screws that hold on the 3/4 x5/8 braces which were removed when I was measuring the back. In my drawings, you can see them as dotted lines.

Ah. Funny how quickly I can forget stuff. I had to go back to where I we originally discuses the set on CL to see what the back originally looked like mounted. Makes sense now that the corner hole were elongated for expansion and contraction, and then the large washers to cover the holes. But I also have to agree that that back doesn't allow for very good ventilation, but since it's spaced out from the chassis at the bottom I suppose it's suppose to work like a convection oven.

http://videokarma.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=192018&d=1470097105

Now that the mini project is done I'm going to sand, rub out and polish the cabinet. It's been 2 weeks since I shot the clear lacquer.

I also added a resistor and capacitor to blank out the retrace lines per Admiral's instructions. Worked great. I even used an existing terminal strip that had 2 unused terminals very close to the brightness pot.

Here's the refinished cabinet. It turned out great! Not perfect but real good.

On to making a new back.


http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4938a_zpstuhcip3c.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4938a_zpstuhcip3c.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4941a_zpsnhzdbhij.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4941a_zpsnhzdbhij.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4947a_zpssxggfrpo.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4947a_zpssxggfrpo.jpg.html)

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4948a_zpsmf7rvdvs.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4948a_zpsmf7rvdvs.jpg.html)

I have the 26R12 set. I also had two of those clear picture tube covers or whatever you call them. Both of them were not perfectly clear. Rather they had a little swirl of white or cloudy in the plastic. It was not something that would polish out. Mind you, not objectionable, just noticeable to me.

Just letting you know since both of our sets are of the same vintage and probably same plastic source.

Yeah, mine has the same "defect" in the safety plastic. See the last picture above and the one below. I couldn't polish it out either.

http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t458/crigotti/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4951a_zpsrhmhosrr.jpg (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/crigotti/media/Admiral%2014R12%201950%20TV/100_4951a_zpsrhmhosrr.jpg.html)

The cabinet turned out great, it's just very hard to photograph something that's very shiny. Most clear plastic's become cloudy with age, especially if they've been exposed to high levels of sunlight over a long period of years. I doubt it will be a problem once you have the CRT lighting it from behind, at least not in a low ambient light room.

The cabinet turned out great, it's just very hard to photograph something that's very shiny. Most clear plastic's become cloudy with age, especially if they've been exposed to high levels of sunlight over a long period of years. I doubt it will be a problem once you have the CRT lighting it from behind, at least not in a low ambient light room.
I always used to use "Pledge" furniture polish on the plastic lenses on the 50's type portables. It seemed to fill in the minute scratches and improve the clarity. :scratch2:

The cabinet turned out great, it's just very hard to photograph something that's very shiny. Most clear plastic's become cloudy with age, especially if they've been exposed to high levels of sunlight over a long period of years. I doubt it will be a problem once you have the CRT lighting it from behind, at least not in a low ambient light room.

Thanks.

Yeah, mine has become a little cloudy. However, there is a casting flaw in it just like kvflyer has in his.

I always used to use "Pledge" furniture polish on the plastic lenses on the 50's type portables. It seemed to fill in the minute scratches and improve the clarity. :scratch2:

I'll try some of that. Thanks.

But don't EVER use Pledge on (or near) any old wooden cabinets. The silicone can permanently contaminate the finish and then you may have a heck of a problem if you ever want to refinish it. Google "silicone contamination" to learn more.

Phil Nelson
Phil's Old Radios
http://antiqueradio.org/index.html

But don't EVER use Pledge on (or near) any old wooden cabinets. The silicone can permanently contaminate the finish and then you may have a heck of a problem if you ever want to refinish it. Google "silicone contamination" to learn more.

Phil Nelson
Phil's Old Radios
http://antiqueradio.org/index.html

Good point Phil!