I was contacted way back in Dec 2023 about some free sets in Winchester Co, New York. A house needed to be cleared out and they weren't sure what to do with these old TVs.

Turns out they had two 60s color roundies and a B&W set. It's my understanding that when they stopped worked, they were just left as pieces of furniture. The original owner passed in the 80s and his wife went to live with a relative. It appears the house was left untouched for decades.

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53983321386_547b35dae6_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qfjCGs) https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53982430712_a7242f108d_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qff4W1)

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53983754455_a92166f54b_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qfmRra)

These are the photos I was sent.
I passed on the B&W but made arrangements for the color sets.
Finally, after 10 months of waiting, they have arrived!
I'll focus on the GE in this thread and start another for the RCA.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53982401787_63979536fe_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qfeVki)

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53982401777_c0ea03e48a_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qfeVk8)


https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53983724865_293c3efed7_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qfmGCZ)

You can see faint outlines where a sculpture and set top box sat for many years.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53983292956_3151431885_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qfjufh)

Here's a look inside.
21FJP22 work up after a couple minutes and tests like new.
Yoke, degaussing coil and grounding wire were found disconnected.
All the tubes except for horizontal / HV stuff are original GE date late 1964. All test like new.

6JS6, 3A3C and 6EL6 are RCA branded.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53983536658_31f665a45e_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qfkJG3)

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53983724840_216e30d718_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qfmGCy)

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53983605814_f30da4b4c8_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qfm6fo)

Tried a slow power up and quickly realized the is no B+. Only the filaments are getting power. Likely the circuit breaker is shot.

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53983605809_fac3787c82_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qfm6fi)

Trying to pull the chassis right now.

Here's a look inside.
21FJP22 work up after a couple minutes and tests like new.
Yoke, degaussing coil and grounding wire were found disconnected.
All the tubes except for horizontal / HV stuff are original GE date late 1964. All test like new.

6JS6, 3A3C and 6EL6 are RCA branded.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53983536658_31f665a45e_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qfkJG3)

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53983724840_216e30d718_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qfmGCy)

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53983605814_f30da4b4c8_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qfm6fo)

Tried a slow power up and quickly realized the is no B+. Only the filaments are getting power. Likely the circuit breaker is shot.

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53983605809_fac3787c82_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qfm6fi)

Trying to pull the chassis right now.

Also, As you showed in your video, the degaussing coil was unplugged, (plugs into left side of chassis), if this is not plugged in, and the VDR/thermistor combo is bad, it will also kill all power, as it's in line with the breaker, the diode pair seemed rather robust in this set, almost overbuilt, they could go bad, but so far, I have not seen any in the few color sets I have done.

BTW, those chassis clips are a royal pain to get back in there right and tightened down, it's understandable why they were just left in there like that!

BTW, those chassis clips are a royal pain to get back in there right and tightened down, it's understandable why they were just left in there like that!

These things?
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53983973338_59b9606c23_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qfnYv1)

Looks like there was some trouble with the focus pin. Wire is directly soldered to the CRT pin!
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53984163215_e10d987dda_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qfoWWK)

Decided to pull the chassis so I could give it a good look over.
Crazy clean underneath. No obvious signs of any old repairs.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53984045249_1c71182ca7_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qfokSR)

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53983973353_8ffe7bc39c_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qfnYvg)

Yes, the circuit breaker is open. There's also a split bumblebee right across the AC line.

I suspect the thermistor or VDR are bad as well since the degaussing coil was disconnected. Oh yeah, I can see a detached lead in the photo!
Are compatible parts even made anymore?
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53984163190_bbae513762_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qfoWWj)

OK I'm really glad I pulled the chassis now. That terminal in the center of the screen was never soldered!

Are these vintage EM type capacitors plastic film?

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53983807841_362b8f3e90_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qfn8iB)

yes, those clips hold rear of the chassis.

I have this weird feeling of Déjà vu! :D

http://suzaku.live-evil.org/0919202020.jpg

I replaced the entire socket.

http://suzaku.live-evil.org/0928202041a.jpg
And yes, you can still get them.
https://talonelectronics.com has many that will work, not exact but will work, sold in pairs. and they can be found in other places.

OK I'm really glad I pulled the chassis now. That terminal in the center of the screen was never soldered!

Are these vintage EM type capacitors plastic film?

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53983807841_362b8f3e90_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qfn8iB)

Looks like C146 & C147 Think they are just standard orange drop film, they should be OK, id they did not burn.

I think Chester electronics in Kenosha still stocks thermistor pairs.

I think Chester electronics in Kenosha still stocks thermistor pairs.

He's also gonna have to most likely replace the focus diode, and the boost diode, But I forgot which one you suggested to use. :(

2 in series i believe.

He's also gonna have to most likely replace the focus diode, and the boost diode, But I forgot which one you suggested to use. :(

2 in series i believe.

This. https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Rectron/R5000F-B?qs=QwfNnbSFhLlLTK%252BIClpyBQ%3D%3D

You probably can make do with one, but on sets where focus range touches or especially if it exceeds 5KV I tend to use a series pair for added safety.

Yeah, i was having brightness and focus stability problems so I pulled the chassis for the umpteenth time and replaced diodes, as well as the matched pair of 1.5 meg resistors R137/138 on the 6BK4, and it helped a lot!

WOW, that circuit breaker seems rather impossible to find at the needed rating for this set.
But the one for the CTC-15 is out there.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/393284894216
It hopefully should work, if you can't find the right one.

I don't have a screen shot (maybe someone does) but I think that GE is like the set MR. Ed won and kept moving it from Wilbur's living room to his stall.

I was able to get the circuit breaker working with some deoxit. I also have a few used but good breakers.

I'm not sure how the rating works for these.
This set pulls about 3 amps, but I see a lot of breakers label "hold 2.1A". What exactly does that mean? Seems like they are undersized?

I was able to get the circuit breaker working with some deoxit. I also have a few used but good breakers.

I'm not sure how the rating works for these.
This set pulls about 3 amps, but I see a lot of breakers label "hold 2.1A". What exactly does that mean? Seems like they are undersized?

It is a bit confusing, from what I understand, they are all slow acting, there is the sustained “hold at” rating, and the trip at rating, but it is never clear what the trip rating is, or how long it must be at or over that threshold for it to trip.

I remember dissecting a bad one a long time ago when I was in High School to see how it worked, it has a bimetal contact that's reset by the button, and wrapped around that is a heater wire that has the current running through it.
And, yes, the contacts do burn and fail often.

this is WAY too big, gotta wonder what it's for, but it is the only one i see with both ratings on it, hold and trip.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/303267481171?_nkw=TV+Circuit+Breaker&epid=727545790&itmmeta=01J7EARQJT10M4RE12N2CJM94Y&hash=item469c268653:g:6ZwAAOSwzlFdZqIT&itmprp=enc%3AAQAJAAAA0HoV3kP08IDx%2BKZ9MfhVJKlJqVF XtEmd8AvcxrEeowm2bmPhB4BNx8CgD51B40vGEXxqDHNI4tAxA lHVewgxWxFWFzJReOoqN4b6GSZ6%2BskRYyRim9TB6BLvxyZ1D r1ngU3YbvcNHs9sgEhyttu1A9bw%2FhU8Rk6xKADUKtGYhZ3bA lOfkD29KLhfrlNj1i7sHkoDghjuSeB2u0ew9OUhD9ehKW02azw wZFcuMYepcloy%2F9JCadUbxSnoAxr3gykeqsG1%2Bw9TzuDFl 9iUi%2Btx%2FzM%3D%7Ctkp%3ABk9SR8D54sq7ZA

I also got one of these to fix the burned focus connector.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/225235664833

Thanks for the links. Just realized I'm being stupid. The breaker is not whole the whole set - it's only for the B+ supply! The filament supply is fused separately. The common 2.1 amp hold type is probably fine.

There is one way to see how much the draw is, including surge, if the breaker is holding, just AC amp measure with peaking across the faulty / removed thermistor, that should give some idea what kind of breaker hold/trip will work.

FOUND ONE!:banana:

but it's with 2 lesser ones.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/315321107869

tip point 3.25 amps.

I have the chassis pulled. Can't power anything without putting it all back together. Sames does list it as a 3.1 amp breaker.

I have the chassis pulled. Can't power anything without putting it all back together. Sames does list it as a 3.1 amp breaker.

that's the only listing for a LITTELFUSE CIRCUIT BREAKER 8153.25, which Sames lists as a replacement I can find.
So I guess it's hold at 3a or so which seems high to me and trip at 3.25 amps.

Get it while you can! :)

Parts have been ordered. Meanwhile spot checked a bunch of resistors and caps. All are well within spec. Well, except that 0.047 across the AC line. It's very leaky and in the trash.

I measure about 120 ohms cold on the damaged thermistor. That got me thinking a CL-90 might be a good replacement. It can handle 2A and is 120 cold and about 4 ohms hot.

What do you guys think?

I measure about 120 ohms cold on the damaged thermistor. That got me thinking a CL-90 might be a good replacement. It can handle 2A and is 120 cold and about 4 ohms hot.

What do you guys think?

It should work. You can always try and see, with the vintage combos sold, they always show the cold rating, but rarely the hot.

Does anyone know the significance of white tipped tubes?
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53992379103_5b1e229308_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qg84eZ)

I have seen that a few times before, not sure why it's done. :O

I've seen red and yellow tipped tubes before too...No clue what it means.

See if they look like original tubes. Manufacturers could mark them to identify them if they were part of a warranty claim. Just a thought.

From a thread at the Antique Radios forum;

"Painted tops" (usually exhaust tips on miniature tubes) did indeed represent "selected tubes."

Tomer relates the entire story in his book, Getting the Most Out of Vacuum Tubes (Gernsback, 1960). The practice was very common among older B&W TV sets. You'll often see tubes with their exhaust tips daubed in what looks like red or white paint. Many circuits "skated the rim" as far as workability went, and without the cream of the tubes plugged into them, they'd give trouble. When the cream of the tubes began to age out, they gave trouble anyhow.

With audio output tubes, I'd agree that they were tested for precise matching if used in the output of Baldwin electronic organ amplifiers. If used for other purposes (tone generator oscillators maybe?) in other parts of the circuit, they may have been tested for other qualities.

Interesting. They are only in the VHF tuner.

Gave the chassis a good look over and found no more problems. Crazy how pristine it is. Really want to minimize replacing parts.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53997323218_d65b14d4e8_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qgyoXm)

Here it is after a bit of cleaning. Axial electrolytic and two white ElMenco caps have been replaced. Also replaced the thermistor.
Will resume trying to reform the original caps with a slow power up.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53996212962_93c70beff9_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qgsGV1)

The right hand side of R204 needs attention it looks like, where the red wire is hooked, Terminal block looks dark, as does the resistor lead, i replaced the entire thing on mine, new Terminal block with a 20w resistor

no where near as bad a mine was! :P
http://suzaku.live-evil.org/burned.jpg

I also got one of these to fix the burned focus connector.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/225235664833

MUCH better eBay deal:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/125551787795 (NO relation or affiliation, just on my watchlist for spares for my 2 roundies.) I have one socket and jig M-F 28" extension for 70 degree tubes, so probably won't ever need a spare....

BTW, never buy from Moyers on eBay. Better prices when you call them and deal direct. I'd bet their socket would be $5 less over the phone, but you can't avoid their $9 shipping....

Does anyone know the significance of white tipped tubes?
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53992379103_5b1e229308_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qg84eZ)

QA marks - proof that the tubes are installed after the tuner mounting assembly is installed in the cabinet. Much easier to shine a light and see two white (or yellow if Magnavox) tips than to reach in for a feel. Some Conn organs did the same with an orangish, almost fluorescent paint on the tips of some "voice" tubes and wire ties in the back recesses. The block on the QA final tag was also colored orange for their stamp.

(blessed to have had a PTS location about 1 mile from Dad's shop.....learned a ton from their youngest tech - I thought it was a PTS thing that many of their test RF amp and mixer tubes had painted tips, but they educated me on the QA thing.)

Interesting. They are only in the VHF tuner.

Gave the chassis a good look over and found no more problems. Crazy how pristine it is. Really want to minimize replacing parts.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53997323218_d65b14d4e8_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qgyoXm)

Here it is after a bit of cleaning. Axial electrolytic and two white ElMenco caps have been replaced. Also replaced the thermistor.
Will resume trying to reform the original caps with a slow power up.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53996212962_93c70beff9_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qgsGV1)

Just for assurances, we always changed the cap that couples the drive from the horizontal oscillator plate to the HOT grid. Saves tubes, prevents callbacks, and extends flyback life. Any good brand polypropylene cap of same value voltage will do. This goes for any RCA or RCA clone set like yours.

A last thought on breakers. We used mallorys. Had a complete
line of single & doubles. There was also a sub book. I bet
its out there.

Zeno:smoke:

The right hand side of R204 needs attention it looks like, where the red wire is hooked, Terminal block looks dark, as does the resistor lead, i replaced the entire thing on mine, new Terminal block with a 20w resistor

no where near as bad a mine was! :P
http://suzaku.live-evil.org/burned.jpg

Looks OK to me and measures dead on.

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53999593156_f8fcc2534d_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qgL2Jd) https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53999832708_b57c0d811e_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qgMfWq)

Looks OK to me and measures dead on.

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53999593156_f8fcc2534d_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qgL2Jd) https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53999832708_b57c0d811e_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qgMfWq)

So did mine, but it's a high stress point, due to the heat and oxidation, it will fail sooner or later, not quite as bad as the bleeder nets in the old RCA BW types, but you may want to deal with it now while you have the chassis out, then having to do it again a year or so later, cause due to the heat involved, it will go at some time in the future.

And a new terminal block which I'm sure you have on hand, + this, https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Ohmite/B20J12K5E?qs=6lLyInCrgsnH2LTE%252Bhysvw%3D%3D is worth the investment to having to put it apart later if you can avoid it, :)

Consider it preventive maintenance, all color sets seem to have a 18+ watt resistor in them in the voltage divider, winch always seems to roast the resistor and the tie points, I always make it a point to replace these with slightly higher wattage ones and new terminal blocks when I re-cap, even if they check OK, cause I don't want to be bitten by it later.

But the choice is ultimately your of course. :)
Going over my old pics, before I replaced the old one, it blew out my IR camera at over 400F, which is what prompted me to put in the 20w, which ran quite cooler.

Here we go again with no HOT or damper. About 5 volts every 10 minutes. So far so good.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54000070588_6e0b1b559b_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qgNtDN)

...And a new terminal block which I'm sure you have on hand...

Why would I replace the terminal strip? It's pristine.

Why would I replace the terminal strip? It's pristine.

I could not see it very clearly. :tears:

mine was toasted! :yes:

I see (feel) what you mean now that I've gotten it up to full power!

Spent a couple hours reforming them caps without incident. Then popped the remaining tubes in and went for it.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54000564951_4259a6dd1d_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qgR1Bi)

Yes! We have raster. You can really tell when the HV kicks in!
Now I can also see just how bad that cataract is. No way you could watch the set like this.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54000886944_5f12464f05_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qgSEjU)

Hooked up a cheapo portable B&K pattern generator and got these after fooling around with the controls.
Obviously some vertical issues but it's stable.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54000564921_3ca8822616_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qgR1AM)

Color isn't so hot, but I'm not trusting this generator. I'll use a better one later.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53999669777_11f86e120e_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qgLqvg)

Now for a converter box. No sound and only B&W at first.
Eventually, I discovered I had to tune off station to get sound and color.
Not sure what that is about. Tuner issues? IF needs alignment?
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54000564916_c24c7c7c9d_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qgR1AG)

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53999669772_0dfa51f725_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qgLqvb)

The breaker is popping about every five minutes even current draw is fine. Definitely, need to swap it out. I'll take all the advice above as well and order up some more parts.

Off to a good start I think.

Video IF looks good from what can be seen through the cataract. :D:banana:

For sound, most tune in the best pic, and them adjust the sound IF coils for best audio.

Most of the time this can be done by ear, but sometimes, it's best to follow the Audio IF steps laid out in the SAMS.

I also have no color if I tune in for best pic though. I'm right on the edge of losing everything in these screenshots.

I also have no color if I tune in for best pic though. I'm right on the edge of losing everything in these screenshots.

For that the color AFC setup helps, symptoms of that being off is poor color lock, or rainbow (barber pole effect). symptoms if bad video IF would be bleeding color mostly reds, that is especially seen when you fine tune, this of course goes hand in hand with the chroma bandpass. My guess is that it just needs a touch up on color AFC and sound IF.
unless someone really messed with it :(

Tuner tubes are fine. Malloy circuit breaker, new CRT socket, polypropylene caps and a beefy power resistor have been ordered.

I'm hoping it hasn't been messed with. It's the sound being so far off that really surprised me. None at all until the station is almost tuned out. Usually with intercarrier sets you get at least some sound throughout the fine tuning range.

The sound has always been a bit weird with these with DVD/VHS/LD input vs converter box, you seem to get great sound on one, then get crap when you change to a converter box, then tweak it to work great with a converter box, then the sound sucks on DVD/VHS/LD input, if you have a DVD/VHS/LD input source, you may want to try that to see if the sound acts any better before any adjustments.

Those mystery white elenco capacitors, (.001) one of them is C70, on the plate of the vertical output, and is having the hell beat out of it, and may be the source of the lack of full sweep, along with C4.

Looks a lot like RCA but those compactrons say some General Electric.
Is the color circuit a crystal ringing GE or RCA circuit?

Looks a lot like RCA but those compactrons say some General Electric.
Is the color circuit a crystal ringing GE or RCA circuit?

It's a clone of a RCA-CTC 15, with extensive modifications all over the set, even a few hints of Zenith tossed in here and there.
The color circuit looks to be RCA, the horizontal oscillator, seems to be Zenith.

Curiously, all the tubes are GE except the horizontal output, HV rectifier and shunt regulator being RCA.

New CRT socket, HV polypropylene caps, power resistor etc have arrived.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54016469508_84d7063397_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qifwtN)

Still waiting on the NOS circuit breaker to arrive. Hppefully, tomorrow. The current one consistently pops after less than a minute of power.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54015301612_52db80b27e_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qi9xiE)

Curiously, all the tubes are GE except the horizontal output, HV rectifier and shunt regulator being RCA.

New CRT socket, HV polypropylene caps, power resistor etc have arrived.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54016469508_84d7063397_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qifwtN)

Still waiting on the NOS circuit breaker to arrive. Hppefully, tomorrow. The current one consistently pops after less than a minute of power.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54015301612_52db80b27e_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qi9xiE)

I kept the bum socket from mine to use to test tubes later, as I had none with my crt tester, just a universal connector with crappy leads. :tears:

I do have the proper adapter with my CR70. Finally had a chance to use it!

Here's a portion of the color circuit.

Quite surprised to see the sound is picked off after the 3rd IF stage making it a sort of split carrier set. No wonder the sound is off. Should be fairly easy to tweak assume the cores aren't frozen.
Full PDF copy of the SAMS https://drive.google.com/file/d/1-XOB_mHR_eamzs-rLXQK5BX8p12AjkDC/view?usp=sharing

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54016701150_dbb671b5ac_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qigHkC)

Not a split-carrier - note the sound IF detector X8, whose purpose is to produce the 4.5 MHz intercarrier. This allows the 4.5 MHz in the video path to be strongly attenuated, to prevent 900 kHz chroma/sound beat patterns in the picture.

That's what I meant by sort of. It's not taking the sound after the video detector like other intercarrier sets.

I still wouldn't call it "sort of" split carrier. "Split carrier" is used too often as the code words to refer to the fine tuning problems that split carrier sets have as opposed to intercarrier.

Maybe "dual detector " or "intercarrier with separate sound detector."

Semantics aside, this set does have the same problem that split carrier sets have. There is no sound at all until I adjust the fine tuning to the point where the image almost disappears.

It's all a bit too confusing to me!:D

Sounds (no pun intended) like it have misaligment... I have seen some intercarrier sets with this behaviour.

Sounds (no pun intended) like it have misaligment... I have seen some intercarrier sets with this behaviour.

As I mentioned a while back, the dreaded “Intercarrier Buzz” is horrid with these sets, and much more pronounced with video sourced from cable boxes and digital stuff vs DVD or VHS, which I guess is due to the way they have the video assembled with scrolling text an such, found this out by testing and debugging/ adjusting with a DVD source via rf modulator, getting the sound perfect, only to see it was GARBAGE with the cable box, then I re-adjust for best sound on the cable box, can never get rid of the buzz fully, NOW it's crappy on the DVD source? WTH?

So, it seems that the fussy sets for audio are particulary sensitive to the different sources. I bet some difference in the video response plays havoc here (or even the quality of modulation), besides the video format. A slight HF freq. difference between the sources and it interacts more or less with the intercarrier.

Alright, let's see what we can do about the cataract.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54081310851_f65e917625_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qoYRxZ)

Took loads of reference photos and pulled everything off the neck.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54081770610_e80aa015f7_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qp2ddS)

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54081637844_7208107f9f_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qp1wKN)

Trying a heat lamp for starters. Cataract seems to be growing after 30 minutes.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54081770605_33ae3532c0_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qp2ddM)

After the CRT face was toasty from the heat lamp, I switch to a heat gun. You can see it start to separate as it reached the critical temperature.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54081569501_5aec985ae8_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qp1brt)

Yummy.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54081820158_0cab539635_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qp2sX9)

Piece of cake. Now the fun part - cleaning and reattaching the glass
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54081569506_e5072e1dd4_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qp1bry)

After a bit a cleaning. Any advice on the type of adhesive to secure the glass back on?
I'm thinking silicone

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54081888473_54e1cf7414_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qp2PfZ)

Congratulations! :banana:
You now know the horrid smell of replacing an RCA type safety glass!
There are no words to describe it! :scratch2:

After a bit a cleaning. Any advice on the type of adhesive to secure the glass back on?
I'm thinking silicone

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54081888473_54e1cf7414_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qp2PfZ)

See this video parts 6 and 7.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fp7mg9VbUpw
where tape is used. Doug did a roundy for me this way and it worked very well.

Also look for posts on this topic on Videokarma.

Got it. I followed Doug's technique for removing the lens. Hadn't watch the last few episodes.
So just tape is all that's needed. I can handle that :)

Test fit with the cleaned lens. I'll pick up some 3M tape tomorrow.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54084333356_741b4b8928_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qpfm39)

BTW there was almost no odor. I wonder if it is related to the temperature? I got it just hot enough to separate.

BTW there was almost no odor. I wonder if it is related to the temperature? I got it just hot enough to separate.

Bob, have you ever worked on a Channel Master rebuilt tube? I have one that is NOS. I have to remove the safety glass but it seems to be very solid. Just wondering if they are essentially the same. I live in Florida and was going to sit it out in the sun and try that.

Thanks for your advice.

Nope. I'm not sure if they would have replaced the safety glass when it was rebuilt.
I don't think just the sun will be quite hot enough. I had to use a heat gun on high.

BTW there was almost no odor. I wonder if it is related to the temperature? I got it just hot enough to separate.

The RCA we did (21fjp22a) had a very pungent chemical smell to it, that was even noticeable when done outside, the same was noticed with rectangle tubes that had the same type of boding material, however the gummy type in the Zenith bonds did not really stink so much as the RCA.

You could always look up the EIA code on the tube, there should be one to find exactly who made it.

I believe the safety glass must be removed when rebuilding, as the bonding material would not survive the oven temperature.

IIRC, the rebuilt tube I bought from Scotty had no safety glass, but that was OK as I was using it in the CTC-5 until I could get a 21AX. Then when I got the 21AX, Doug helped remove the glass from a dud glass tube with a cataract and put it on the rebuilt tube.

I don't recall any strong smell on the Zenith tube that Doug did for me.

At the risk of derailing this thread, sorry, maybe I should practice on the original RCA 25XP22 that's in the set. The replacement is a 25AP22.

Your thoughts, guys?

Speaking of Scotty. as far as I know, Shango is using his method here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6hGd_ZPaqY

At the risk of derailing this thread, sorry, maybe I should practice on the original RCA 25XP22 that's in the set. The replacement is a 25AP22.

Your thoughts, guys?

The rectangle tubes will always be a higher risk than the round ones, that being said, how you do it still depends on the type, If it's RCA, you need heat or soak it in water for a very VERY long time, or if it's the green gummy Zenith, a heated wire is used to cut through it.

I had a friend who worked at Video Display Corporation in Georgia. He once told me the tubes were heated up and the safety glass removed on all tubes before rebuilding. Most of the tubes they sold had a tension band installed, but for an additional fee they would laminate a glass back on to the tube instead. I got several of these tubes from them because I wanted the original tinted "frosted" look.

Question for the group. Can you safely leave the yoke and convergence stuff on the neck while removing a cataract?
I removed it from this one as I was concerned about damage but now I'm wondering if I could have left it alone?

Question for the group. Can you safely leave the yoke and convergence stuff on the neck while removing a cataract?
I removed it from this one as I was concerned about damage but now I'm wondering if I could have left it alone?

Yes you can, however is self defeating as you will need to do the convergence and purity setup anyway when you are done after no mater what, and on the round tubes, the static magnets are a bit more fragile then the later ones used on the rectangle ones, so most just take it off, but i have left them on for rectangle ones, removed them on round.

OK. I would think if one was careful not to disturb anything on the neck, the convergence and purity would still be pretty good.

That's correct, relatively speaking, but any changes will have subtle effects on the final setup, for example, N,W,S E, final positioning of the set will have sight effects on purity and convergence, get it perfect in one position, turn it 90 degrees, or 120, it's no no longer quite as exact, this may not matter to the average viewer, but to those who spend hours with a magnifying glass getting convergence as spot on as they can, it does.
And as Old Tv Nut pointed out a while back, do anything that causes a noticeable change to vertical height / linearity, like a new oscillator / output, or resistors / caps in the vertical area, going through the setup procedure is unavoidable once the set is at it's final location to get best picture, no matter if you had the parts off or not, but, it will make it a bit easier to keep them on, yes.

In my experience if adjustment looks fine from 10' away and you don't like to press your eyeballs to the glass leaving the neck hardware one will allow you to skip redoing the setup an be unnoticeable from before the work.

In my experience if adjustment looks fine from 10' away and you don't like to press your eyeballs to the glass leaving the neck hardware one will allow you to skip redoing the setup an be unnoticeable from before the work.

As i mentioned before :D
I'm severely nearsighted, and my glasses cause very bad chromatic aberration, so i do setup w/o them with my face 3 inches from the screen!
And it has ALWAYS bugged me if it was not as perfect as I could get it, so I often spend 2 hours or longer going round and round till it's as close as I can get it, I have done this since High School days! :yes:

Two pieces of this 3M tape are the same thickness of the original bonding agent. I placed them near the edge in six places then applied a bead of silicone.
I'll left that sit overnight and reassemble tomorrow.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54091289848_7017b695df_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qpRZXE)

Silicone instead of packing tape on the edge?

Congratz on your first one! :banana:

At least you did not have to deal with a secondary CAT-A-Ract, like I did the first time! :D

https://imgur.com/Cub0Mxk

Yeah i posted this before!
He's a brat!

Silicone instead of packing tape on the edge?

I'll use tape as well once the silicone sets up. Just in case there are any tiny gaps.

Congratz on your first one! :banana:

At least you did not have to deal with a secondary CAT-A-Ract, like I did the first time! :D

https://imgur.com/Cub0Mxk

Yeah i posted this before!
He's a brat!

LOL, thanks. No, but I did have to deal with a stray dog hair or two.

I don't have a screen shot (maybe someone does) but I think that GE is like the set MR. Ed won and kept moving it from Wilbur's living room to his stall. +1 I saw that episode and agree!

Looks pretty good to me. Now the real fun begins.
Finish the chassis overhaul, put it all back together and deal with convergence.

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54095546139_b8e49791d8_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qqePcZ)

I put all the stuff back on the neck as best I could and popped the chassis back in.
Still have more work to do on it, but I'm anxious to see how the CRT looks.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54098307698_63ec0832d2_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qqtY85)

Crap! No idea how this happened. RIP 6JS6C
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54098391614_c8344c5375_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qqup4U)

Installed a used, weak one. Takes a while to get full horizontal deflection, but it's alive gain.

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54098510510_bd3c48c1cc_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qqv1pQ)

Looks like I didn't screw up the convergence too badly.
New circuit breaker is working fine, but all the other issues remain.
Lack of vertical height, poor linearity, very dirty volume control, etc.
I'll tackle all that stuff next.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54097192392_18b41f1e7d_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qqofzE)

:tears::tears:Damn. those tubes are not cheap! Thanks to the audio nuts!

:tears::tears:Damn. those tubes are not cheap! Thanks to the audio nuts!

I've had decent luck getting them for under $10 at antique radio swapmeets. Radio collectors typically don't use TV tubes, don't consider them valuable and don't bother eBay searching value...

I have a spare or two. Mostly I'm bummed because it was original like all the other tubes (and worked fine).

I don't remember for sure right now, but I think I have a 6hf5 in mine right now.

just for the hell of it, and it is the season!

Here is mine, from 4 years ago.




https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C6OedtbldkQ

:tears::tears:Damn. those tubes are not cheap! Thanks to the audio nuts!

The CB freaks get most of the blame on those. Horizontal sweep tubes were widely used in illegal CB linear amps through the '70s and '80s. They were typically overdriven, and went through them really fast....

The CB freaks get most of the blame on those. Horizontal sweep tubes were widely used in illegal CB linear amps through the '70s and '80s. They were typically overdriven, and went through them really fast....

"Foot Warmers"
But it was not until audiophiles started to use them in amps did the supply really drop and the prices REALLY start to go up.

Speaking of foot warmers.... I worked for an electronic manufacturer in the 1980s which did not allow individual heaters to keep personnel warm. Instead, the secretaries got us to place Tektronix 545 tube oscilloscopes in the cutouts of their desks. It kept them warm all winter. However, the company still had the oscilloscopes (heaters) re-calibrated on the normal schedule. Finally, in the late 1980s, they offered these oscilloscopes to the technical staff. I managed to snag a calibrated 547 with 1A1 and 1A7 plug-ins. Still have it.

Speaking of foot warmers.... I worked for an electronic manufacturer in the 1980s which did not allow individual heaters to keep personnel warm. Instead, the secretaries got us to place Tektronix 545 tube oscilloscopes in the cutouts of their desks. It kept them warm all winter. However, the company still had the oscilloscopes (heaters) re-calibrated on the normal schedule. Finally, in the late 1980s, they offered these oscilloscopes to the technical staff. I managed to snag a calibrated 547 with 1A1 and 1A7 plug-ins. Still have it.

Model 545 foot warmers! :D

Yeah, that's one heck of a resistor you showed off there in your video! :D
L100J2K0E

2k 100w :banana:

Lucky that you have the gear to do the chroma bandpass alignment.

You mean this little guy? Sure beats have the horizontal output tube running and HV crackling.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54321813381_9e1ce1566b_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qLeuzk)

You mean this little guy? Sure beats have the horizontal output tube running and HV crackling.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/54321813381_9e1ce1566b_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2qLeuzk)

It's not so much having the HV present and the hazards it causes, it's the horizontal pulses that are the problem if I remember, the chroma bandpass amp is tied to the lower coil on the FBT, via a 120 pf cap, and with those pulses there, it will make it quite impossible to plot the curve of the amp, thus it's shut off for adjustment, as far as I know.

:tears::tears:Damn. those tubes are not cheap! Thanks to the audio nuts!

You can point to certain sellers on the internet who are outright ripping people off, but if people keep buying from them the problem will continue. If you need tubes contact me, I have lots of tubes and other parts I've acquired over the years, I used to be service manager at an RCA parts distributor here in SOUTH BEND.

How is it ripping people off if they buy a product for the listed price and received it? That's capitalism.
Now if they didn't get what they paid for, that's another matter. Like all the counterfeit semiconductors flooding the secondary market.

How is it ripping people off if they buy a product for the listed price and received it? That's capitalism.
Now if they didn't get what they paid for, that's another matter. Like all the counterfeit semiconductors flooding the secondary market.

Hear, hear, Bob. Just because someone doesn't like it doesn't make it wrong or illegal.

RCA distributor that existed in Harrisburg picked up and moved 40 years ago, now they "distribute" HVAC equipment. If only we knew where that stock of parts went:scratch2:

My "local source" is Moyers Electronics, surely is not predatory as some of these tube sellers are, try them for any RCA part number within reason, that is to say: they are out of many common flybacks, yokes and CRT's. The Pottsville store has every cable or jack Ill ever need, tools galore.

Moyers in Sunbury has many surprises like a NOS $25 output transformer for an RCA RS177 PP 6BQ5 amp. Try finding THAT deal on the internet. Every Sams set, IF trans, or vertical blocking transformer I have ever needed was found as a Merit or Ram, many other coils etc that you might otherwise not find.

RCA distributor that existed in Harrisburg picked up and moved 40 years ago, now they "distribute" HVAC equipment. If only we knew where that stock of parts went:scratch2:

My "local source" is Moyers Electronics, surely is not predatory as some of these tube sellers are, try them for any RCA part number within reason, that is to say: they are out of many common flybacks, yokes and CRT's. The Pottsville store has every cable or jack Ill ever need, tools galore.

Moyers in Sunbury has many surprises like a NOS $25 output transformer for an RCA RS177 PP 6BQ5 amp. Try finding THAT deal on the internet. Every Sams set, IF trans, or vertical blocking transformer I have ever needed was found as a Merit or Ram, many other coils etc that you might otherwise not find.

There used to be two places like that here, a RCA distributor, and a electronics salvage warehouse that had just about everything at decent prices, both long gone.

The point I was making, before this vintage audio craze fired up and all these people seemed to jump on the tube amp bandwagon, there was no 12AX7s being sold for $300-$600, and so on, and you could find horizontal output tubes at decent prices, not hundreds of dollars, for NOS ones, this is nuts, if one had a DeLorean, you could go back 20 years or so and fill it tubes and come back and make millions!