Benq plasma salvagable or write off?

[MRX37]

Originally Posted by restorer-john

. Never forget the person who needs a dead one to fix his own.

Quite true.

I've more then once brought something back to life using "cadavers" from other dead electronics.

[Richard D]

I work part time in a TV shop in Miami Fl. that has been in business since 1953. People still bring in their beloved electronics from the 1950's thru 1970's and when one or two come in I get called to repair them. They are also the authorized service center for companys the build/sell plasma, LCD, and DLP sets. What I have seen that if the problem cannot be corrected by software upgrades, (quite a few can ) or the replacement of large circuit boards the manfacturer says to tell the customer that the device is not economicilly repairable. If under warranty the bad section is replaced, they usually ship second day air. There are a lot of folks with 5 year old plasma sets who are very unhappy after pitching their 15 year old still working CRT rear projection sets to make room for the new flat screen technology.

[ChrisW6ATV]

It is sad that these companies are not even trying to support component-level repairs. I doubt that most of the repairs needed are the complex chips; most surface-mount repairs I have done were caps or transistors, and flat-panel TVs could be the same. I understand not repairing a 19" CRT TV, but a flat panel that cost $3000 new should be worth more effort than that.

[Richard D]

Originally Posted by ChrisW6ATV

It is sad that these companies are not even trying to support component-level repairs. I doubt that most of the repairs needed are the complex chips; most surface-mount repairs I have done were caps or transistors, and flat-panel TVs could be the same. I understand not repairing a 19" CRT TV, but a flat panel that cost $3000 new should be worth more effort than that.

I forgot to mention that the manufacturer wants the old board back or a very expensive core charge. There is also a note in the box that the replacement board comes in that says something like, This board my have been refurbished but meets all the specs and warranty as does a new one.

[andy]

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[Randy Bassham]

Wonder if PTS electronics rebuilds plasma and LCD modules, they've been in the panel/tuner rebuilding business for years.

[ChrisW6ATV]

Originally Posted by Richard D

I forgot to mention that the manufacturer wants the old board back or a very expensive core charge. There is also a note in the box that the replacement board comes in that says something like, This board my have been refurbished but meets all the specs and warranty as does a new one.

This idea is not bad, provided the "exchange" cost is reasonable. Also, since they have these exchange programs, clearly someone is doing component-level repairs on plasma/LCD circuits. If they refuse to make service information available, I wonder if the FTC could get involved for some kind of business-restraint issue?

[radiotvnut]

Originally Posted by restorer-john

Answer: someone who needs a powersupply, an outer plastic frame, rear case, feet etc would pay decent money for it on ebay. Never forget the person who needs a dead one to fix his own.

I understand that; but, it would be just my luck that the same part I needed would be bad in the busted plasma I just paid $500 for. The only way I'd consider paying any large amount of $$ for anything broke would be if I knew for certain that it had a good part for something else I needed. It will be interesting to see what new plasma sets sell for in 10-15 years. I wonder if they will ever be as cheap as most current CRT sets are.

[peverett]

With modern electronics, the extremely complex integrated circuits and the surface mount technology(not to mention the lead-free soldier that is coming) is making board repair at the local TV shop very difficult. At the manufacturers location, special test fixtures(such as bed of nails, special test equipment to exercise the ICs test modes, etc) would make more economic sense than at an individuals TV shop. This would also be true of the specialized equipment needed to reliably replace surface mount components.

This is my opinion as to why board replacement, not repair is being done at most electronic service locations today. (It is also the reason that I try to avoid working on any electronic equipment made after about 1985-not only are the components easier to replace-they are easier to find and purchase, including vaccum tubes.)

[ChrisW6ATV]

Originally Posted by radiotvnut

It will be interesting to see what new plasma sets sell for in 10-15 years. I wonder if they will ever be as cheap as most current CRT sets are.

Plasma displays will probably not be made for more than about another five years, as LCD displays get better and better. LCD TVs in five years will cost about the same as comparable-sized CRT TVs cost recently, that is, US$100 for a 15" and maybe $150 for a 19-inch. Actually, I would expect those prices to be hit in about two years, not five. $500 or less will buy you a 40-42" LCD within five years (or maybe two years), $1000 for a 52". Eventually, the 42" will be $300 and the 52" will be $500, probably. Projection sets will go away within five years as well, when the really big LCDs (65-80") start to sell for less than US$2000.

It was only four and a half years ago that 42" non-high-definition plasma displays went down to US$3000-3500, and now the near-high-def ones are under $1000. A 37-inch LCD in Japan cost the equivalent of $7500 in January 2003, and I have seen that size recently for well under $1000.

[kx250rider]

Originally Posted by Randy Bassham

Wonder if PTS electronics rebuilds plasma and LCD modules, they've been in the panel/tuner rebuilding business for years.

Some, YES. My friend in West Los Angeles uses them often for plasma and LCD boards. However, the reason that a lot of those boards are not component level repairable is that they're multi-layer, and contain BGA comonents. (BGA= Ball-Grid array, which cannot be soldered with an iron. It takes a special BGA placement heat projector and X-ray viewer.)

I've used PTS for many boards too. I trust their work 90%, but not on anything from a CRT projection Phillips. They've done several Pioneer CRT projection boards for me, and also a few Sony XBR CRT boards that had really weird and hard-to-troubleshoot problems.

Charles

[andy]

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[kx250rider]

Originally Posted by andy

BGA is the worst thing to happen to the electronic hobby. Even dense surface mount can be done at home, but BGA is virtually impossible. Even if it works, you have no way to inspect your soldering to make sure it's good. I've started to see a lot of laptops and video cards with bad BGA soldering. Certain models have very high failure rates.

I had some exposure to it while I was working in the test lab at a local PC board mfg company. I never operated the BGA bench, but I did fill in on the BGA X-ray for the X-ray tech once in awhile (I had to get X-ray certified and wear a badge that was supposed to explode in my face or something, to warn of X-ray exposure in case of a leak )... Basically, the X-ray shows the density of the balls. If there are white dots, or if they're not circular, the BGA connection is a fail. With no X-ray, it's 100% impossible to see what you have.

Charles

[lukiedog]

The screen burn-in is apparently not fixable. You might get lucky and open her up and look on the boards and find something obvious like a leaking capacitor. I've fixed LCD monitors this way, not knowing a thing about how to actually fix one.

[bgadow]

This is the first time I've heard of BGA. (well, I don't get out much...) Would be interesting to see just what it looks like. Is it fairly universal now?