Magnavox 19" find at the thrift
 

Just stopped by my local thrift and bought a 1984 Magnavox 19C309 for 5 bucks. Knob tuned set in good overall condition, fake woodgrain and all.

I'm surprised at how good the picture is BEFORE all the usual tweaking. Must have been a low-hour set. Haven't even opened it up yet.

Was built in Greenville, TN October 1984. Assuming it is a NAP product.

Once I open the back up I'll know who made the CRT and I'll post some pics if anyone is interested.

I've worked on a few of those. They were good sets. I wouldn't mind seeing some pictures.

Here we go:

The CRT is a 19VMFP22 with an EIA code of 312 (Sylvania) although its labeled NAP Made in U.S.A.

HV is 27.5kV. I like the layout of this set, its just the type of set I'm best at servicing. Singleboard, knob tuners, large neckboard with clearly labeled drive and cutoff controls. Got this one looking real good :thmbsp:

So, in general, this was a long-lived chassis? I see Nichicon capacitors and other quality parts on the board. The speaker is labeled 'Onk'--that can't be Onkyo, can it? It's 1.5 watt at 4 ohm, FWIW.

Apologies for the low-rez pictures. I am using my laptop's internal camera.

Just a note also: These shots were taken with the TV on my basement floor and no antenna attached. VHF channel 7 analog. All that was connected to the 300 ohm posts was a 75 to 300 balun adapter. Another testament to the power of analog television. :yes:

Come to think of it, I'll probably use this set in my basement with a converter box and UHF loop antenna. Using my portacolor down here at the moment.

Those sets also sported the Philco and Sylvania badges. In fact, the control placement and knobs are very similar to my '81 (pre-NAP) GTE-Philco. I remember reading somewhere where NAP bought Sylvania for their CRT division. Those C3 chassis were fairly reliable. I've seen the usual power supply problems, vertical problems, and that yellow retrace cap by the HOT crack and burn a few times.

Correct me if I'm wrong; but, I think this may have been the last NAP chassis to use a rotary tuner. Every NAP set that I've seen after about '84-'85 had a digital tuner.

I think I had this exact set at one point. Could have been an '83 though.

Anyway, it is interesting to hear about Philips and their relations with Sylvania CRT's....Wonder which factory these tubes were made at? Batavia, NY?

The 19" Magnavox I had for years was a digital tuned set - not cable ready. It was made in late 1985 - I received it for Christmas that year. If there was still a knob-tuned set available I really don't think my parents would have spent the extra money for a digital one.

They were much less common after about '85; but, there were still some made.

I've seen one 19" knob tuned Zenith set from around '87 and an RCA XL-100 from the very late '80's that still used a knob tuner (CTC136, IIRC). There were a few RCA/GE consoles (CTC130) from around '86 or '87 that had the single knob varactor tuner as well as some Panasonic/Quasar consoles from the same period with knob tuners.

Emerson, KTV, Samsung, Goldstar, Megatron, and other "off brands" had knob tuned sets up until '93, when the Gov't required closed caption decoders to be built into all sets.

I used to sell many knob tuned TVs to older people that were intimidated by TVs with pushbuttons.

Some more info: This set uses a switched mode PSU. Apparently the CRT was used in several arcade monitors back in this time. I ran a search and the tube number came up multiple times. Must be a decent crt.

I've seen very few bad NAP CRT's.

You must be in a very strong signal area if you are getting such a good picture on that set, using just a 75/300-ohm matching transformer and no antenna. (You are the second person here I have seen so far who has reported this--AK member AUdubon5425 was the first.) How far are you from the NYC TV stations? There doesn't seem to be any ghosting, multipath or other distortion in the picture either. I mention that because I read in the old Electronics Illustrated magazine about 35-40 years ago an article about the problems New Yorkers were having with multipath and ghosting problems in the city at that time (caused by signal reflections off the World Trade Center and other structures in downtown Manhattan), and probably the suburbs as well. Your area seems to be a suburb of New York (I did a Google search for Belle Harbor before starting to write this), but as I said, your area must have incredible signal strength or else you have an unusually clear shot at the transmitters atop the Empire State Building.

It's not that we're very close to the transmitters; it's that there are literally no tall structures between the Empire State Bldg and where I live, it's all residential. A bay seperates us from Brooklyn and the skyline is clearly visible from the other end of my neighborhood (only 5 blocks across)

EDIT: I had to open the set up again because I neglected to set the height control accordingly now that i hooked the Maggie up to my cable converter. Silly mistakes, huh... All they do is waste my time :: But the TV looks nice.

Interesting Magnavox 19" I have.

It is a digital chnl selection, Model RD4258SL with date of OCtober 83.

One label says "NAP Consumer Electronics"

All I can say is I hooked up a DVD player to it and the picture was incredibly sharp.

I have had one problem with it though, I lost chnl 10 a few weeks ago. I was using antenna since I currently have no cable service. The other VHF chnls come in ok though.

I just got my converter coupons yesterday and will get a converter to keep using this nice running TV. Plus I love the fact that there is a flip down drawer for all the adjustments, none of that on-screen modern garbage they sell now days.

I did buy a new digital TV, a LG 22", not bad but smaller than my Magnavox 19" for overall viewing across the room!

Did Magnavox have NAP build this TV set for them?

Regards, Ron

Cool! Save it! Sounds like a quality TV set. As for the channel 10 issue, it could simply need the tuner cleaned out. What does the picture look like on channel 10? Snow? or black screen?

North American Philips bought up the Magnavox, Sylvania, and Philco names from General Telephone and Electronics (GTE) who already owned Sylvania and built them at Batavia NY and other locations in the USA. This was in the early 80s and apparently built these sets in Tennessee at the original Magnavox factory. The chassis were designed by Philips and the CRT's are Sylvanias as far as I can tell.

I meant Magnavox/NAP sets in particular. I saw a 19" color Zenith with knobs that was from '87-'89 at a thrift in February - made in Mexico I think.

chnl 10 problem
 

Chnl 10 comes in like every other "no-signal" chnl, snowy that is.

But since I'll be getting a converter box it won't matter. Also, I plan to use this set for DVD/VCR use since the picture quality is very good.

So "NAP" stands for "North American Philips", right???


Regards, Ron

I'm curious. What is it you don't like about on-screen menus and controls, which are all but universal in today's TVs? I think they are an improvement over mechanical tuners, potentiometers, and switches, as on-screen controls don't wear out and are easier to adjust (they have a cursor that moves along a scale, which is good for finding the midpoint of the control's travel). The only real drawback I can see to this system is that if a certain section of the jungle IC (that large IC in today's TVs with 30 pins or more) goes bad, it can disable those OSD controls and menus--even if the TV still makes a picture.

If you have lost channel ten, the other channels are normal, and your set has a digital electronic tuner, cleaning won't help as there is nothing to clean in these modern tuners. I once had a Zenith 13" color portable with a single-knob 12-position VHF/UHF varactor electronic tuner; these can conceivably go bad if the switch mechanism that turns the channel indicator and switches the parameters of the tuner (for want of a better phrase) gets dirty or corroded, but I can't see how an all-electronic tuner can lose only one channel. Hmmm. :scratch2:

Well in an electronic tuner, sometimes it can be beneficial to take apart the tuning box/IF box and clean the contacts with alcohol. If there are modular pin connectors, clean the posts there as well. Worth a shot, but it's true that channel 3 is all we'll need after the transition to DTV.

I prefer analog potentiometers and switches to on-screen menus as well. Like Jeff noted, if the controller chip goes bad, it may not be worth the time and money to fix the set. Whereas, in an older TV, the controls usually just need some DeOxit cleaner and/or their board's solder joints reflowed.

That '83 Magnavox sounds like the set my family had during my childhood. It was a 19" set in a woodgrain plastic case. It had a green LED readout and buttons for power, volume up, volume down, channel up, and channel down. Below those buttons was a fold down door that hid the other customer adjustments. I think it used the 19C2 chassis. That set saw heavy use until it was gotten rid of around '95 when the CRT got too weak to make a decent picture. My dad bought it used in '84 from our TV man for $150. I wish 19" color TVs were still worth $150 on the used market.

That loss of channel 10 could be due to loose connections in the tuner and where the tuner plugs into the chassis.

I don't know when NAP actually bought Magnavox. I've heard '74, '78, and '80. I do know that they bought Magnavox before they bought the consumer electronics division of GTE (Sylvania/Philco). Sometime in '81, NAP bought the consumer electronics division from GTE, which included the Sylvania and Philco names. GTE had already purchased Philco from Ford around '75. I have a 19" Philco-GTE set that was made in April, '81. I think it was one of the very last pre-NAP Philco's.

NAP sets were, for the most part, decent quality up until the late '90's. Then, the quality really went downhill. As with other old brand names, Magnavox is now pretty much just a name slapped on Funai trash.

Oh, and I'm another one that likes the old pot controls. When dealing with on screen adjustments, I often have to think "do I move from one adjustment with the volume or channel buttons". It seems like all sets have a slightly different way of getting around in the menu. Also, many sets do not have a menu button on the set and a remote must be used. Many times, a universal remote will not do the job. An original remote must be used and those are often expensive or NLA.

The chassis in this TV doesn't look like it has anything to do with Philips, the layout is very different, of course a NTSC chassis has to be different from the European PAL ones i'm used to, but 80s Philips designs are always very distinctive anyway.

I of course can be mistaken Kiwick. Not sure now.

I like the knobs and switches as I can do more than one at once and don't have to wait for the on-screen image to go away before I can adjust the next one.

BTW - It might have something to do with the fact that I'm past the half century mark and like the way things were done in the old days.

Regards, Ron

Hi Ron- I'm only 20 and I prefer the old fashioned way too. :yes:

I'm over fifty years old myself (will be 53 in July), and remember well the mechanical tuners, pots, etc. used in older TVs, but to be perfectly honest, I don't miss them (every TV I ever had when I was a kid until I was in my 30s had rotary pot controls and, in all but one of my sets in the '80s, mechanical switch-type and turret tuners). However, time does march on and only goes forward; we will never again, in this age of digital everything, see the likes of mechanical TV tuners and rotary controls. Moreover, the days when one could get a new analog CRT TV are gone as well, for the most part, unless one can find a store that's selling off its inventory of such sets to make room for HD flat panels.

Today's sets with the jungle IC can develop more than just OSD display problems if that chip goes bad, as most of the set's control circuits are on the chip; it all depends on what part of the IC goes. My RCA CTC185 XL-100, for example, developed a problem with its jungle IC after I'd had the set about a year; the technician who repaired the set (for an unrelated problem) told me it would cost at least $100 to replace and reprogram the chip. The warranty had expired by this time, so I decided against the latter and am now using the TV as it is. The set works very well, is in daily use with OTA signals, a VCR and a DVD player, and makes a beautiful picture, so I really don't know to this day (eight years later) what the tech meant when he said part of the jungle IC was defective. Perhaps I'd notice the problem if I were using the set on an antenna, but since I have cable it doesn't show--probably because the cable signal is much stronger than any antenna signal would be in my area.

BTW, I agree with the person who said in a previous post that universal TV remotes often do not control every conceivable function of today's sets, making it almost imperative that the original remote be used if the more exotic functions are desired. Again using my RCA CTC185 as an example, the commercial-skip function only works with the set's original remote; every universal remote I've used with this set (including a GE universal I bought for $5 at Big Lots a couple years ago, and still use today, so I could use one remote for my TV, VCR and DVD) has operated all functions except the commercial skip.

IMHO, it depends on personal preferences. If all one wants is control of basic functions of a TV and/or VCR/DVD, most universals will work just fine. However, for full control of every function available on any of these devices, in most cases the original remote(s) must be used. If the original(s) is/are lost, damaged or quit(s) for any reason, and a universal remote doesn't operate some special functions of your devices, you're out of luck as far as those functions are concerned. Since, as has been noted, many original TV remotes are difficult to find, are NLA (no longer available), or have been lost or broken, as is often the case with some TVs offered for auction on eBay, universal remotes are being used in place of the originals, but the tradeoff is, again, loss of some functions offered by the remote that came with the set. However, many people are just happy to have a remote again (after the original breaks or quits for whatever reason) and could not care less about the lesser-used functions such as commercial skip and the like, so they won't mind that these extra functions may not work with a universal controller. I know at least one person who doesn't use her TV remote for anything but turning the set on/off, adjusting volume and changing channels; she just ignores the rest of the buttons, including mute. A universal remote would suit this person just fine, and would accomodate her VCR and DVD as well.

I'm curious if Philips ever did use a "worldwide" chassis in the US? I recall his being brought up before. NAP was a very high volume manufacturer at one time and so could have very well designed those for here only.

'75 seems to be the most mentioned year for the sale of Magnavox. I have read that the logo change that took place in the 70s had to do with this sale-the older one was "Magnavox" and the newer one "MAGNAVOX" in capitals. I have also read that the old Magnavox company remained as a maker of commercial or industrial equipment and kept the old logo for their use. I know I've seen some "old logo" sets up into the '76-77 era. Apparently when NAP bought that business it moved production from the old Ft. Wayne facilities down to the all new plant in Greeneville, TN. I know the Sylvania plant was in Batavia, NY but I've never seen an indication of where picture tubes were made after the sale. There are a couple people on AK who would know as they worked at (or with) the company at that time. I enjoy reading the history, and like to see that we have the facts straight.

There were at least 2 things that NAP really wanted, that it obtained from buying GTE's consumer electronics division. It got the crt production, and it got the Philco name. As mentioned elsewhere, there was a longstanding agreement that the Philips name could not be used in the USA as it was too similiar to Philco. Once NAP owned the name they could do anything they wanted. NAP never owned the Sylvania name, though...they only licensed it from GTE (which continued using it on lighting and such until it sold that division to Osram). The Sylvania name as used nowadays on consumer electronics is licensed from Osram to Funai or somebody.

The only 80s Philips "world" chassis with NTSC capability i'm aware of is the CTO-N, it was built in the 1983-1985 time frame.

Here's a Philips CTO-N set, model 16CT6425/51S: http://www.marcelstvmuseum.com/photoalbum83.html

as you can see here: http://www.marcelstvmuseum.com/phili...nenkant01.html, the typical Philips chassis layout and passive components (philips always used their own capacitors back then) are totally different from the Magnavox chassis

Take a closer look at the CRT socket board, ALL philips boards carry a Philips "XXXX XXX XXXX X" part code somewhere, You can also see the way the PCB tracks are designed, this is another unique Philips feature

Thanks for that information, bgadow. Very good stuff...I like to hear these stories as well.

Now that I think of it, I am most likely wrong about the chassis being a Philips. I just thought it was their design since they did own Magnavox in '84. The capacitors are NOT branded Philips, they're Nichicons. However, the small horizontal transformer is a Philips and at least one other part I saw also was.

From your pics, Kiwick, the traces on the neckboard do look similar but the chassis layout does not.

I don't have a problem with digital chnl tuning, I'm talking about adjusting the picture quality. I still prefer knobs for that purpose.

52 in July!

Ron

Quick question about the proper setting of the CRT cutoff and Drive controls:

As found, the controls were all down all the way, and the master G2 control was up higher than I'd like.

What I did was increase the blue cutoff a tad since the greyscale was brownish in low-light conditions. I left the RGB drives alone. I also turned the G2 back a little since the brightness pot had plenty of extra gain which wasn't needed.

Now, when there is an exceptionally contrasty raster (like certain commercials) the color gets kind of washed out (yellow, in particular looks kind of lifeless)

I'm going to open the set again and re-do everything. FWIW, I let the set warm up for 30 minutes before adjustments.

Basically, I've set up many tv's before and haven't encountered this phenomenon. Any tips on getting the best possible color picture from this TV? Thanks in advance.

Just a followup: The high voltage was a little low which was probably causing the issue I described above. To set the necessary 2nd anode voltage, it is necessary to meter 130VDC across TP4 while adjusting VR426. That fixed it right up and it looks better than it did. :thmbsp: (FWIW, it was at 124.7VDC originally)

Thought I'd give this thread one final bump now that I have the set right how I want it. It's now connected to digital cable in my bedroom and the pix quality is superb. This tube is very strong for its age.

In these pics you can see zenith2134 with the set. :D Don't mind the hair I have been neglecting to get it cut...also sunglare sucks but I needed the extra light to take the pictures.