I bought two TVs of craigslist and I want to restore two units. The first is a Zenith model L1820R with Chassis 19L26 that was made in November 12, 1953. Second, is a Setchell-Carlson with Chassis 401B and I am wondering what year it was made. On the Setchell-Carlson there is a very faded writing on the back cover that I think is 19TL65.

The safe glass on the Zenith seems loose, is there anything special that I need to do before I pull the Chassis? What is a Super "K" Chassis?
The suction cup for high voltage on the S.C. looks like it would crumble if I remove it. Where can I get a replacement? What is the exact name/term for it?

Both TVs were kept in a smoker’s environment. :smoke: I am currently using water and isopropyl alcohol to clean up the units. Is there any other ways to freshen up the smell a bit?

Sorry for the bad pictures. I just took some quick photos with my cellphone.

More Photos...

Those are both nice TV's. I'd put the SC in the mid-'60's time period.

Nice finds.
On that Zenith beware a typo in the sam's that lists a vertical stage cap as different values on the schematic and parts list.

More Photos...

The crumbling cap is called the 2nd anode high voltage cap.
You can possibly get one from a trashed newer set. The newer ones were made from a better rubber on a vinyl product.
Don't be surprised if the CRT is weak in the S-C. EIA 836 is National Video and many didn't fare too well, through the years. :sigh:

Best anode caps were from mid 70's Zenith color sets.
Large cap, screw on connection 15-276 was PN.
Easily handles 35 KV

Newer Zenith safety screens came off from front. Plastic trim came off
with a light pry but BE CAREFUL just in case. The glass
was held by a few 1/4 inch screws under the trim.

Nice pair of set, probably the best out there at the time.

73 Zeno:smoke:

Zeno: Zenith did not use pry-off plastic bezels in the 50's. I have the 21" screen version of that set, and I can tell you that there are screws holding the glass and mask on mine. Prying will only cause damage.

Zeno: Zenith did not use pry-off plastic bezels in the 50's. I have the 21" screen version of that set, and I can tell you that there are screws holding the glass and mask on mine. Prying will only cause damage.
Thats why I said be careful. I worked sets from abt 1960 on, darn few before that. The ones I did the plastic did pop off but if you got one
then you know. I assume the jug is mounted on the chassis as in
newer over 19" sets like 14N22 & requires a chassis pull to clean
the screen ??

73 Zeno:smoke:

Thats why I said be careful. I worked sets from abt 1960 on, darn few before that. The ones I did the plastic did pop off but if you got one
then you know. I assume the jug is mounted on the chassis as in
newer over 19" sets like 14N22 & requires a chassis pull to clean
the screen ??

73 Zeno:smoke:

I think the newer model Zenith's, you're referring to, use a tension band type of CRT, that didn't require a safety glass. The "N" models are 1966 model year.

I think the newer model Zenith's, you're referring to, use a tension band type of CRT, that didn't require a safety glass. The "N" models are 1966 model year.
I was remembering the 19" sets abt 60-65. IIRC older consoles
had a large flat screen that came off easy. Yes I am sure by N
line they were "built in" screens.

73 Zeno:smoke:

Most any BPC CRT TV set or computer monitor will have a usable 2nd anode high voltage cap. If the high voltage wire is long enough (cut if off at the BPC flyback), you could use it along with the newer cap when you replace the old one.

You might be able to salvage some of the capacitors off the BPC board to use when you replace the old set's wax paper caps.

Keep your eyes out for sets on the curb, i see them all the time, usually someone has already smashed open the back of the set to swipe the copper defection coils. just dont get zapped!

Sorry or the long delays. I took a replacement high voltage cap out of a computer monitor that my Grandma was going to throw away. I did get the Setchell-Carlson working. The CRT seems to be ok and not too weak.
184451
I love the light up channel knobs!
184452
There were some weird fixes. One is they used a can capacitor and wired the three together for about 70uf when part list called for 100uf, so it was replaced with a 100uf 50v capacitor and replaced all old capacitors along with a few old bumble bee.
184453
Second, the CRT tube is missing a plastic base/connector cover.
184454

I am now working on cleaning and restoring the Zenith. I found after cleaning all the dirt and years of smoke there is little bits of gold thread in the fabric of the speaker cover. Now it looks a little like the Hollywood Bowl.
184455
It seems that my Yoke cover is rotting away into little bits all over. What are you guys using for replacements?
184456The plug looks very different for the high voltage. It’s not really a plug. What would you call it? It looks like there was electric arc in one spot, should I use corona dope to cover that area?
184457
184458

I have this odd resistor that is a 68K OHMS but measures 80+K that is connect to the C2C 100uF electrolytic capacitor and a 250V Terminal lug where a bunch of 250V items connect. I can’t seem to locate it at all on my part list or schematic. Should it be removed?

185101

Part list and schematic files:
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/nhbwr7587isa2om/AADvaWaTAFVKwWx0JktocOwJa?dl=0

185102

I've said it before, and I'll say it again: I never take the sam's diagram's version of how a set ought to be wired over the actual wiring in the set!...Unless I see evidence that that a hack repairman has been in the section I'm working on or the the section where I see a difference does not work properly after all caps have been replaced and all other parts in the circuit have been confirmed to be good.

Sam's has had SO MANY typos/errors over the years (not to mention they often missed documenting production changes)that I consider taking their folders as the bible on any given set to be almost the same as asking to be instructed to sabotage your own set!
I've screwed up good circuits in sets, and caused myself many headaches by blindly assuming that the sam's was infalible.

I have this odd resistor that is a 68K OHMS but measures 80+K that is connect to the C2C 100uF electrolytic capacitor and a 250V Terminal lug where a bunch of 250V items connect. I can’t seem to locate it at all on my part list or schematic. Should it be removed?

185101

Part list and schematic files:
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/nhbwr7587isa2om/AADvaWaTAFVKwWx0JktocOwJa?dl=0
It looks factory so leave it in. Its just out of tolerance so you
may want to change it. It cant be a 680 ohm as the Sams says.
If it were the 250V would be go to ground through the
680 ohm & R67 a 1K. That would make lots of smoke :banana:
Also C2 is probably rated at 50V, KABOOM :thmbsp:
BTW if C2 opens the bottom of the pix will pull up, common.

Bottom line is Sams has at least 2 errors. But I will not
beat up on them. Imagine the hobby or the former industry
without them. And factory manuals are not without sin either.
That may make a good new thread someday:scratch2:
Good luck with the Zenith.

73 Zeno:smoke:

I've said it before, and I'll say it again: I never take the sam's diagram's version of how a set ought to be wired over the actual wiring in the set!...Unless I see evidence that that a hack repairman has been in the section I'm working on or the the section where I see a difference does not work properly after all caps have been replaced and all other parts in the circuit have been confirmed to be good.

Sam's has had SO MANY typos/errors over the years (not to mention they often missed documenting production changes)that I consider taking their folders as the bible on any given set to be almost the same as asking to be instructed to sabotage your own set!
I've screwed up good circuits in sets, and caused myself many headaches by blindly assuming that the sam's was infalible.

Many "errors" in Sams aren't errors, but Production Changes that weren't passed to them, or the tech not doing the research to see if Sams printed a PCB.

Sams are a snapshot of two TVs in the total production - and not wholly representative of the entire production of that model/chassis. There is a really good article in PF reporter about the troubles that Production Changes bring, and the necessity that manufacturers report them to Sams, thus giving the whole picture. RCA, Westinghouse, Magnavox, GE and Philco were lauded in the article for providing the changes. Zenith, Sylvania, Admiral and Sears weren't so generous, which is why all of the Sams for those sets are to be suspect should the circuitry differ.

Note that the Sams website DOES NOT report Production Change Bulletins like the printed indexes did. That is why the paper indexes are so valuable, and much needed, especially for the older sets.

The PCBs are in the index as parenthesis-items, and are noted as such:

CTC38 1000-1 (PCB 1231-9)

If you have a later chassis, that PCB could save your head from spinning. I got bit back in the early 80's when working on an old Teledyne/Packard Bell Solid state set. Sams didn't show any changes, yet the vertical had changed....dramatically, with the addition of a few diodes and resistors in the blanking and yoke return. One call to Teledyne, and I got what was needed - a change, issued some 9 months after the date of the Sams. Apparently Teledyne had three production runs of the same chassis, and never reported it to Sams. Easy way to make some money for themselves, selling updated manuals. Same for Zenith - anyone familiar with their CM manuals and the updates, where you replace an entire manual with another. It was tempting to "save" the outdated manual, and keep it for further use, despite it having errors and omissions. RCA was the same - the CTC16 data I have is the "FIFTH printing", and I also have the 2nd and 4th, which are both very different parts-wise.

So I guess I can say while Sams does have errors, not all omissions or changes are errors on Sams' part.

The errors I was referring to are TRUE ERRORS such as the schematic and parts list in one folder showing a factor of 10 difference on a capacitor value, and another where the tuning cans for different remote functions were interchanged on the chassis layout.

I can tell the difference between a production change and an error just fine. An error is the above, similar things and sometimes a part having the wrong value listed (although that can fall under production change some of the time).
A production change is when the schematic has a different number and or configuration of parts than the set and possibly value changes of parts have been made.

I'm a Zenith man so I don't work on much PCB based stuff...The only pure RCA product I've worked on is a CTC-4, unless you count CTC-15 clones.

I think we are saying the same thing - errors exist in SAMs. As for PCBs, some PCBs REMOVE parts, leading to the conclusion the SAMs is wrong. I helped a fellow VKer with his RCA, which had a PCB that removed several parts-didn't change them, just removed them:http://www.videokarma.org/showpost.php?p=3120597&postcount=8


My point is merely that with SAMs, you really can't tell. If the schematic or parts lists differ, you can't rule out a PCB if you don't have that PCB. SAMs website won't help, as they don't mention them, only the paper indexes do.

Awhile back I was working a Zenith 19EC45 set. SAMs doesn't show changes to the power supply, the Zenith data does, and the TEKFAX is different that Sams and the Zenith data. The PCB listed by SAMs doesn't affect the power supply circuitry that is different. Conclusion is that SAMs didn't get the PCB from Zenith, as Zenith data clearly lists the correct info.

So while SAMs does have errors, not all differences or omissions are errors on SAMs' part.

I have this odd resistor that is a 68K OHMS but measures 80+K that is connect to the C2C 100uF electrolytic capacitor and a 250V Terminal lug where a bunch of 250V items connect. I can’t seem to locate it at all on my part list or schematic. Should it be removed?

185101

Part list and schematic files:
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/nhbwr7587isa2om/AADvaWaTAFVKwWx0JktocOwJa?dl=0

Zenith data seems to agree with Sams on this - the 68K is nowhere to be found, schematically.

Before you remove the part;

Does the part look age appropriate with the other parts already in the set....?

Do the solder joints look undisturbed...? Was it original looking in its installation...?

If it perhaps looks newer, or if the solder joints look recently disturbed.... Then is there
a possible nearby location where this part may go....? As in, did someone accidentally
put this part back in the wrong spot making a previous repair....?

If it's connected off the cathode of the vert output, 100uf cap, (it's the only 100uf
cap I see in the schematic clip posted above) Then, the set had a minor
linearity issue, or a sync issue and someone fudged the circuit.... I can't
see it making a really big difference given the values of the other resistors
to ground in that area...

Remember ground and voltage sources are both looked at as a sink as far as
signal goes..... If it's a voltage source than what, the screen on the sync tube
must have been floating too low.....

Fix the set, then run it without it, and then put it back and see what it does....
At that value it ain't gunna make that big a difference...

See what happens.... The guy that put it in was either a schmuck, or a genius!


.

I saw your request over on ARF-the Zenith schematic is in both the 1954 Beitmans Tv-7 and Radio Electronics Magazine:

http://www.americanradiohistory.com/hd2/IDX-Consumer/Archive-Radio-Electronics-IDX/IDX/50s/1954/Radio-Electronics-1954-01-OCR-Page-0084.pdf

http://www.americanradiohistory.com/hd2/IDX-Consumer/Archive-Radio-Electronics-IDX/IDX/50s/1954/Radio-Electronics-1954-01-OCR-Page-0085.pdf

Hope this helps.

After doing a power on after replacing all caps and some resistors I was able to get a picture.

I had some issues with horizontal and vertical hold so I went back and replaced more resistors that tested ok when I check the set originally.

It still has horizontal hold issue. I uploaded a youtube video. Is there anything I should look into? http://youtu.be/RoxY6O8WNYk

The crumbling cap is called the 2nd anode high voltage cap.
You can possibly get one from a trashed newer set. The newer ones were made from a better rubber on a vinyl product.
Don't be surprised if the CRT is weak in the S-C. EIA 836 is National Video and many didn't fare too well, through the years. :sigh:


You're right, S.C made the phones better than the Tvs..:scratch2:

After doing a power on after replacing all caps and some resistors I was able to get a picture.

I had some issues with horizontal and vertical hold so I went back and replaced more resistors that tested ok when I check the set originally.

It still has horizontal hold issue. I uploaded a youtube video. Is there anything I should look into? http://youtu.be/RoxY6O8WNYk
Look to the horz phase area. Usually 2 diodes in series & all the
parts between the sync sep & horz osc tubes.

73 Zeno:smoke:

After doing some more work on the set I found some micamold/mica caps and I am wondering if they are paper and if they could be causing the issue. A troubleshooting book suggested the picture vibration might also be caused by IF tubes.

What do you guys think?

Look to the horz phase area. Usually 2 diodes in series & all the
parts between the sync sep & horz osc tubes.
Those dual diodes are most always common-cathode rather than series. Be sure to determine which it is. (There is a common-anode type but I've never seen one in a TV set.)

To footlooseman: An IF tube will not cause weak H sync like shown in the vid.

I showed my co-worker the video with the horizontal. He used to be a TV repair person back in the 80s and 90s and thought the horizontal issue could be caused by the flyback transformer. There were some cracks and if I recall correctly missing insulation (I have to take photos tonight). Do you think I should look into buying a replacement?