Digital TV by 2009?

[compucat]

That TV transmitter is a neat idea. I may look into something like that when the time comes. I received a reply from Casio regarding digital portable TV. Here is what they said:


As of right now we do not have information on when or if that will be out. I'm sure we will have units that will be capable but right now we don’t know when. Please keep posted on our website we will post a press release when available.

Thank You,
Lisa Bayliss
Casio CSR

For those of us who use a portable TV as much or more than the big set in the living room, It seems like there will be digital portables available. I guess I'll just break down an buy a new set when the analog service is ended.

[andy]

I think the big problem with portable DTVs is the power needed. It's probably going to be a while before we can receive and decode ATSC on 4 AAs. Has anyone ever tried running an ATSC set top box in a moving car? Is it even possible to receive it unless you're standing still?

I like the way the UK is handling digital TV. They have added digital channels to the analog carrier, but still have the analog signal. All you do is plug a digital box into you existing antenna and you can get more channels for free plus digital copies of the analog channels and a program guide. They will eventually turn off the analog signal, but by then everyone will be able to receive digital.

They can do this because the TV network reallly is a network that coveres the entire county. Everyone can recieve the same 5 broadcast channels clearly.

[NowhereMan 1966]

Originally Posted by andy

I think the big problem with portable DTVs is the power needed. It's probably going to be a while before we can receive and decode ATSC on 4 AAs. Has anyone ever tried running an ATSC set top box in a moving car? Is it even possible to receive it unless you're standing still?

I like the way the UK is handling digital TV. They have added digital channels to the analog carrier, but still have the analog signal. All you do is plug a digital box into you existing antenna and you can get more channels for free plus digital copies of the analog channels and a program guide. They will eventually turn off the analog signal, but by then everyone will be able to receive digital.

They can do this because the TV network reallly is a network that coveres the entire county. Everyone can recieve the same 5 broadcast channels clearly.

Good thoughts. I know there have been stories where the Feds who used the digital mode on their walkie-talkies complained the battery life was short so they used the analogue mode for comms unless the digital encryption is really needed. Everything uses power and to use a computer to decode and decompress the HDTV signal will take its share of power along with the RF circuits to receive the signal in the first place. Mobile reception of HDTV, would be interesting to try, maybe in an urban/suburban area, it would work but if you're out in the sticks, I think it would be tough.

[nasadowsk]

FDNY and Motorola are tangled in a few lawsuits over digital walkie talkies. Apparently, the things don't work very well (or even work...), though my dad (retired FDNY) pointed out to me that the old radios didn't work very well either...

[Sandy G]

HDTV IS a better picture than analog/std NTSC, but is it REALLY worth all the hate & discontent it's gonna cause? Virtually EVERY TV set in the country is gonna be obsolete overnight-I don't care how much they advertise it, that's gonna cause mass confusion on a huge scale-and it's been proven people would give up easily-available food & water before they'd give up TV. As usual, people in government have not thought this one out very well. But we all know the gummint could f!ck up a 2 car funeral....<grin>-Sandy G.

[yagosaga]

Originally Posted by Sandy G

I don't care how much they advertise it, that's gonna cause mass confusion on a huge scale-and it's been proven people would give up easily-available food & water before they'd give up TV.

I don't know what are the plans for changing tv norm in the U.S.. We have already digital tv on air since one year. But on satellite tv we have both, the analog programs and the digital programs. Only 10 percent of the people watch tv by air antenna, and they have to buy the set top box.
A great problem we have with the landwide distribution of the digital broadcasting. Many parts of the country can't receive tv on air because digital tv doesn't reach so far, the transmitting power was underestimated. Does you government switch off totally analog NTSC or can you get analog tv still via satellite?

[NowhereMan 1966]

Originally Posted by Sandy G

HDTV IS a better picture than analog/std NTSC, but is it REALLY worth all the hate & discontent it's gonna cause? Virtually EVERY TV set in the country is gonna be obsolete overnight-I don't care how much they advertise it, that's gonna cause mass confusion on a huge scale-and it's been proven people would give up easily-available food & water before they'd give up TV. As usual, people in government have not thought this one out very well. But we all know the gummint could f!ck up a 2 car funeral....<grin>-Sandy G.

That's the problem I see as well. The US Government ought to be thankful my maternal grandmother passed away in 1997 at 85, otherwise whe would put up a fuss and stink about not getting her stories on her 1962 RCA B&W portable. My father is still around and he thinks it is all a conspiracy to just make money for the movers and shakers behind it.

I do agree that people would give up food before TV, heck in the 1930's, they did or would do the same for radio. I dunno of HDTV is worth all of that, to me, I'd rather have a Chevy that hardly breaks down and does what I need it to do than a Rolls Royce that is in the shop every other Tuesday. Then again, a lot of TV programming, well, frankly sucks, you need to go to places like cable/satellite to find anything decent.

Maybe a better solution would have been to accolate a certain number of UHF channels for HDTV or go by satellite/cable while leaving the VHF spectrum and part of the UHF spectrum to analogue TV. I do remember stories that the old CBS color TV system was to be broadcast on UHF only and leaving NTSC on VHF.

I think we could be going down the same path that killed AM stereo to where you had a trainwreck of various systems instead of just one system, I do see a trainwreck here. The only people I know that have an HDTV is my neighbors and he bought that after winning the lottery for $20K plus. Well, I guess i'll just keep my 1982 Zenith going and if need be, use a convertor box. I wish i did have my father's 1979 Zenith, almost a carbom copy of mine for spare parts though.

[NowhereMan 1966]

Originally Posted by nasadowsk

FDNY and Motorola are tangled in a few lawsuits over digital walkie talkies. Apparently, the things don't work very well (or even work...), though my dad (retired FDNY) pointed out to me that the old radios didn't work very well either...

I think I heard that somewhere. I know there was talk for a while about Pittsburgh Police going to 800 Mc, although it would still have been analogue, but the deal fell through and they are still using their old 453 Mc system they had since the 1960's. I know New York had a lot of commo problems and when the Twin Towers fell on 9-11, it made them a lot worse.

[OvenMaster]

Originally Posted by Sandy G

HDTV IS a better picture than analog/std NTSC, but is it REALLY worth all the hate & discontent it's gonna cause? Virtually EVERY TV set in the country is gonna be obsolete overnight-I don't care how much they advertise it, that's gonna cause mass confusion on a huge scale-and it's been proven people would give up easily-available food & water before they'd give up TV. As usual, people in government have not thought this one out very well. But we all know the gummint could f!ck up a 2 car funeral....<grin>-Sandy G.

Got that right. How many analog tv sets are in use in the US? 200, 300 million?
Imagine what that will do to landfills. Imagine the lead leaching into the soil. Bet the geniuses didn't think of that.
Tom

[john_w]

This sucks for serious vintage TV collectors, or even someone with just one cool old TV they like to play with - I'm not in that situation but I really sympathize with you guys. Even with a free converter box, it kinda ruins it to have to stick some cheep plastic box on your set. I suppose you could hide it, though. And would they be usable with some of the older sets out there?

The government will likely be very successful at pulling the plug on standard def. After all, aren't they the ones that got rid of all our English measurements in favor of metric by the year 2000?

Why not allow standard def. amateur broadcasts? Now, that would be cool! Probably wouldn't be too common, but it would be kind of fun to see what pops up out there.

I do agree that forcing everyone to go to digital HDTV and such is a problem.

Thing is, I hardly watch any cable TV or whatever at all, except on Sundays in the evening. The rest of the time, my daily watcher set is used for playing DVDs or video gaming or playing back my mini-DV tapes, etc. I've also been buying a lot of the TV shows I enjoy on DVD anyhow. I have about 100+ Beta and 150+ VHS tapes I am restoring to DVD with my computer of TV shows. Another thing is, up until the mid 1990s, I could probably watch 6-7 hours of TV a day. Now I watch maybe, if I am lucky, 2 hours a week of broadcast TV.

I do in the next few years want to upgrade to a bigger TV with HDTV and such. Mainly for the upcoming HD-DVD and/or Blue Ray format, and for gaming and such. But I won't just go out and buy one just like that. It may be several years before I do that.

As for my 20+ collection of TVs ranging from 1960-1982, I actually don't even have it set up to receive any over the air signals as is now. I have 3 8-output distribution amps hooked to a DVD-VHS combo unit which also acts as an RF output for my other equipment I own. While that may not be as fun as tuning in over the air signals and such, there really is nothing on broadcast TV I watch. As for portables, I do have a cheap TV transmitter that broadcasts on channel 5, but not that good. I plan to build one of my own design, but that won't be for a while. Another advantage with my setup is it saves wear on the tuners. Just leave them all on channel 3.

So even if this does happen, I will still be using my old TVs. Nothing will stop me

[OvenMaster]

Originally Posted by john_w

Why not allow standard def. amateur broadcasts? Now, that would be cool! Probably wouldn't be too common, but it would be kind of fun to see what pops up out there.

They got 'em already, John!
"Amateur television (ATV) is used on four UHF channels just below 14, especially for repeater output and direct communications. ATV repeater inputs may also be on other channels not near the broadcast bands." (from http://www.answers.com/topic/north-a...on-frequencies )
So that means you can find present-day ATV broadcasting between 447MHz and 471MHz This corresponds to the CABLE channels 62 through 66, approximately, NOT the over-the-air channel numbers. Any cable-ready TV or VCR will be able to get these channels. (from http://www.jneuhaus.com/fccindex/cablech.html )
If you have an outdoor antenna or rabbit ears, just switch the TV or VCR from over-the-air reception to cable reception and try to see what you can get... if anything. Transmitters are from what I recall about 100W max. Usually this will be near larger cities.

Tom

[Bill R]

HDTV is only a marketing tool to get everyone to switch to ATSC. The real driving force is money. What we will see is not only the end of NTSC broadcasting, but the end to free tv broadcasting. Maybe not at first, not until sufficent market saturation. Since networks can put multiple Standard def programs on one digital channel, How long do you think it will take them to start charging you to receive the signal. That is what digital cable does now with addressable decoders. You may not only need a set top box, but an addressable set top box. The technology is already there. Remember the networks were not to happy with the cable superstation networks, after Ted Turner was charging for what they were giving away. It's all in the money.

[Big Dave]

Our government never learns from its mistakes. They approved FM, then after Sarnoff complained, they moved the FM band where it is today, but didn't require manufacturers to make recievers. Look at UHF. After the freeze, stations got placed on UHF, but nobody could recieve it. HDTV will not be any different. I think the majority of TV viewers will be out on the cold when the switch takes place. Thank goodness for DVD players. If the networks had to depend on me for revenue, they would join Enron in bankruptcy court.

I couldn't make out the scanned article at the beginning of this thread, but based on what other posters have said, that reporter is a total dweeb. Our recapped tube sets are not obsolete. They will still work, unlike this cheap foreign slave labor shit that passes as a TV reciever today.

End of rant.

This rant was brought to you today by Lite Beer.

[vintagecollect]

Big companies are always changing formats. Nothing new since RCA and CBS fought it out to see which color standard would prevail in early 1950's. I hope no one has spent big money on a tv in last 5 years. Any system not compaiple with NTSC in some way would obviously cause mass discontent as everybody needs to buy tv. RCA was smart enough to make sytem compatible w/ B/W TV sets. Not to mention all those VCRs with tuners that also work same standards.