Greetings everyone, I was browsing around on FB Marketplace and spotted a Panasonic Omnivision 4-Head Hi-Fi VCR model PV-1730 from 1984 (from what I could see of the date of manufacture on the back) and its in really good cosmetic condition yet, but electronically I'm not sure of the operating condition (the person I bought it from said that it works but who knows what that means, because I know a lot of the Panasonic VCRs from this time period can have issues with the idler tires being bad which will allow them to rewind and F.Forward, but not necessarily play or if they do play, they play slower than they should.)

Anyways I know some of you guys on here have had some experience with this model or other similar models and I was wondering how this VCR Compared to Panasonic's later Hi-Fi Models from the late 80s and early 90s as far as repairability and usability goes.

Thanks for your help.

I looked at three of that model back in 1993 and '94 but for very minor problems like a loose RF input jack and "the remote doesn't work" (so, I put batteries in it). :)

Is the FCC ID# on the rear panel shown as ACJ927033A? If so, I can't cross that model to any others because I haven't seen any other models (of any brand) with that ID#. And, after 25 years the memory banks have run dry. Sorry...

I believe so, I'm not sure though as the photos in the listing didn't have any close-up shots of the ID tag on the back.

I just know that from what little I could find in my research, Sylvania (N. A. P.), Magnavox (the same company as Sylvania), and GE (maybe others I'm missing as well) used their own versions of this model (they had different front panel arrangements.)

Oh, sorry, I thought you were in possession of it.

Yes, there may well be some very similar crosses but I never really knew my Panasonic model numbers well and would mostly rely on FCC ID#'s.

Idler tires shouldn't be too big of a problem. However, there WERE power supply capacitors that were going bad even 20 years ago so I would factor in replacing many/most/all in the secondary of the power supply when you get it.

Other than that and a few belts (and loose RF input jacks?) they were pretty solid and reliable machines.

Oh, sorry, I thought you were in possession of it.

Yes, there may well be some very similar crosses but I never really knew my Panasonic model numbers well and would mostly rely on FCC ID#'s.

Idler tires shouldn't be too big of a problem. However, there WERE power supply capacitors that were going bad even 20 years ago so I would factor in replacing many/most/all in the secondary of the power supply when you get it.

Other than that and a few belts (and loose RF input jacks?) they were pretty solid and reliable machines.

Ok, that's good to hear, the reason why I mentioned the idler tires was because I've worked on/owned a few Panasonic Linear Stereo VCRs from the same time period that did have idler tire issues (the VCRs played, rewound and fast forwarded, but when they played they had a tendency to eat tapes and when they rewind they would stall half-way through a 2+ hour tape, and fast forward was virtually non-existent speed wise.

If I recall correctly there are no belts or idler tires in the PV-1730 (other than belt on the FL mechanism). Reels are direct drive. If I could find a pic with the lid off I could verify. Biggest issue with those was the head cylinder bearing wearing out causing the upper cylinder to wobble when it spins.

When they came out I would have bought one except no MTS stereo tuner.

If I recall correctly there are no belts or idler tires in the PV-1730 (other than belt on the FL mechanism). Reels are direct drive. If I could find a pic with the lid off I could verify. Biggest issue with those was the head cylinder bearing wearing out causing the upper cylinder to wobble when it spins.

When they came out I would have bought one except no MTS stereo tuner.

Ok, thanks for the info, I think for my purposes (since we don't have analog TV signals anymore) it will work fine because all I need is the Hi-Fi audio for the video tape playback.

Ok, thanks for the info, I think for my purposes (since we don't have analog TV signals anymore) it will work fine because all I need is the Hi-Fi audio for the video tape playback.

As long as the drum bearing is good. You're out of luck if it isn't.

Similar mechanism was used in portables PV-8000 (non hi-fi) and PV-9000 (hi-fi).

I saw Quasar, Sylvania, Magnavox and GE branded versions of the PV-1730 back in the day.

If I recall correctly there are no belts or idler tires in the PV-1730 (other than belt on the FL mechanism). Reels are direct drive. If I could find a pic with the lid off I could verify. Biggest issue with those was the head cylinder bearing wearing out causing the upper cylinder to wobble when it spins.

When they came out I would have bought one except no MTS stereo tuner.

My Panasonic PV-4022 VCR has only one belt as well. However, if that belt breaks (or if anything else goes wrong with the VCR), I will simply store the machine and forget it, as most of the programs I have on VHS are also on DVD these days (I have an LG BP-220 DVD player which works very well). I have perhaps 60 DVDs now; the discs are generally older TV shows from the 1970s, so I have little or no use for my VCR anymore.

BTW, because television is now 100 percent digital, meaning today's ATSC TV signals cannot be recorded on NTSC standard VCRs, and because VHS video tape is a relic of the past in this day and age, VCRs are all but useless except to play back previously recorded cassettes. I honestly do not believe VCRs can be used for recording, even if connected to a cable box, again because of the incompatible video standards (an NTSC VCR cannot record or play back ATSC video). If there is a way to record ATSC video using an NTSC VCR, I would be amazed.

NTSC VCRs were phased out by ATSC video when the latter came into widespread use; because of that, NTSC VCRs, as I said, cannot record modern ATSC video under any circumstances. If there are any converters or other schemes available to allow an older VCR to record today's ATSC digital video, I am not aware of them yet. In fact I don't think such adapters will ever be made since, as I said, NTSC video is obsolete. The same thing happened with television when the standards were changed from analog to digital a decade ago, although in the beginning cable operators could connect a user's TV to cable through a converter box.

I don't think cable companies even offer that option any longer, and in fact cable boxes themselves are, or may be, obsolete (if they are not already). I have what Spectrum refers to as "streaming" video service, which does not use a cable box; I use a Roku device (Roku 2), which I own outright, to receive their programming. In fact, I believe these devices may be replacing traditional cable boxes, meaning cable subscribers may not need to pay for a cable box any longer. My cable bill is just under $30 a month (for TV service), with two additional charges for Internet and home telephone service; in fact, Spectrum now informs me (as of a few months ago) I no longer have traditional cable service, since I have their "streaming" video service. I will not return to any kind of standard cable, as I do not want an additional charge on my bill for a cable box. My bill is high enough as it is, with the three services I mentioned, and, being a senior citizen on a fixed income, I do not want to spend any more money than I absolutely have to for TV services.

My Panasonic PV-4022 VCR has only one belt as well.
That would be the Matsushita "G" chassis or some later incarnation... one belt on the bottom driven by the capstan motor that does it all with a solenoid that shifted modes. Compared to the chassis used in the PV-1730 VCR in question with separate direct-drive motors for supply & take-up reels, capstan, and DC motor with belt for the front loader.

I'm sure most people use VCRs to playback old tapes. You can record analog NTSC to a VCR from a DTV converter box if you don't mind the huge degradation in picture quality or are using an older analog TV. Myself I use a DTVPal DVR to record ATSC TV channels nowadays.

If I recall correctly there are no belts or idler tires in the PV-1730 (other than belt on the FL mechanism). Reels are direct drive. --snip--

--snip-- Compared to the chassis used in the PV-1730 VCR in question with separate direct-drive motors for supply & take-up reels, capstan, and DC motor with belt for the front loader.
AH, YES! The 5 motor beast! Of, course. And, that was a few years before MTS, wasn't it?

Good luck friend, I spent over a month working on the PV-1430 earlier this year, but from what I'm reading, a lot of the mechanisms are different on your model.

AH, YES! The 5 motor beast! Of, course. And, that was a few years before MTS, wasn't it?

MTS came to be in late 1984. The Panasonic 1730 missed MTS by about a year. At the time I ended up buying a Mitsubishi HS-430UR with MTS which was both Hi-Fi and linear stereo with Dolby for backward compatibility with my older non-Hi-Fi stereo tapes I had recorded on other linear stereo machines I had owned (Panasonic NV-8200, PV-6000, PV-1780) off of cable using FM stereo radio as the audio source.

I got the VCR today, and it looks nearly mint (it looks like it was hardly used) and I'm going to give it a test run as soon as I get a chance to hook it up to my TV and pull out some of my old Hi-Fi Stereo Pre-Recorded tapes to see if the video heads are still up to par yet as was suggested on here.

The only thing that's missing is the original remote which I think I could source one on the 'Bay for cheap.

This VCR seems to be about on par with my old JVC Hi-Fi VCR I have that I picked up at Goodwill complete with its original remote and Owners Manual for $10, and about on par with the old Fisher (Sanyo) Hi-Fi VCR that I'm working on for my Uncle.

I got the VCR today, and it looks nearly mint...Post some pictures of inside and out, for posterity if nothing else. Hard to find.

Post some pictures of inside and out, for posterity if nothing else. Hard to find.

I sure will. :thmbsp:

OK so I got a chance to plug in and power on the VCR and unfortunately its not working, when you go to power it on, it attempts to go through the power-up sequence but then it gets stuck at the part where it attempts to test the takeup reel motors and only the left takeup reel motor does anything the right takeup reel doesn't do anything, its just "dead".

This VCR did have a service shop tag on it from a repair shop in Salt Lake City, Utah that was dated 1989 and when I opened the VCR up to take a look inside it acted like the only servicing that was done in the VCR was on the topside (maybe the main loading mechanism belt was replaced at that time) as the underside panel screws were still torqued to factory specs and made the famous "crack" noise that screws make when they've been unscrewed for the first time in their history on vintage electronic devices.

With all of this in mind what might be wrong with this VCR and can it be repaired easily?

I have some photos I'll upload as soon as my google photos account starts to cooperate again, because right now its not loading correctly for some weird reason. :thumbsdn: :sigh:

OK so I got a chance to plug in and power on the VCR and unfortunately its not working, when you go to power it on, it attempts to go through the power-up sequence but then it gets stuck at the part where it attempts to test the takeup reel motors and only the left takeup reel motor does anything the right takeup reel doesn't do anything, its just "dead".

Do you have a dummy test tape to put in it? A tape shell minus the tape and innards? So you can run it through its paces without ruining a tape.You're finding out about the complexity of those machines.


With all of this in mind what might be wrong with this VCR and can it be repaired easily?

Without a service manual to check voltages and signals it will be difficult. Could be a reel drive IC. First thing needed is to check all power supply output voltages.

I have some photos I'll upload as soon as my google photos account starts to cooperate again, because right now its not loading correctly for some weird reason. :thumbsdn: :sigh:Why bother with Google? Just upload the images to the Videokarma website.

http://www.videokarma.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=204266&d=1652446072

Do you have a dummy test tape to put in it? A tape shell minus the tape and innards? So you can run it through its paces without ruining a tape.You're finding out about the complexity of those machines.




Without a service manual to check voltages and signals it will be difficult. Could be a reel drive IC. First thing needed is to check all power supply output voltages.

Why bother with Google? Just upload the images to the Videokarma website.

http://www.videokarma.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=204266&d=1652446072


Well the problem is the pictures were taken with my phone, and using Google photos is the only way I can get the pictures from my phone to my computer without having to mess with my phone's microSD card.

As far as sacrificial tapes go, I have some old blank tapes that were NOS that someone gave me that I can use for that purpose, and the VCR seems to be in a "lockout" mode as it won't let me load a tape into the VCR and without the VCR being able to power on it won't allow me to load a tape into the VCR.

Well the problem is the pictures were taken with my phone, and using Google photos is the only way I can get the pictures from my phone to my computer without having to mess with my phone's microSD card.
I never do it that way so can't help there. I use either my Canon or Nikon cameras for my pictures.


As far as sacrificial tapes go, I have some old blank tapes that were NOS that someone gave me that I can use for that purpose, and the VCR seems to be in a "lockout" mode as it won't let me load a tape into the VCR and without the VCR being able to power on it won't allow me to load a tape into the VCR.

You MIGHT be able to trick it by turning the TU reel by hand when you power it on, which should send a PG signal to the microprocessor.

Other than that, without a service manual and putting it on a bench to check things with an o'scope and DVM, don't know what to tell you.

I never do it that way so can't help there. I use either my Canon or Nikon cameras for my pictures.



You MIGHT be able to trick it by turning the TU reel by hand when you power it on, which should send a PG signal to the microprocessor.

Other than that, without a service manual and putting it on a bench to check things with an o'scope and DVM, don't know what to tell you.

Ok. Let me try posting the pictures onto here from my phone.

Well unfortunately when I was trying to remove the take-up reel assembly I ended up having one screw that happened to be torqued down too tight at the factory (which seems to be the case on every single VCR I work on) and when I was trying to unscrew the screw I ended up stripping the head out (because they used brass for the screw rather than stainless steel or some other harder material) so now I have one screw that's stuck in the take-up reel assembly and I'm able to get it out without having to resort to the possibility of having to drill it out.

What have you guys done in situations like this?

You need a JIS screwdriver. I hear they prevent stripping screw heads out.
You see those are not Phillips screws, they are Japanese Industry Standard screws.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_screw_drives#JIS_B_1012

You need a JIS screwdriver. I hear they prevent stripping screw heads out.
You see those are not Phillips screws, they are Japanese Industry Standard screws.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_screw_drives#JIS_B_1012

Ok, I was wondering why all of the Japanese made electronics I've seen and worked on had "JIS" marked on the cases somewhere, it was a reference to the type of screws and screwdrivers they needed to use to service them. :scratch2:

Can JIS screwdrivers be bought at your everyday hardware store like Ace or TruValue or Lowe's or do you have to buy them online?

Amazon sells them. I've never seen them in the usual box stores. I'm not saying that they don't, but I've never seen them. I've only read about them myself but people say they are real game changers.

I did find a service manual for this VCR (its the Sam's version.)

I found the correct page for the Motor Drive Circuitry, hopefully that will help others follow along. :yes:

OK, so I looked at the Service Data and it looks like IC2007 is the one that controls the motor control board and was the one you were talking about possibly being bad am I correct?

OK, so I looked at the Service Data and it looks like IC2007 is the one that controls the motor control board and was the one you were talking about possibly being bad am I correct?It's possible but without doing some testing with a service manual, scope and DVM don't get me to lying!

It's possible but without doing some testing with a service manual, scope and DVM don't get me to lying!

I'm not going to, I'm planning on taking a look at it more closely after I get off work tonight. :thmbsp:

Since I now have my 'scope figured out how to work it I'll see if I can figure out what's what on the VCR.

I'm not going to, I'm planning on taking a look at it more closely after I get off work tonight. :thmbsp:

Since I now have my 'scope figured out how to work it I'll see if I can figure out what's what on the VCR.

Be sure to check for a shorted electrolytic capacitor somewhere in that motor drive circuit too, could be something as simple as that. As old as it is that's a possibility.

Be sure to check for a shorted electrolytic capacitor somewhere in that motor drive circuit too, could be something as simple as that. As old as it is that's a possibility.

Well I looked through the service data and I found 4 electrolytics in particular that seem suspect in the motor drive circuit that could be causing my issue, C18 (C1118 in the Sam's), C30, C32, and C34 (C2530, C2532, and C2534 respectively in the Sam's) that are all in the 11.9V Source (15V) rail, and the 12V Source rails for the supply and take up reel motors.

One in particular looked kind of out of place (it looked a little newer than the rest of the capacitors in the unit and also it was a higher capacitance rating than what's called out in the Sam's), which is C30 (C2530) which is supposed to be a 100 µF 16V but instead had a 470 µF 16V capacitor in that spot, which unless there was some sort of design change made to the unit that wasn't reflected in the Sam's (or that was reflected in the Sam's) I think someone installed the wrong size capacitor in there, which I'm apted to think that someone put the wrong size capacitor in there because as I said the capacitor was a completely different style of capacitor than the rest of the capacitors in there.

Well I looked through the service data and I found 4 electrolytics in particular that seem suspect in the motor drive circuit that could be causing my issue, C18 (C1118 in the Sam's), C30, C32, and C34 (C2530, C2532, and C2534 respectively in the Sam's) that are all in the 11.9V Source (15V) rail, and the 12V Source rails for the supply and take up reel motors.

One in particular looked kind of out of place (it looked a little newer than the rest of the capacitors in the unit and also it was a higher capacitance rating than what's called out in the Sam's), which is C30 (C2530) which is supposed to be a 100 µF 16V but instead had a 470 µF 16V capacitor in that spot, which unless there was some sort of design change made to the unit that wasn't reflected in the Sam's (or that was reflected in the Sam's) I think someone installed the wrong size capacitor in there, which I'm apted to think that someone put the wrong size capacitor in there because as I said the capacitor was a completely different style of capacitor than the rest of the capacitors in there.

Re-read your post. It's probably OK depending where it is in the circuitry. I wouldn't necessarily trust Sam's as gospel either! Might have been a change during production.

If I had that machine first thing I would be doing is checking every electrolytic in it with my ESR meter. I actually have two, one I used at the shop and the other for home use, it's that important and useful.

Won't let be attach two files! What the ...??!

OK I see what's going on. I already attached that one in another thread a while back.

Another pic (right side) testing the Hi-fi audio board from an old JVC VCR. Those old surface mount caps were notorious for failing.

http://www.videokarma.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=174914&d=1339600483

Re-read your post. It's probably OK depending where it is in the circuitry. I wouldn't necessarily trust Sam's as gospel either! Might have been a change during production.

If I had that machine first thing I would be doing is checking every electrolytic in it with my ESR meter. I actually have two, one I used at the shop and the other for home use, it's that important and useful.

Unfortunately my ESR Meter died recently (the LCD Display won't come on anymore) and it was one of those "kit" units that you could get on ebay for $10 (the one that could come either cased or uncased.)

The Sam's for this VCR is from 1987 and my VCR is from 1984...:scratch2:

Unfortunately my ESR Meter died recently (the LCD Display won't come on anymore)...You need to get another one then. I wouldn't even attempt to fix this old stuff without an ESR tester. Can save hours of work, and the old equipment you're trying to fix.

You need to get another one then. I wouldn't even attempt to fix this old stuff without an ESR tester. Can save hours of work, and the old equipment you're trying to fix.

I just did, I bought an old analog one.

I have posted a screenshot of the section of the schematic with the capacitors in question including the 470 uF 16V Capacitor and its overall circuit context.

I just did, I bought an old analog one.


:thmbsp:

First ESR meter I ever used was an analog one, Capacitor Wizard I think it was called. The shop owner bought it in the mid-80s for us technicians to share. I got tired of having to track it down every time I wanted to use it and found the black digital one, a kit from Dick Smith Electronics in Australia, so I could have my own. Still works great!

:thmbsp:

First ESR meter I ever used was an analog one, Capacitor Wizard I think it was called. The shop owner bought it in the mid-80s for us technicians to share. I got tired of having to track it down every time I wanted to use it and found the black digital one, a kit from Dick Smith Electronics in Australia, so I could have my own. Still works great!

I saw some capacitor wizards for sale on epay but the price was too rich for me, $275! :thumbsdn:

I ended up getting a MAT Electronics Analog ESR Meter model MUL3333 that can test capacitors in-circuit and it was only $45 (I will have to use the cables from my old ESR Meter as the original cables didn't come with this unit but they were basically just your standard mini-banana plug style cables.

so what do you think of the circuit diagram I uploaded showing the capacitors in question?

I saw some capacitor wizards for sale on epay but the price was too rich for me, $275! :thumbsdn:

Yikes! They were expensive back then too but not that much!

I ended up getting a MAT Electronics Analog ESR Meter model MUL3333 that can test capacitors in-circuit and it was only $45 (I will have to use the cables from my old ESR Meter as the original cables didn't come with this unit but they were basically just your standard mini-banana plug style cables.Sounds like a deal. Both of mine test in-circuit. As long as the applied AC voltage is below the conduction point of the semiconductors in the circuit .6 V or less they will do that no problem.

so what do you think of the circuit diagram I uploaded showing the capacitors in question?I'll look at it in a little while. Busy fixin' food.

Yikes! They were expensive back then too but not that much!

Sounds like a deal. Both of mine test in-circuit. As long as the applied AC voltage is below the conduction point of the semiconductors in the circuit .6 V or less they will do that no problem.

I'll look at it in a little while. Busy fixin' food.

Ok, thanks! And that's good to know.

so what do you think of the circuit diagram I uploaded showing the capacitors in question?
That's no problem being larger value, it's on the 12V B+. Might have been a production change to fix some ripple or interference when the motors were loaded down. In that diagram they show 2 100 uF's in parallel for total 200 uF.

That's no problem being larger value, it's on the 12V B+. Might have been a production change to fix some ripple or interference when the motors were loaded down. In that diagram they show 2 100 uF's in parallel for total 200 uF.

Ok, I wasn't sure, I knew in old tube equipment, capacitor values weren't too critical but I wasn't sure about solid state stuff ( I know some solid state stuff like this capacitor value is more critical, than in tube circuits, which is why I asked.)

Ok, I wasn't sure, I knew in old tube equipment, capacitor values weren't too critical but I wasn't sure about solid state stuff ( I know some solid state stuff like this capacitor value is more critical, than in tube circuits, which is why I asked.)And I would think tube equipment would be more critical than solid-state...

How critical a capacitor value is depends on its function, and has relatively little to do with tube vs. solid state. Power supply filter caps need to be a certain minimum size. Signal-handling cap tolerance depends on function. Stage-coupling caps need medium-tight tolerances to assure low-frequency response. Caps for functions like tuned circuits require the tightest tolerance.

Tube and transistor circuits are similar in their sensitivity to passive component values.

Tube amplifiers generally may be sensitive to individual tube parameters, while most transistor circuits are generally insensitive to transistor parameters above a certain minimum, for example if current gain (beta) >=100. There are exceptions, for example where matched transistors and/or diodes are required to maintain proper bias in push-pull power stages.

How critical a capacitor value is depends on its function, and has relatively little to do with tube vs. solid state...Good clarification. Thanks!

I've always avoided working on anything with vacuum tubes including CRT TVs. Reason why is, back in the '70s my Aunt and Uncle up in Connecticut came home to find my cousin dead on the living room floor. He had been working on a tube-type guitar amplifier. So I've been a bit wary ever since.

Although one of these can nail 'ya too, about 80V + and - on the finals... one of my Pioneer SPEC-4 power amplifiers that decided to let the smoke out one day.

http://www.videokarma.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=204323&stc=1&d=1653176101

Hi. The PV-1730 was probably Panasonic's answer to the Sony SL-2700 Beta hi-fi. Like the 2700, it has direct drive reel motors and electronic servo-controlled back-tension. The same mechanism was incorporated into some Panasonic portable VCRs from the same time. The NV-180/PV-8000 being a good example.

Fivos

The same mechanism was incorporated into some Panasonic portable VCRs from the same time. The NV-180/PV-8000 being a good example.

Fivos And the stereo Hi-Fi PV-9000 portable, can't leave that one out!:thmbsp:

And the stereo Hi-Fi PV-9000 portable, can't leave that one out!:thmbsp:

Yeah. Quite amazing how they managed to cram the AFM circuits inside a unit that small in 1984.

Yeah. Quite amazing how they managed to cram the AFM circuits inside a unit that small in 1984.Yes! But at the same time they didn't figure out how to keep the 8000 and 9000 VCRs from coming un-docked from the PV-A860 docking tuner charger power unit, until Panasonic came up with a modification kit a while later. Don't know how many of those I installed that kit in but it was a bunch!

http://www.videokarma.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=204325&stc=1&d=1653345370

Yes! But at the same time they didn't figure out how to keep the 8000 and 9000 VCRs from coming un-docked from the PV-A860 docking tuner charger power unit, until Panasonic came up with a modification kit a while later. Don't know how many of those I installed that kit in but it was a bunch!

http://www.videokarma.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=204325&stc=1&d=1653345370

Zenith and JVC in the 1980s had some pretty interesting Hi-Fi and Mono VCRs (one of them was a sideways loading front loading VCR) and most of those were also direct drive units as well. :thmbsp:

Zenith and JVC in the 1980s had some pretty interesting Hi-Fi and Mono VCRs (one of them was a sideways loading front loading VCR) and most of those were also direct drive units as well. :thmbsp:
Was warranty service for JVC and Zenith, HR-D470 sideways load, and those did not have direct drive reels. DD capstan motors, yes, and the cylinder of course. Even the relatively sophisticated HR-S5800 and S6700 that you could use two together with a remote controller for editing didn't. ☺ The big industrial VCRs might have though, we didn't see many of those.

Matsushita owned a large stake in JVC but they sure didn't share any chassis or anything else.

Was warranty service for JVC and Zenith, HR-D470 sideways load, and those did not have direct drive reels. DD capstan motors, yes, and the cylinder of course. Even the relatively sophisticated HR-S5800 and S6700 that you could use two together with a remote controller for editing didn't. ☺ The big industrial VCRs might have though, we didn't see many of those.

Matsushita owned a large stake in JVC but they sure didn't share any chassis or anything else.

I've had a few JVC (and JVC's Rebadged as Zenith) that did have direct drive mechanisms (mostly the really high end prosumer grade Hi-Fi units.)

I've had a few JVC (and JVC's Rebadged as Zenith) that did have direct drive mechanisms (mostly the really high end prosumer grade Hi-Fi units.)

Look up any HR model JVC and I betcha there's a belt from the DD capstan motor to the reel drive mechanism. Pretty sure you're thinking about the "prosumer" industrial models. But hey I've been wrong more than once!


Thinking about it, some of them (HR) had a centrally located DC motor between the reels for reel drive but still used an idler wheel to move one way or the other depending which direction the tape needed to go.

You're probably thinking of JVC's "BR" line. My 2¢!

The HR-D470 has a separate reel drive motor but it still uses an idler tire. There's no consumer JVC with direct drive take-up and supply "pancake motors" like the PV-1730 or SL-2700. Some Grundig European-market VHS VCRs from the mid 80s have a similar setup to the PV-1730, but those utilize the U-loading system like Betamax.

The HR-D470 has a separate reel drive motor but it still uses an idler tire. There's no consumer JVC with direct drive take-up and supply "pancake motors" like the PV-1730 or SL-2700. Some Grundig European-market VHS VCRs from the mid 80s have a similar setup to the PV-1730, but those utilize the U-loading system like Betamax.

Yep!

I remember getting in those HR-D470s and the Zenith version too, where the backup supercap would leak and make a mess of things on the front timer board as I recall.

Some would need the star washer under a screw on the bottom deck board to ground. I installed that washer on every similar chassis JVC that came in with even the potential of needing that, just so it wouldn't come back on me.

Yep!

I remember getting in those HR-D470s and the Zenith version too, where the backup supercap would leak and make a mess of things on the front timer board as I recall.

Some would need the star washer under a screw on the bottom deck board to ground. I installed that washer on every similar chassis JVC that came in with even the potential of needing that, just so it wouldn't come back on me.

The one I'm thinking of, that I have currently, is the Prosumer grade version of the HR-U8000 S-VHS VCR, of course maybe I was thinking of the HR-U8000 S-VHS unit when I was thinking of one of the JVC VCRs I had (which I've had several over the years including JVC made Zenith VCRs) that was all direct drive...:scratch2:

And Yes I have also had the HR-U8000 S-VHS VCR as well, (which I got from the High School I went to when they retired it.)
Actually I had two of them, I also got one from a garage sale one time as well, the one I got from the school had its original remote and the one I got from the garage sale didn't, the one I got from my high school when they retired it had long since died and been junked out (including the remote) by the time I found the one at the garage sale a few years later.

The one I'm thinking of, that I have currently, is the Prosumer grade version of the HR-U8000 S-VHS VCR, of course maybe I was thinking of the HR-U8000 S-VHS unit when I was thinking of one of the JVC VCRs I had (which I've had several over the years including JVC made Zenith VCRs) that was all direct drive...:scratch2:

And Yes I have also had the HR-U8000 S-VHS VCR as well, (which I got from the High School I went to when they retired it.)
Actually I had two of them, I also got one from a garage sale one time as well, the one I got from the school had its original remote and the one I got from the garage sale didn't, the one I got from my high school when they retired it had long since died and been junked out (including the remote) by the time I found the one at the garage sale a few years later.That would be HR-S8000U...The one with the crappy switching mode power supply burns up in, melts the insulator sheet! Did not like it when I got assigned one to work on, at all! And no, not direct drive reels in that either.

That would be HR-S8000U...The one with the crappy switching mode power supply burns up in, melts the insulator sheet! Did not like it when I got assigned one to work on, at all! And no, not direct drive reels in that either.


http://www.videokarma.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=204332&stc=1&d=1653522229

Ok, I thought it did have them (I had opened it up only once when I had it and I saw several motors under there but didn't realize it wasn't direct drive all around).
Sorry for the confusion.
The unit I have now which I think is the sister to the wood-grained S-VHS unit I was talking about is the HR-D630U Hi-Fi VHS VCR from 1987.

HR-D630U not S-VHS, a higher end consumer model, with central reel motor and idler drive. Any others?

HR-D630U not S-VHS, a higher end consumer model, with central reel motor and idler drive. Any others?



http://www.videokarma.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=204333&stc=1&d=1653524774


I didn't say it was S-VHS, I said it was the regular Hi-Fi VHS version of the S-VHS unit that JVC made that year because it had the same style front end layout.

Never mind...! I am done.

BTW.. If you still have the HR-S8000 I would advise unplugging it when not in use or it might burn your house down! No thermal protection and fuses wouldn't blow either. ☺

Never mind...! I am done.

BTW.. If you still have the HR-S8000 I would advise unplugging it when not in use or it might burn your house down! No thermal protection and fuses wouldn't blow either. ☺

Nope, fortunately I don't have either of them anymore as they both suffered the burned up power supply issue you mentioned, although at the time I didn't realize that's what happened with them...

I'm sorry I didn't mean to confuse you with the descriptions of the VCRs I had. I was just describing what I thought they looked like.

I got my new (to me) analog ESR Meter today, installed some batteries and found some test leads for it (I had some spare test leads for it from an old $10 Harbor Freight DMM that died on me a couple of years ago) that worked with it perfectly and I tested those capacitors I mentioned that we figured out were part of the take-up and supply reel motor B+ lines and they all tested bad (they pegged out the ESR meter, at least I think so anyways if I'm reading it right, in reference to an ESR chart I downloaded from the internet.)

Alright so I actually figured out that if the meter pegs out the capacitors are good. So I figured out that C6-C8 were the actual culprits, they actually suffered from the notorious Matshuista(sp?) green corosion/leakage issue and that's actually the first time I've ran into that so far. :scratch2:

But I know Shango and J. P. Dylan have both discussed it in their videos quite often so that's the only reason why I recognized it once I found them with my ESR Meter. :thmbsp:

Now to gets some replacement capacitors and install them and put the VCR back together and I think I should finally have a functioning VCR again. :yes:

Well another update on the VCR, I did manage to find some capacitors for the VCR in my capacitor stash, and installed them, and put the VCR back together and it is partially fixed, the VCR is now powering on all by itself now when you plug it into the wall, and the take-up reel spindle is now spinning at a much faster speed than it used to when it is doing the self-diagnostic check.

But its still not spinning up the supply reel spindle and the video head drum isn't spinning up either in the self-diagnostic check, so I wonder if there's some more capacitors on another board that's involved with the loading/playback mechanism?

Also I noticed that when the VCR attempts to power up the display screen shows "camera" on the readout which I'm not sure if that's normal or not but I'm wondering if that's maybe something that might be something to do with what's going on with the VCR and why its acting up?

Also I noticed that when the VCR attempts to power up the display screen shows "camera" on the readout which I'm not sure if that's normal or not but I'm wondering if that's maybe something that might be something to do with what's going on with the VCR and why its acting up?

Is the input selector switch set to camera?

I did find a service manual for this VCR (its the Sam's version.)

I found the correct page for the Motor Drive Circuitry, hopefully that will help others follow along. :yes:
Looks like the PV-1730 uses the same motor drive ICs as the portable PV-8000 so this schematic might be useful although the board itself is obviously different.
204340

204341
EDIT: Because the resolution of the attachments is garbage, here's the links for the full-res png files:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Xge0B7MnBM7wh0r2QdynnGWyJOhCtWEP/view?usp=sharing
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1LGu3a2YtIJ_Gy25eZobzqF8aHdh0V2CR/view?usp=sharing

Is the input selector switch set to camera?

No, it wasn't it was set to the Line Input mode (which apparently triggers the "camera" light on the VFD Display readout, which is the same thing that happens when its actually set to "camera" mode.)

Anyways, I take it that the "Servo Board" also has some influence on the functionality of the VCR's loading/playback mechanism? If so could it be possible that there might be some bad caps on that board as well causing some issues?:scratch2:

No, it wasn't it was set to the Line Input mode (which apparently triggers the "camera" light on the VFD Display readout, which is the same thing that happens when its actually set to "camera" mode.)

Anyways, I take it that the "Servo Board" also has some influence on the functionality of the VCR's loading/playback mechanism? If so could it be possible that there might be some bad caps on that board as well causing some issues?:scratch2:

Generally the servo circuit is what controls the speed and phase of the capstan and drum motors. This machine being fully direct-drive will have an extra servo board for the reel motors. Loading issues are usually caused by dirty mode encoder switches, gummed-up mechanisms or missing/low power supply voltages. Since you have the Sam's, have you verified that the voltages from the power supply are correct?

Generally the servo circuit is what controls the speed and phase of the capstan and drum motors. This machine being fully direct-drive will have an extra servo board for the reel motors. Loading issues are usually caused by dirty mode encoder switches, gummed-up mechanisms or missing/low power supply voltages. Since you have the Sam's, have you verified that the voltages from the power supply are correct?

I did check the voltages and the seemed to be where they were supposed to be. I did notice though in the Sam's that there is a Voltage regulator transistor for the supply reel motor which (which seems to be the only part of the motor drive board that has a voltage regulator transistor), I wonder if that might of failed and that's what's causing the supply reel motor to malfunction, either that or some bad capacitors on another board somewhere in the VCR. :scratch2:

Also I was looking at the Servo/Control Board for this VCR in the Sam's and it seems that it does indeed control the take-up and supply reel motors as well besides the capstan and drum motors.
So again I think I might take a look at that board for some bad capacitors with my ESR meter.

Well I took the Servo Circuit Board out and looked it over closely and when I was checking some of the electrolytics on the board, I noticed what looked like a dip or low spot in the board around one of the plastic stand-offs and so I looked at it closely and sure enough the board has several cracks in it that go through to the traces and so I think that the reason why this VCR isn't working is because of the cracks in the Servo Board. :sigh: :no: :tears:

Unfortunately I think this VCR is a lost cause unless someone has a donor board from a junker VCR that they'd be willing to send me or know of one somewhere for sale... :scratch2:

I did check the voltages and the seemed to be where they were supposed to be. I did notice though in the Sam's that there is a Voltage regulator transistor for the supply reel motor which (which seems to be the only part of the motor drive board that has a voltage regulator transistor), I wonder if that might of failed and that's what's causing the supply reel motor to malfunction, either that or some bad capacitors on another board somewhere in the VCR. :scratch2:

Also I was looking at the Servo/Control Board for this VCR in the Sam's and it seems that it does indeed control the take-up and supply reel motors as well besides the capstan and drum motors.
So again I think I might take a look at that board for some bad capacitors with my ESR meter.

You can measure the junctions of the transistor in the diode test mode of a multimeter. I don't know if this model is supposed to run the supply and/or take-up reel motor when you turn it on as we didn't have a PV-1730 equivalent model here in Europe. Does the front loading mechanism accept tapes?

You can measure the junctions of the transistor in the diode test mode of a multimeter. I don't know if this model is supposed to run the supply and/or take-up reel motor when you turn it on as we didn't have a PV-1730 equivalent model here in Europe. Does the front loading mechanism accept tapes?

No it doesn't accept tapes into the VCR when you try to load the tapes into the VCR, that's because (at least in USA models) the VCR has to be powered on in order for it to be able to load a tape into the mechanism, and if the VCR refuses to power on (goes into safety shut-down mode) then the VCR loading mechanism will not load tapes.

And as a little update, unfortunately I found several broken traces on the main control board of the VCR (the board that contains the Servo Circuit, Index Circuit, and the System Control Circuits) that were from some cracks that I found on the circuit board that were around a couple of the plastic standoffs that were for supporting the board against the case when you installed the board into the case.

I'm going to see if there's any way to repair those traces, if not I'll see if there's a board for this VCR available on feebay for sale.

No it doesn't accept tapes into the VCR when you try to load the tapes into the VCR, that's because (at least in USA models) the VCR has to be powered on in order for it to be able to load a tape into the mechanism, and if the VCR refuses to power on (goes into safety shut-down mode) then the VCR loading mechanism will not load tapes.

And as a little update, unfortunately I found several broken traces on the main control board of the VCR (the board that contains the Servo Circuit, Index Circuit, and the System Control Circuits) that were from some cracks that I found on the circuit board that were around a couple of the plastic standoffs that were for supporting the board against the case when you installed the board into the case.

I'm going to see if there's any way to repair those traces, if not I'll see if there's a board for this VCR available on feebay for sale.

It will more than likely be a single-layer board so severed traces will be easy to repair. Can you upload close-up pictures of the damaged traces?

It will more than likely be a single-layer board so severed traces will be easy to repair. Can you upload close-up pictures of the damaged traces?

Yes, thankfully it is a single layer board (traces only on one side) so yes I think it should be able to be repaired using the Shango method.

I'll post a picture of the broken traces when I get back from work later tonight.

I think it should be able to be repaired using the Shango method.

Shango method... awaiting the results.

http://www.videokarma.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=204413&stc=1&d=1655600823

Used to get in PV-5000s and PV-6000s (portables) with cracked 3-layer boards a lot. Panny had placed a small rubber spacer between the board and the bottom cabinet panel. All it took was a bump while carrying it around to crack the board. Yes I repaired them, charged by the hour. Used the Ed method.

Have fun!

-

Shango method... awaiting the results.

http://www.videokarma.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=204413&stc=1&d=1655600823

Used to get in PV-5000s and PV-6000s (portables) with cracked 3-layer boards a lot. Panny had placed a small rubber spacer between the board and the bottom cabinet panel. All it took was a bump while carrying it around to crack the board. Yes I repaired them, charged by the hour. Used the Ed method.

Have fun!

-

I meant Shango066 on YouTube. 😜

I meant Shango066 on YouTube. 😜

ah.. OK. I thought you were going to listen to Santana's "Shango" while you worked on it. :thmbsp: That was one of several albums I used to listen to while at work.

ah.. OK. I thought you were going to listen to Santana's "Shango" while you worked on it. :thmbsp: That was one of several albums I used to listen to while at work.

That's OK, I just thought that when one mentioned Shango on here it was kind of understood that one was talking about Shango066 on YouTube.

I guess I shouldn't assume things like that on here. 😅

OK, so I finally got the VCR Fixed! :thmbsp:

But of course now it has a timing issue related to the mode switch I think, because when I put the tape in, it loads the tape in normally like it would if you tried to play a tape but then when you hit play the tape loads against the heads and attempts to play but then unloads the tape back into the tape housing, and if I try to hit rewind or fast forward the tape will rewind for about a second before stopping and then loading the tape against the heads like its going to try and play but then the VCR shuts down and when you try to power it on again it shuts back down again after a few seconds (and the tape is stuck in fully loaded/playback mode the entire time.)

Is there some sort of way to figure out which mode the mode switch is in in reference to the mechanism? Like is there some sort of specific marking that will tell you which position is which on the mode switch (ie stop, play, Rew, FF, Eject, Pause, etc.?)

It's very rare for mode switch to jump time on its own.. Can you post a picture of the mode switch? I would suspect the switch could be dirty instead and may need to be cleaned. Usually to check its alignment, machine has to be put into sub-load if its the type I am thinking of. There's either a dot or a notch on it for indexing but again a picture is worth 1000 words.

It's very rare for mode switch to jump time on its own.. Can you post a picture of the mode switch? I would suspect the switch could be dirty instead and may need to be cleaned. Usually to check its alignment, machine has to be put into sub-load if its the type I am thinking of. There's either a dot or a notch on it for indexing but again a picture is worth 1000 words.

Well I did say (or I thought I did anyways) that I took the mode switch out of the VCR to check it out when I was trying to troubleshoot the VCR initially and when I did that I turned the switch back and forth to figure out if it was still rotating properly or not, and I forgot to put the switch back into its original keyed position.

I'll get a picture of the mechanism including the mode switch and post it and see what you think.

Well I did say (or I thought I did anyways) that I took the mode switch out of the VCR to check it out when I was trying to troubleshoot the VCR initially and when I did that I turned the switch back and forth to figure out if it was still rotating properly or not, and I forgot to put the switch back into its original keyed position.

I'll get a picture of the mechanism including the mode switch and post it and see what you think.
Is the switch below or up top by the cassette tray?

Is the switch below or up top by the cassette tray?

It's below the cassette tray, it's a little round assembly that has some square shaped protrusions out the side that the retaining screws go through, the electrical connector goes through the top.

Greetings everyone, a little update on this VCR, I was going through the Power Supply circuitry and I found several bad capacitors in the 5V and 12V rail of the power supply circuit and 3 of the capacitors (2 2200 µF 16V capacitors and a 330 µF 16V capacitor) are capacitors that I don't have the exact values in, I have 2200 µF and 330µF capacitors but they're 10V units rather than 16V units, if they are only a few microfarads low (within 10%) would it be ok to use them in the circuit?

I think otherwise this unit is fixed now.

OK, so another update on this unit, this unit is giving me some more troubles, I had it working for a little bit but then for some reason now its not wanting to power up properly again.

This time the VCR when you power it on, it will go through the powerup self-test thing (but only partially) and the VCR will stay powered on for about 30 seconds and then it will shut itself off.

Now when I say it will go through the powerup self-test partially I mean that the video head doesn't spin up during the self-test process, it just does the spin-up of the take-up reel motor and thats it.

I've already recapped the control board for the VCR mechanism, and I'm not sure whatelse to do to get this VCR up and running properly.

I've read through the service data for this VCR and the troubleshooting portion doesn't give any lip-service to the specific issues I'm having with this VCR.

Can't help with your specific trouble list, but I see no one answered your question about capacitor voltage rating.

It is NOT OK to use a lower voltage rated capacitor as a replacement.
A higher rating is OK within reason, but it may be bigger and not fit anyway.

Another update on this VCR, Its now having problems with the mode switch, and I can't seem to find the mode switch this VCR uses as a NOS part anywhere online (not ebay, or any Electronics Parts suppliers.)

I was wondering if there were any other models of Panasonic or Quasar VCRs from the early to mid 1980s that used the same type of mode switch as the PV-1730 did?
If so which models were they so I could possibly look out for those models as parts units on ebay or locally on facebook marketplace.

I think right now the mode switch is all that's wrong with the unit, because I was able to sucessfully repair the power supply issue mentioned previously (I found capacitors in my stash that were the correct voltage) and it started up and loaded and played and FF and Rew like it was supposed to for about a day but then after I had unplugged it to put it back together and put it away, I went to try it out the next day and then it started acting up again.
This time I think it was the mode switch because when I tried to clean the mode switch I think I might of damaged it and not realized it, and so it worked a little bit but then it failed for good.

Clean the mode switch. Look up Norcal715 and 12voltvids on YouTube. They show how to do it many times.

Clean the mode switch. Look up Norcal715 and 12voltvids on YouTube. They show how to do it many times.

I did clean the mode switch already, and that's unfortunately how I broke the original mode switch... :sigh: