View Full Version : Testing equipment: Signal gen, bias, Peak to Peak
BandDirector 10-18-2020, 10:59 AM Hello all,
Giving it the old college try, can't get a P to P value.
The red clip is -6 agc bias, signal gen set to 44.5 mc, -6 volts can be read on VoltOhmst, can't get a read of anything when I adjust traps for videos.
Notimetolooz 10-20-2020, 10:08 PM I have no idea what you are doing.
Peak-to-Peak is a term used to describe the size of a signal, usually measures with an oscilloscope.
What are you applying bias to?
The traps on a TV are usually sound traps (4.5 MHz), or are you talking about the IF filters/transformers?
You have to give a lot more information if you expect someone to help.
BandDirector 03-29-2021, 09:07 AM Alignment and test equipment check, see pics. I'm going to spend some time experimenting and teaching myself to do an alignment on the RCA 21D KCS116C.
The sweep generator isn't too healthy but I can adjust the tuning lugs to match various channel number frequencies with a freq counter. Since I'm only concerned with aligning channel 3 or 4 based on what input signal (vcr/dvd combo with digital convertor) I'm focused on Sound and Video IF traps, and tuner alignment for channel 3. Also- I can't get a -6 vdc bias into the video traps to read a 3 volt peak to peak, despite numerous points to check voltages around the 1st, 2nd, and 3d video stages.
When I measure various markers of the BK generator, the waveform on the RCA scope is not a clean sinewave, so I may need to service the scope, more to learn! The waveform looks a bit ragged, and not very focused despite adjusting the scope response.
*It's not the scope, I forgot that calibrating the scope is clean and easy. Faults are *probably* in other equipment.
BandDirector 03-29-2021, 11:25 AM Service manual images below
Notimetolooz 03-30-2021, 10:29 AM Frankly I think doing a TV alignment is biting of more than you can chew at this point. Alignment is just about the most difficult thing to do if you don't have a thorough understanding of how a TV works and the test equipment.
The fact that you are using the wrong terminology is a bad sign.
"Traps" are set to eliminate certain frequencies, like the sound carrier getting into the video signal to the CRT.
"Filter coils or transformers" are tuned to allow frequencies to pass through the circuit.
When the instructions talk about "peaking" it means adjust to get the most signal.
The instructions have the meter connected to the demodulated IF signal (44.5 MHz for instance), you cannot measure the IF directly with the meter because the frequency is too high. It seems you are not getting the 44.5 MHz through the circuit if you are saying you are not getting a reading.
Looks like you scope is a RCA WO-33A, I happen to have one of those. Your picture is not sharp enough to tell the model number otherwise of the test equipment. At best that scope is only good to about 5.5 MHz, so it cannot give you a good view of a frequency as high as 44 MHz. That scope has some goofy things about it like the frequency range is less when set for higher voltage sensitivity. RCA made some oddball test equipment that were different from the common test equipment. RCA was a big cheese in the radio business because David Sarnoff bought out all radio patents in the early days, so they thought they had the best ideas.
The RCA sweep generator should work well with that scope however.
You have to know your test equipment is working right however.
BandDirector 03-30-2021, 09:59 PM A very informative response, and much appreciated. I'm in no rush.
Tube TV 06-29-2021, 07:29 PM Just to clear things up, are you trying to view a sinewave, or are you trying to see the marker pips on your oscilloscope?
If you are doing a alignment you will need a demodulator probe to be able to see the markers.
As Notimetolooz said 5.5 MC is the top end on that scope for examining a direct waveform. My Heathkit is around the same frequency range.
If you're using markers and a demodulator probe then you will have a far greater range.
World radio history has plenty of books in PDF form on radio and TV alignment that is period correct for the gear you're using. The Sams books and the Gernsbach books are excellent and I highly recommend them.
I would not recommend adjusting the IF cores until you have a full knowlege about what you're doing. Trust me I've been there and done that as a kid when I was just starting out and it is real tough to get everthing dialed back in.
SAMS
https://worldradiohistory.com/BOOKSHELF-ARH/Bookshelf_Sams.htm
GERNSBACK
https://worldradiohistory.com/BOOKSHELF-ARH/Bookshelf_Gernsback.htm
Many coils / transformers can be adjusted by eye or ears if
you have a good solid signal. Usually the convergence, horz osc, AFT,
sound IF, sound detector ( quad coil), 3.58 osc, burst, 41.25 & 4.5 traps.
The trick with coils is to flag your tool. Thats nothing but putting
a piece of tape on it so you can count the turns CW or CCW. That
way you can put them back if need be.
73 Zeno:smoke:
LFOD !
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