https://imgur.com/WvpxRTp

i know these px suck but I found this locally and I'm tempted to get it, but can find NOTHING about it, even with the MO# info from the back :o

https://imgur.com/HovvPWO
https://imgur.com/k54TvR3
https://imgur.com/wXwRzpB

what is it, who REALLY made it?

Philco? RCA?

if I cant find service info on it, it's just parts, I'd rater restore it.

any help welcome!
thanks!

SAMS lists a GE M939ACD:
https://www.samswebsite.com/en/photofact/search?t=model&o=0&k=m+939+acd&submit=Search&s=Search

The back cover and front control layout resemble this GE in a Shango066 video, which he identified as a CTC-15 clone.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=kTesct_7uOA

thanks! I guess I was looking up the MO# in sections, not as a whole :/

that's why I got nothing :(

I have the Photofact in PDF if needed.

thanks! I guess I was looking up the MO# in sections, not as a whole :/

that's why I got nothing :(
If you miss it, you're not missing much.
That thing's a dog. I scrapped one. The only good thing about it was the RCA 21FBP22 HI Lite CRT which was perfect!
The CRT was used in a much more deserving set, a Zenith 23NC**. The last roundie Zenith made.
The set isn't an RCA clone, a lot different.

Personally if I had more space I'd be interested in picking that set up... from what I understand they were sort of like a portacolor with a transformer power supply and traditional roundy sweep circuits.
The worst limiting factor of picture quality in the portacolor was the coarse dot pitch CRT...the roundys didn't have that limitation... There's a LOT LESS GE roundys surviving than RCA or Zenith so IMO they are worth preserving more than the RCA designed off brand clones.

The premium sets are nice to collect, but you can't fully appreciate a Dumont till you've experienced a Muntz.

Well, it's about 50 miles away from me, much closer than the stromberg carlson x-21 was, so I guess it's worth a try!

The GE Portacolors had two different CRTs: 11SP22 and the 11WP22. The early 11SP22 had the coarse dot pitch and the later 11WP22 had a much finer dot pitch - a much better picture. I owned one of each.

Personally if I had more space I'd be interested in picking that set up... from what I understand they were sort of like a portacolor with a transformer power supply and traditional roundy sweep circuits.
The worst limiting factor of picture quality in the portacolor was the coarse dot pitch CRT...the roundys didn't have that limitation... There's a LOT LESS GE roundys surviving than RCA or Zenith so IMO they are worth preserving more than the RCA designed off brand clones.

The premium sets are nice to collect, but you can't fully appreciate a Dumont till you've experienced a Muntz.
Actually, the GE KC and KD chassis is a glorified Portacolor!
The AC chassis set is a bit different using 6AU8's in the color circuit.
It's worth looking the schematic! IIRC, they made a rectangular set with a similar chassis.

Electronic M, your comment about not fully appreciating a DuMont until you have experienced a Muntz reminds me of my first high school job in a garage. A 1959 Rambler came in and I got the job to fix it. I groused a little bit about doing it and one of the other mechanics said I couldn't appreciate working on a Lincoln until I worked on a few Ramblers! He was right.

The CA chassis had a CTC15 clone look to it in many ways but GE revised some most circuits to use their tubes. i.e. 6BH11, 6FM7 etc.

I saw one of the CA or CB sets on an episode of "Mister Ed" when Wilbur brought home
a color TV one day, in an Italian Provincial IIRC.

I trained on a CX chassis, almost 50 years ago. It was RCA made, and seemed to be close to the CTC-12, with a few elements of the CTC-15. I think that was the last RCA chassis that they used.

well, I'm close to having it in my paws!

It's mine!

:banana:

https://imgur.com/6uhmLi7
very bad cataract
https://i.imgur.com/VuWhH0y.jpg
https://imgur.com/vSwF40g
https://imgur.com/Yty9iP5
reg cap is loose fitting, falls off easily.
https://imgur.com/N9dESJM

https://imgur.com/b1TBULo
https://imgur.com/rQgBKXh

now that is VERY stupid...
rather than replacing a bad socket, someone soldered the wire to the focus pin of the CRT? WTF? :thumbsdn:

https://imgur.com/58xIKOB
blue is a bit low, but the CRT is not dead, not as strong as the one in my CTC-16xl, but could be worse.
gonna let it sit a bit and wake up

Definitely needs a lot of work...
https://imgur.com/FYKd8kn

Screens at max for this, brightness ctl has almost no effect,
NO color, just causes green hue on screen. ( huge feeling of déjà vu here :o )

many dirty pots,

most tubes original.

screen should be much brighter given what my CRT tester showed me.

Set is most likely full of leaky caps.

The only thing that I wonder now is, what kind of cataract am I dealing with here, someone said that the CRT was a RCA type, but CRT so far has no markings or labels on it, so I'm not sure who made it.

The only thing that I wonder now is, what kind of cataract am I dealing with here, someone said that the CRT was a RCA type, but CRT so far has no markings or labels on it, so I'm not sure who made it.

Sent from my VS501 using Tapatalk

It's an RCA style with that hard white moldy halo cataract other brands (like a NOS channel Master CRT I've got) had RCA style cataracts too.
Zenith types cataracts (also found in other brands like Sylvania) develop a gummy green halo.

RCA and Zenith evenly split about %85 of the TV market in the 50s-70's so people tend to name the 2 cataract types after the 2 brands each is most often found in.

The gummy ones can be cut with guitar string (my favorite method). All will be affected by heat (which can be dangerous) and some Will come off with water.

It's an RCA style with that hard white moldy halo cataract other brands (like a NOS channel Master CRT I've got) had RCA style cataracts too.
Zenith types cataracts (also found in other brands like Sylvania) develop a gummy green halo.

RCA and Zenith evenly split about %85 of the TV market in the 50s-70's so people tend to name the 2 cataract types after the 2 brands each is most often found in.

The gummy ones can be cut with guitar string (my favorite method). All will be affected by heat (which can be dangerous) and some Will come off with water.

I'm still wondering what to do with this one,
as mentioned, it should be much brighter given how it tested on my tester, it almost but not quite as good testing as the one in my 16xl and it is VERY bright with bias at lowest setting and screens hardly turned up, so SOMETHING is not right here...
strangely this set has no CRT bias setting, and another odd thing I have seen that when shut off, there is a bright flash of raster seen on the screen as it powers down, IE screen is dark when on, shut off it gets brighter for a second as just as the sweep collapses, telling me there is most likely a bunch of electronic stuff to fix.

I wonder if I should try soaking this cataract, or would that even work on it?

but first things first, ( Hana Yori Dango ) , i need to finish the SC tv before I really start this one! :)

This is just pure speculation at this point, as I have only had the set on for about 30 min to evaluate it, and not even pulled the chassis yet.

I have no idea why they chose not to put the CRT bias in like RCA does.
https://i.imgur.com/6XruNV1.jpg
it's hard wired to the lowest setting via the 47k resistor R170, that is the area that in RCA sets that the bias switch is, that has dif resistors to change the bias, if R170 has gone up in value, it would no doubt cause a dim screen even with a good CRT.

once I start working on this, I will most likely replace that with a 50K 2 watt Pot, that will give me a way to adjust CRT bias on this thing.

What is the normal range of bias voltage? I would be cautious about using a pot if the voltage is high. Parts in this area might have to withstand momentary CRT arcs too.

Well, I can just go ahead a stick the proper switch in there and resistors to go with it, there IS a place for it in this chassis, it was just not put in, also gonna have to find a new CRT socket that is NOT overpriced. :/

looking a bit better!

https://imgur.com/eCBI6Us
color works!

I tacked a 75k ohm resistor across the 47k one to bring the bias up a bit, tha made things a bit brighter, for now.

I most likely wont have to resort to this after I go over things and replace out of tol caps and resistors.

CRT sockets removed from old brightners are usually cheap.

OK, What I think I'm gonna do with this CRT is, get a cheap kiddie pool, stick it in my shed, fill it with water, and a bit of ethylene glycol , take the CRT, remove the tape covering the sealed area, perhaps pick away some of the bad cataract with a spudger tool around the edge, and let it sit... and sit.

chassis removed...

it is a lot lighter than the CTC-16 is :o

https://i.imgur.com/efQcOV0.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/63XTKUJ.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/CdsulOR.jpg

ummm, that USED to be a thermistor... :tears:

but i doubt it's the reason alone for the diim screen,

The 2 main filter caps in the voltage doubler already seems dodgy , should be 2x 160 uf but they check 1 at 182uf and the other at 194uf,, seems unbalanced to me.
160uf is hard to get, gonna get a fresh pair of 180 uf.

These values are within 20% of nominal and should be just fine in that regard.

If they are the originals, the main thing to worry about is leakage/failure, but those capacitance measurements look OK.

Unfortunately, I have no real way to test the electrolytic capacitors for leakage. :(

I do have testers, a cheapy Mega328 LCR-T4 Transistor Tester, 2 DVMs that test caps, and a more pricey LCR meter, and all tell me generally the same thing within 3%-5% of each other when I test caps with them.

The Mega328 is the only one that shows any kind of leakage reading at all, but being powered from a 9v battery I don't put much faith in it for a accurate leak test for 200v+ caps.

And granted, when I DID power up and run this set, it was on for over 40 min, and all the electrolytic capacitors cans were still cool to the touch, so I guess that is a good sign that the are OK, not leaky.

And unlike my CTC-16XL, which had all the resistors replaced on the chroma/luminance PCB
everything in this one is all original, so I got to check it all. :o

https://imgur.com/RiRALCS

OK :D
Lets see how long this takes!
It is literally floating in the bathtub. :o

It SAYS GE on the tube but it still looks a lot like a RCA tube.
but unlike with my CTC-16XL, I had to remove the bracket around it cause it in the way if the safety glass.

Does it have a label with an EIA number?

Does it have a label with an EIA number?

Yes. E.I.A. 274.

EIA 274 was RCA.
http://www.thespeakershop.com/speakerrepair/eiacodes.html

I recall a set with the CA chassis showing up in HS shop that looked in perfect condition, raster nice and sharp without a cateract - those days long ago, a roundie was a special set even then.

BUT the red gun was nearly dead or maybe another student zapped it with the tester-rejuv before I got to it. It sat there after that, waiting for a donor CRT. It really seemed worth the trouble based on every other measure.

No surprise that your CRT is RCA Hi-lite, being a year earlier than a CB-21" chassis GE that I worked on.

CB-21 was GE's last 21" round set, it had the original CRT and it was pretty decent emission like yours seems to be, the CRT label was well-hidden too. :D

IMHO, your CA will make better color than that '66 model did due to fact RCA circuits were used in the CA, but GE went full-on porta-color with the CB.

There was a FY-chassis for 1964, like the CTC-15 but I would jump for a CTC11 clone, the CW. I never saw one of those either.:sigh:

The cushioning material that was between the CRT and the retention band has deteriorated, (looks to be some kind of thin cork almost ).
And I know that when I put the thing back in, that having metal on glass is just about as bad as “crossing the streams” in Ghostbusters, so I wonder what would be a good substance to replace it with? That is not too costly?

Does the cushion go all around, or only a few points?

Arts n crafts stores often cary thin coark and or felt.

BTW I assume you mean mounting band instead of tension band. A mounting band will have tension adjusting bolts that allow you to easily and safely loosen the band and slip it off.
A tension band is mechanically tensioned in a non-adjustable way.

Mounting bands often have padding, but tension bands usually don't have any padding....also tension bands don't come off unless cut off and tension band CRTs usually implode after the band is cut off.

the padding was only on a few points,
https://imgur.com/wD1EKaZ

i tried to get a good pic of it... but SOMEONE got in the way, and changed the focal point of the shot at the last moment.

I would have left it on. but as you can see, that little tab on the bottom would not let the safety glass come off.

I guess if the original is cork, then that's the best.

Someone had to go and claim it as their own...
https://i.imgur.com/5hIaaam.jpg

So far, I have not found any really bad resistors yet, although I have just barely started checking, a few were CLOSE to the upper 20% limit, but not by much, I'm still gonna replace the ones around the brightness & contrast controls with new 2% ones, as well as the ones near the 6GU7 Y-AMPS and H-blanker, and most likely the drop caps near those tubes, as they were REALLY cooked in my CTC-16, and acting up, NOT gonna touch the IF and colorburst/ demod as they seem to be OK.

So, perhaps the dim screen was caused by the weak thermistor, causing power to be shunted through the degaussing coil, though I did not see that in the screen at the time, I guess I will not know until I get the CRT back in and fire it up again.

And once I do that, I can go and check for weak parts in the sweep PCB, as well.

I've been trying for some time to see your photos on Imgur.com, but it doesn't work. The imgur.com page shows up for about five seconds, then disappears. I tried disabling tracking, still doesn't work.

I've been trying for some time to see your photos on Imgur.com, but it doesn't work. The imgur.com page shows up for about five seconds, then disappears. I tried disabling tracking, still doesn't work.


not sure why, others can, that I have sent links to, and I can see them from other locations when not logged in. odd.

not sure why, others can, that I have sent links to, and I can see them from other locations when not logged in. odd.

i even tried getting on this site anonymously from my cell, and I could still see them, not sure why you cant :o

Thought you might like to see what a NOS CTC16X board looks like before it gets cooked.

Thought you might like to see what a NOS CTC16X board looks like before it gets cooked.

I thought those were unobtanium! :scratch2:

I have replaced all the resistors in the video output area, 2 of them were most like out of tol, as they were 10% ones and they tested out of the 10% range, not sure how much that matters. but they must have had 10% in there for a reason and not 20% like every place else.
I also replaced 1 orange drop that may have been flaky.

The cataract on the 21fjp22 in the GE set has been removed :P
but it's now a 21FBP22... :tears:

https://i.imgur.com/CiFcyr0.jpg

here is my new cataract free "21FBP22"...

and this is mess I made doing it . :(
https://i.imgur.com/1Jdtyha.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/pfo5lwV.jpg

new pads on mounting bracket, now also CAT-A R-act free, for now.

https://i.imgur.com/QlvvjAb.jpg

CRT installed

https://i.imgur.com/0WkjdtZ.jpg

convergence asy and purity magnets NOT on at this point.

HV is a little low, about 21kv HOT & HV rect may be tired ( orig tubes )

all pots cleaned now

EDIT
NOS tubes for HOT and HV rect ordered, I'm kind of surprised that they were still the orig GE ones in there, given that how hard they are driven, once I get them hopefully I can get it to around 24kv where it should be.

https://i.imgur.com/CiFcyr0.jpg

here is my new cataract free "21FBP22"...

and this is mess I made doing it . :(
https://i.imgur.com/1Jdtyha.jpg
The cataract on the 21fjp22 in the GE set has been removed :P
but it's now a 21FBP22... :tears:
Not really...The 21FBP22 had a safety glass by design, but it wasn't glued to the screen. The safety glass on a FBP is held on by the front fingers of the mounting band and a rubber gasket around the perimeter.
Really it's a still 21FJP22 just without a safety glass.

I've done a few 21FJP to FBP conversions and I always reinstall a safety glass...but not always the one it came with...

I feel your pain. The majority of RCA cataract removals I've done ended up like that...It sucks having broken glass and in my case having to come up with replacement safety glass (though the first couple of times I was lucky enough to have dud CRTs to pirate from).
Did this happen from a slip up with the water method?

Not really...The 21FBP22 had a safety glass by design, but it wasn't glued to the screen. The safety glass on a FBP is held on by the front fingers of the mounting band and a rubber gasket around the perimeter.
Really it's a still 21FJP22 just without a safety glass.

I've done a few 21FJP to FBP conversions and I always reinstall a safety glass...but not always the one it came with...

I feel your pain. The majority of RCA cataract removals I've done ended up like that...It sucks having broken glass and in my case having to come up with replacement safety glass (though the first couple of times I was lucky enough to have dud CRTs to pirate from).
Did this happen from a slip up with the water method?


Yes, I was removing some of the white gunky stuff from around the edges with spudger tool Friday, I got a lot out, and I stuck 4 of them across from each other between the safety glass and tube in order to open the gap a bit more, I could see the gap flexing as I did, but as it was being out back into the water, one spudger bumped the edge of the tube and the safety glass cracked.

Sucks, but no REAL big deal, was able to get the rest off w/o too much trouble, and as I have nothing to replace it with, and am very unlikely to ever get one, I put it in as-is.

Looks pretty OK.

Right now, I'm more zeroed in on the HV problem, why I can't get it to 24kv like it should be, if I try, focus goes to hell, which MAY be because the CRT socket is crappy, and all carbon arced around the pin for focus, AND/OR as mentioned the HOT/HV rect tubes are all old, new socket and tubes ordered.

Am also seeing symptoms of bad caps in the Y amps, the level of red is jumping all over the place, just like blue was before I replaced them in my CTC-16

Although I am working on the video circuits right now, and getting them up to par, and will move on to sweep later, I do wonder what could be causing that odd tilt to the left at the top of the screen, horizontal problem? Vertical? Pincushion?

Looking at https://imgur.com/0WkjdtZ I don't see a tilt?

The bend in the vertical lines is probably due to non-standard sync from the pattern generator. Just check that it goes away with a better source - DVD player or cable box.

Looking at https://imgur.com/0WkjdtZ I don't see a tilt?

The bend in the vertical lines is probably due to non-standard sync from the pattern generator. Just check that it goes away with a better source - DVD player or cable box.

here is the same pattern generator on my CTC-16XL
https://imgur.com/jtYPypZ
And on a SS sony,
https://imgur.com/O7D8fqq

I guess it could be that this set just does not like it.

Try adjusting your horizontal hold on your GE. You will most likely get rid of the bending. My dot-bar generator I used for 20 years did the same thing. If I wanted the top of the cross hatch to look good, I just adjusted the horizontal hold slightly.

I believe I have found something

https://i.imgur.com/MLth8s2.jpg

the signal going into pin 2 ( Sams got it wrong ) of V5 is hardly 6v PtP, should be 8.5, this is no doubt a cause of dim video,
https://i.imgur.com/VoNAr6d.jpg
signal going into pin one V4 point B is almost 5v PtP, I don't have another 6LF8 to try, I have one on the way, the one in there is also an original GE. it is obviously not working as it should be.

While I wait for the new one, I will check the resistors and caps around there as well.

Good thing that happened today is that the CRT socket came and is wired in, BAD thing is, the thermistor did NOT come, even though USPS SAYS that it did,,, they LIE.

Now that the new CRT socket came in, focus is now a lot more stable, the focus voltage was literately trying to corona into the carbon burned areas of the old one, and with the new high voltage rectifier, (3AT2) , I'm able to get to almost 23kv, the HOT is not here yet.
Still no idea what happened with the thermistor I ordered, I'm gonna be very pissed if USPS lost it and said it was delivered anyway, it was one of the last few of that type to be found.
And as mentioned, I will have to wait till I get the new 6LF8 to try and find out the video level is about 30% or more below where it should be, I KNOWthat it's not the video output, 12BY7A, cause I had more than 1 known good one, and tried that first, but the only other 6LF8 I have is in my CTC-16XL, and I'm not about to go yanking it out right now.

could not resist
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-E_g_GIEHAo
had to show some video
the bars on the sides was made by the dvd creation process, it also borked the sound.

damn, it seems the shadow mask is flawed on this tube :o
https://i.imgur.com/95YrwNE.jpg

can only be seen when there is an image on the screen.
What does RCA do? give their failed stuff to others to sell?

Phosphor defect. Theyre pretty common on color tubes atleast the ones I have.

could not resist
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-E_g_GIEHAo
had to show some video
the bars on the sides was made by the dvd creation process, it also borked the sound.

It's too bad Eddie VanHalen passed.

Phosphor/shadow mask defects are not uncommon especially in early color sets. By the mid 60s things were better but lower tier brands still would have grade B CRTs into the early 70s. I've got a late 60s Airline rectangular with similar defects on its original CRT.

You can sometimes find primo sets with the issue when the CRT has been swapped.... Normally customer sets would get grade A or B CRTs but repair shops that would do slap dash reconditioning on trade ins to resell them would sometimes use grade B and C CRTs since margins were tight.

https://i.imgur.com/ggGHBP3.jpg

cooked and leaky, just like the ones I took out of my CTC-16XL

https://i.imgur.com/0ze8p2E.jpg

and I did say the HOT looked tired :O

new one SHOULD be here sat.

Just how accurate are the resistance readings on the SAMs for the tube socket points?

Example, it says pin 7 of the 1st amp should be about 150 ohms, and it's about 640 ohms, and the wave there says it should be 2.5 ptp and it was 5v, and should be -..3 and it was -5v.

And the PtP input for the 2nd video amp should be 1.8 PtP and it was just under 1.

I'm still waiting for the new 6LF8...

Assuming the SAMS numbers are not typos, I would expect within +/-20% or maybe 25% worst case (trying to allow for parts tolerances, tube variations, tolerance of your meter, etc.). But also watch out for circuits that have variable resistance, like contrast or brightness controls. If SAMS tells you how they are to be set, do that, but if not, vary them and see if you can get the specified reading at some setting. For example, if the video detector output p-p is wrong, is it because of AGC adjustment?

There is definitely something wrong with the 1st video amp, be it the tube or related circuit, for the plate voltage, which SHOULD be about 150v, is right now at 260v.
Hopefully, the new tube, which was last scanned in Florida, will fix all this.

General observations of the GE M939ACD.
Although it's considered to be a CTC-15 clone, this one is closer to the CTC-16, using a 6LF6 for the 1st & 2nd video amp and not a 6AW8A, The IF is an odd mix of both the 15 & 16.
The video detector circuit (diode, coils, resistors, etc ) is exactly what's in the 16.
The input wave on pin 7 of the 1st video amp was 5v PtP, and the volts was -5 Sams says the wave should be 2.5v ( this is most likely irreverent) .
The cathode resistor on pin 6 checked OK at 21 ohms.
Plate voltage on pin 9 is way too high by over 100v, R56, 10k,10w plate resistor OK. ( suspect bad tube), C33 color link cap OK.
Cap/resistor link to 2nd amp OK, peaking coil here is good, vertical blanking injection point on grid of 2nd video amp seems OK, but have not fully checked all caps/ resistors in the line yet, signal here is 30%-40% below what it should be, grid and plate voltages are nominal.
Delay line & following coil OK, tieback/feedback point ( resistors and coil) to AGC/ SYNC SEP OK, but have not checked the 40uf cap in that circuit yet, most likely OK, but will check.
ALL resistors for brightness & contrast have been replaced, including R66, the 680k one that's tied to the strong horz pulse, never quite understood what this does, but it's on all versions, if I get no improvement in brightness after getting 1st / 2nd video amps up to par, I will start looking caps in this area,
there is an obvious error in the Sams for the GE, the pulse from the FBT at the horz blanker is shown to be 145 PtP, that clearly should be 245v, based on what it is on all other versions and what I read in this on on my scope.

Assuming the SAMS numbers are not typos, I would expect within +/-20% or maybe 25% worst case (trying to allow for parts tolerances, tube variations, tolerance of your meter, etc.). But also watch out for circuits that have variable resistance, like contrast or brightness controls. If SAMS tells you how they are to be set, do that, but if not, vary them and see if you can get the specified reading at some setting. For example, if the video detector output p-p is wrong, is it because of AGC adjustment?

https://i.imgur.com/k1AuqAi.png
Right now, the only adjustment that I think would have any effect resistance wise of pin 7 of the 1st video amp would be the R22 pot, sound reject, but I have no reason to touch it at this point, so I guess I will ignore the high ohm reading for now.

If you follow all the DC paths from pin 7 (grid) to ground, you see 5600 ohms in parallel with 8200 ohms and all that in parallel with the video detector diode and a few small coils. Because of the diode, I'd bet you get a different reading if you reverse your meter leads or even if you use a different ohmmeter, depending on the voltage of the meter's internal supply and its polarity.

If you follow all the DC paths from pin 7 (grid) to ground, you see 5600 ohms in parallel with 8200 ohms and all that in parallel with the video detector diode and a few small coils. Because of the diode, I'd bet you get a different reading if you reverse your meter leads or even if you use a different ohmmeter, depending on the voltage of the meter's internal supply and its polarity.


Yes, Sams did say it was Dependent on polarity and with positive to gnd, it's much higher, I guess they took that with a VTVM, who knows, I only have digital ones, the new tube should be he Sat, if USPS does not screw that up too, we will see what happens.

What I don't get is that 10k 10w resistor on the plate power line to the first video amp, what is it doing with that much power?

What does the following circuit look like and what is the p-p voltage supposed to be?

Anyway, the DC voltage across the 10k ohm is 400-250 = 250.
250 squared divided by 10k is 6.25 watts.

Wondering if they really needed a 400 volt supply for this stage, or if it was the only thing they had, so a high-wattage resistor was cheaper than supplying a special lower voltage.

What does the following circuit look like and what is the p-p voltage supposed to be?

Anyway, the DC voltage across the 10k ohm is 400-250 = 250.
250 squared divided by 10k is 6.25 watts.

Wondering if they really needed a 400 volt supply for this stage, or if it was the only thing they had, so a high-wattage resistor was cheaper than supplying a special lower voltage.

they basically carbon copied everything from the CTC-16
https://i.imgur.com/hzAFBB0.png
as seen here
it was easier to grab that
another thing noticed, voltage on pin 8 is also way too high, as is the source (110 in the GE 100 in the RCA) it is WAY over, 260v and shoots higher when tube is removed. Again pointing to faulty tube I think, in this GE, the 110 is sourced from the 380v source through a 47k 1 w resistor and tied to a 2uf filter, and goes to only 2 points, that grid of the 1st amp, and here, https://i.imgur.com/yKyOtr1.png
there is nothing else to pull that voltage down to 110v :o

new tube DID make a difference!:D:yes:
https://i.imgur.com/LCvoOvu.jpg
still having problems with the R-Y amp... :(


the 110v source is still too high, not sure why, and if i should do something about it or ignore it.

https://i.imgur.com/mwlBIUK.jpg
Still not sure why the R-Y amp keeps acting up, but then again I have only replaced 1 cap, the film one c133, 136 is a disc, which COULD go bad, but it is rare for them to do so, but I will replace it anyway, It is unlikely to be any of the high power resistors, but the 3 small 1/4 watt ones will be replaced as well, and HOPEFULLY it will behave after that, it's unlikely to be coming from the X-demod, because the problem is ONLY seen on the red, and still happens when color is turned down, fluctuation in red level on the screen.

Focus is still a bit odd, I really do not like the CTC-15 version of focus, which is used in this set, I can't turn up high voltage beyond 21k without losing the ability to focus the screen, if I keep it there, I can focus it fine, any higher, it goes out of range, I guess 21k will have to be good enough, IDk, the only thing I can think of is perhaps that huge 66meg pulldown resistor in the focus circuit is starting to go up a bit in value, or something else is causing the focus bias to be a little bit too high, don't really want to mess with it at this point.

What symptoms can you measure on the red or R-Y? Voltages that jump around? If it's only the red that's changing on the screen, it may not be the G1 circuits, because the R-Y, G-Y and B-Y amps are connected to each other's cathodes and all should change if there's something wrong with one of them. It could be G2 voltage instead.

I would also check for dirty pots or dirty sockets.

What symptoms can you measure on the red or R-Y? Voltages that jump around? If it's only the red that's changing on the screen, it may not be the G1 circuits, because the R-Y, G-Y and B-Y amps are connected to each other's cathodes and all should change if there's something wrong with one of them. It could be G2 voltage instead.


I'd have to look more closely.
the only reason I suspected the R-Y, G-Y and B-Y amps is that my CTC-16xl did this exact same thing, but on blue, and it was fixed by replacing the film caps the feed the input to the 6GU7s, but that did not work this time. :tears:

OK, this just got a bit more confusing....
I have been looking at the schematics for the CTC-15 , and saw that they have a 1m dropping resistor on the output of the focus line, as can be seen in a diagram here, http://www.videokarma.org/showthread.php?t=270396&highlight=focus

ALL others that use the tube for a rectifier, IE the CTC- 16(X)/20 and so on, have a 4.7 meg in them.

But for some unknown reason, the GE has a 4.7 meg and not a 1meg... If it has the same FBT and selenium rectifier / focus circuity as the CTC-15, which it sure looks like it does, why does it have a 4.7 meg and not a 1 meg?? :o
should I just leave it or put in a lower value? :/

At this point, I would suspect that 66 megohm resistor; that used to be a common service part. Do you have a meter that will measure that high?

I would also check all of the resistors and capacitors in the demodulator and amp circuit. That end of the board runs hot; loose connections and fried components were common.

As you have noticed, the "Brown Drop" capacitors are failing leaky now.

color problem fixed....
I hope,, it has fooled me a few times now, by coming and going, replaced another resistor and cap.
if it comes back, I will keep looking.
https://i.imgur.com/rbQDd8h.jpg
and the flaw in the screen IS from the shadow mask! :o
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YlOXXTF8pPY

because the dot changes!

and yes, I am also suspecting the 66 meg resistor, but I'm not sure if it's worth the trouble getting a new one right now.

The red gun problem continues to be elusive, as it is intermittent, seeming to happen more when cold, and working fine when warm, the main symptoms are red horizontal bands most prominently seen with color turned up, this can be seen in the VH video posted earlier, however, it can also be seen with color turned all the way down, another symptom is that is that occasionally red output will jump up so high that it's brighter than all other guns and red retrace lines are seen, but again, only to calm down and work fine after warming up for about 10-15 min.
Adjusting the red screen pot has no effect on it when it's acting up.

Work done so far...
all pots cleaned,- deoxit
tube sockets cleaned - deoxit
inspected for broken solder joints, found none, will look closer.

new parts so far... ref schematic posted before.
C133
C136
R190
C132
C131
V18
V19
HOT
HV RECT
CRT SOCKET
---
will keep looking, I have tons of new resistors (2%) 1/2 watt, and generic film caps to try.

A "new" 66meg resistor has been ordered, as I could not accurately test the one in there, my only gripe is, that you can't get to it w/o removing the FBT from the cage, so I will replace it later.

The red gun problem continues to be elusive, as it is intermittent, seeming to happen more when cold, and working fine when warm, the main symptoms are red horizontal bands most prominently seen with color turned up, this can be seen in the VH video posted earlier, however, it can also be seen with color turned all the way down, another symptom is that is that occasionally red output will jump up so high that it's brighter than all other guns and red retrace lines are seen, but again, only to calm down and work fine after warming up for about 10-15 min.
Adjusting the red screen pot has no effect on it when it's acting up.

Work done so far...
all pots cleaned,- deoxit
tube sockets cleaned - deoxit
inspected for broken solder joints, found none, will look closer.

new parts so far... ref schematic posted before.
C133
C136
R190
C132
C131
V18
V19
HOT
HV RECT
CRT SOCKET
---
will keep looking, I have tons of new resistors (2%) 1/2 watt, and generic film caps to try.

A "new" 66meg resistor has been ordered, as I could not accurately test the one in there, my only gripe is, that you can't get to it w/o removing the FBT from the cage, so I will replace it later.

If the cage is screwed down and not riveted it's probably better to pull the cage.

One other focus issue I've heard of on the 15 is the HV ceramic cap that tunes the focus coil developing bad power factor/ESR (the person who reported it used an old tuning eye type cap tester to find this) and not tuning the focus coil properly.

If the cage is screwed down and not riveted it's probably better to pull the cage.

One other focus issue I've heard of on the 15 is the HV ceramic cap that tunes the focus coil developing bad power factor/ESR (the person who reported it used an old tuning eye type cap tester to find this) and not tuning the focus coil properly.

That cap would be the big one in the cage, C141, 130PF @6KV, Sams clearly shows that a 150pf is a viable replacement, so I guess this should work,
mouser 75-HVCC153Y6P151MEAX
150pF 15kVDC 20%

...
Adjusting the red screen pot has no effect on it when it's acting up.


Sure sounds like an intermittent connection somewhere in red G2 circuit - may be anywhere all the way to the CRT socket.

Gonna re-cap after all. I saw a oddly high ripple in 400v & 380v lines of about 4.3 volts, and it should be GONE at this point, I tacked in a 10UF cap that I had and it all but vanished, and it LOOKED like the crawling color wave up the screen got better, not sure, could be tricking me again, IDK, but gonna stick new caps in and see what happens, I should NOT be seeing ripple at that point IMOH.

New caps on the way, including the HV one for the focus, the bug resistor is coming too, NOS.

looks rather OK when warmed up...
https://i.imgur.com/Cyg3ZtH.jpg
we shall see how it looks with the new parts..
I'm glad the CRT seems OK and strong, except for that DAMN weird mask flaw in the CENTER, of the screen :tears:, cause even if this chassis were to ever fail, ( hope not ) i have a spare tube for my CTC-16XL,
now that I do have this GE, and once done restoring it, the only problem is...
https://i.imgur.com/UbVSx6P.jpg
I'm running out of places to put them! :p

The peaking coils in this GE set are simply pathetic to say the least, most of them are simply coiled magnet wire tacked to a cardboard form with what seems to be enamel or wax, and soldered to 2 lugs to the PCB on each side, and on the majority of them, what was bonding the coil to the cardboard has failed and the coil is just hanging loose, risking destroying it due to vibration, I'm having to go and re-attach most of them down with silicone to protect them.
I have never seen coils like this before, and have no idea why GE chose to do this, other than it was cheaper, mostly the other types seen were wrapped around resistor type cores and covered in epoxy or high temp wax.


Recapping has started, main voltage doubler caps replaced and first 80uf out of bias choke coil, slight improvements in video seen so far.

Tracking SAYS that the new 66m resistor for the focus will be here Sat, ( we will see, ) I'm kind of surprised at how small the new 150pf (15kv) is over the old cap is in the focus circuit, 130pf (6kv), the old one is about the size of a 1/2 dollar coin, the new one is hardly the size of a dime! It's amazing how far capacitor technology has advanced since this TV was built.

I don't know what GE's TV engineering organization was like at that time. In the early 70s, the big two (RCA and Zenith) had three tiers: research, advanced development, and development. GE had four tiers, the fourth being cost reduction engineering. They did some surprising things, for example: where others used separate pots in metal cases for CRT RGB adjustment, GE developed a simpler assembly with three pots and no enclosures on a single thin phenolic substrate that plugged into the main circuit board. In other words, they didn't just look for cheaper parts, they engineered cheaper parts.

3:pm and as i thought, USPS has NOT delivered the 66meg resistor like they said they would... tracking still says,,, "Expected Delivery by 10/17/2020 8pm" but they have closed at 2:30... USPS has really gone to hell lately,,, I won't go into why here, they already lost my thermister, still pissed at that, they better not lose this too.

EDIT-
I most likely won't get it till Monday, ( i hope ) wasted weekend :(
anyway. here is how small the cap really is!
https://i.imgur.com/r5s7vAS.jpg

A few more caps replaced, ran for a couple hours with a scope on red g-y (grid1) and it still acted up after a while, :(
But I do think I really got something this time,,, I hope...
turned down the color, and did NOT see the clean static horz blanking pulse that I should have, there was still something there, some kind of noise, pulled out the x-demod, and it vanished, put it back in, and it came back. swapped Z with X tubes and it stayed gone :o for now.
I have new demod tubes ordered.
will see how it behaves wit them.

Still waiting for the new demod tubes, due sometime this week, all I know is that the problem is related to the X demodulator, wiggle the tube and the problem comes and goes, cleaning did NOT help, solder on socket OK, and it seems tight, will try to tighten, not sure if it can be, 150 ohm 5% resistor on cathode is out of tolerance, reading 164 ohms, where max acceptable is 157.50 ohms according to tolerance calculator, not sure if this, or this in combination to things is causing the problem, will replace it & the g2 resistor when I attempt to tighten the socket, the sockets, like most everything in this set, seem to be of low quality compared to like what RCA used, I'd hate to have to replace any of them due to the hell of unsoldering, let alone finding a exact drop-in replacement.

it just seems to be crappy sockets, cleaning did not work, tightening did not work, new tubes and resistors, no help... but when it acts up, all i have to do is touch the top of x-demod to get it to stop. :/
it's a shame, cause when it works. it looks really good.
https://i.imgur.com/V4c0t8D.jpg

I guess I will have to replace some sockets :tears:

The difference in the quality of the sockets used in the GE and RCA ( and others) is obvious, will try to post a pic later, I just don't hope too many have to be replaced, which begs the question, is there any easy way to get the damn things out w/o having to unsolder EACH AND EVERY pin from underneath, and risk burning traces, or , can someone take a dremel tool and cut free the the metal pathways from the top of the socket making easier to remove, needing only to unsolder the center ground post to remove the old bakelite socket, leaving the remains of the old pins behind to be removed easily one at a time, once the socket is out of the way, does this sound feasible?

the offending socket.
https://i.imgur.com/J86N1km.jpg
you can see how cheap it looks compared to the RCA types as posted in page 3 of this thread.

As mentioned, what I am HOPING to do is grind away the path between the bit that is soldered down and the part that grips the tube, then bend the tabs inward, so I can remove the entire socket by only unsoldering the center, and then remove the pins one by one, then clean up the mess the contact cleaner made. and put in new sockets.

What you describe as a method should be good. I realise it takes much patience. But doing it slowly and methodically should reward you.

I have replaced the 9-pin phenolic wafer PC sockets in an Allied Radio Knight-Kit amplifier, 6973 socket to be specific. They were roasted. But I was able to do essentially what you are describing slowly and it was a success. I replaced the wafer socket with an Amphenol black Bakelite socket. Interestingly, it fit just fine.

It's my understanding that Philco Predicta sockets tend to split at the 90 degree bend. I have that to look forward to since I have two Predictas in queue. (Presently working on my audio amplifiers)

I typically desolder all pins (I usually use a large spring loaded solder sucker and follow up with wick if necessary) and center then push it out from the bottom. It takes pretty thorough desoldering but can yield great results with care and patience.

If it's a water type PCB socket chopping it up pin by pin should be doable. Bakelite sockets usually don't leave enough space to get a pair of dikes in to cut the pins and the Bakelite is typically more solid than the PCB so crunching up a Bakelite socket risks cracking the PCB...most PCB sockets I have had to replace were Bakelite so desoldering is usually my safest approach.

Well, I have 4 new ceramic sockets ordered, and the tracking SAYS that they are 10 hours away from me, and will be here Saturday, not that I have any faith in that... :(
When they do come, I will attempt to replace sockets for the demodulators and Y-amps.
Will also put in new focus parts at the same time, meanwhile, I am attempting to make the crappy GE coils in the general area more stable. Pix soon.

Another odd problem with this set ( I'm sure there will be many ), is that from time to time it has a habit of losing sync for some reason, I have to laugh here, because it's very reminiscent of the RCA CTC-10A Sullivan that my parents had and my dad tossed because he did not want to put the effort into fixing, it had a similar problem, I can run it for quite some time w/o any problems 30-90 min even more then it just goes nuts, loses all sync, and won't lock in, shut down for 5 min, and it's fine again...

The AGC/SYNC SEP tube is an orig GE, new one on the way, I highly doubt that it's the horizontal phase detector in this set, because it's not a selenium rectifier pack, but 2 germanium diodes, and from what I hear, they rearely cause trouble.
I have not gone over the sweep PCB yet, but I will turn my attention to that once video is stable, but I do intend to replace the 40uf cap on the cathode of the AGC/SYNC SEP when I get the new tube.

ge coils before and after

https://i.imgur.com/DoARJAh.jpg

offending socket removed ....
https://i.imgur.com/dZUcbYg.jpg
damn that thing sure got hot under there to change the color like that :yikes:

https://i.imgur.com/Mioxqlq.jpg
new socket in place

new focus parts installed
https://i.imgur.com/0jiTxAy.jpg

the old resistor DID test a bit high, 73 meg, where the new one checked at 66.8 meg.

https://i.imgur.com/itcYSy6.jpg

new sockets seems to have worked :)
HV cage back together HV at 23kv focus is better.
this is the best it has looked so far! :banana:

I'm obviously dealing with cheap crappy parts here vs the better ones that RCA uses, the RED and sync STILL act up from time to time, still have not found the cause, can run for hours and be fine and suddenly act up.
Example, I suddenly lost audio, and after poking around a bit, found that there was 150 v on the input side of the volume control. :sigh:
https://i.imgur.com/Yyn2LHx.jpg
c52 a film cap had shorted :(
did not have the exact size on hand, pit in a .0047 and sound is back for now.

wonder what other time bombs are waiting for me in this thing...

The cost cutting at GE was very apparent in their 1960s products; the joke was that GE stood for Good Enough.

The cost cutting at GE was very apparent in their 1960s products; the joke was that GE stood for Good Enough.


Well, I'm becoming very VERY frustrated with the set, it will work fine for quite some time, an hour or two, and then crap out again... shut off for 5 min, and it is fine again, :tears: these damn intermittent fails are the worst...

As mentioned, this intermittent problem with level of the red gun is getting very frustrating, most likely due to bad parts that I have not found yet, but I'm not sure where to look, when it happens, all I have to do is tap the PCB to get it to stop, which is indicative of loose solder, but I have gone over the area 2 times, but it does not mean I could still have missed something.
https://i.imgur.com/mwlBIUK.jpg


v16,v17v19,v18& sockets replaced, r186,r187,r188,r189,r190,r181,r179,r180,r182,r183, r174,c133,c136, so far, the other caps, like the 33pf and the ones off the z-demod have not been changed yet, but will be soon.

However the problem seems to be more closer related to x-demod, for when it acts up, the spikes in the R-Y can be seen with color turned down, and stops when x-demod tube is removed.
It STILL may be related to the crappy GE coils, L27/L33, even though I removed them and checked them and re-mounted them, they are of poor quality and if they are a source of trouble, I'm not sure where to get matching replacements, because finding 2 coils of the exact value seems impossible.
There seems to be some leeway in what can be used, example, the parts list says it's 750uh, but calls out for the replacement to be 800uh, but the CTC-16, which has the same circuit, says it has a 620uh . So I am assuming there is some wiggle room in the value of those coils, as long as the 2 match.
What I may do in the mean time is swap their positions, and see if anything changes.

L27/L33 are peaking coils that resonate with the input capacitance of the following amplifiers to improve color transient response. As such, the values are not super critical. It is a good idea to use two coils of the same nominal value, though. The strength of resonance and its frequency depend on all the capacitance at the amplifier inputs, including stray capacitance, and Miller capacitance of the triode amplifiers; so it is already variable to some degree.

funny how the waveforms don't ever look quite like they show on the sams...
for example..
the R-Y output with color turned down.
https://i.imgur.com/BSJ5KpG.jpg

and with color up lost in space video...
https://i.imgur.com/5eI2bqn.jpg

will try to grab it when it acts up.

and BOOM!
https://i.imgur.com/rLZv8JY.jpg

here it is acting up!

tap the PCB and it stops :tears:

Quick - check if it's also varying at the B-Y and G-Y - remember all three stages are connected through the cathode circuits. Could be a problem in the cathode circuit or could be in R-Y only but coupling back to the others.

Then look for variation at the inputs to the amplifiers.

Efit - if no problem at the inputs, then you know it must be in the cathodes or the plate circuit of R-Y.

Quick - check if it's also varying at the B-Y and G-Y - remember all three stages are connected through the cathode circuits. Could be a problem in the cathode circuit or could be in R-Y only but coupling back to the others.

Then look for variation at the inputs to the amplifiers.

Efit - if no problem at the inputs, then you know it must be in the cathodes or the plate circuit of R-Y.

OK this is just getting Weirder and Weirder...

It's MOSTLY seen on the R-Y output, slightly on green and not at all on blue, and Yes, I do see it on the cathodes of the tubes I have the scope lead on the 270 ohm 3 watt resistor and I see it there, when it acts up.

Next target is the 33pf caps ( have to order some ) and the decoupling caps on the Z-demod, I really HOPE I don't have to replace the coils :/

Could it be a bad socket connection on the R-Y amp?

I notice the blanking pulse is changing. If that's not happening equally on the G-Y and B-Y, it can't be the pulse itself, so it seems it must be something only or mainly in the R-Y section. Also, the X and Z demods don't have blanking pulses applied, so I'd guess it can't be them.

Could it be a bad socket connection on the R-Y amp?

I notice the blanking pulse is changing. If that's not happening equally on the G-Y and B-Y, it can't be the pulse itself, so it seems it must be something only or mainly in the R-Y section. Also, the X and Z demods don't have blanking pulses applied, so I'd guess it can't be them.

I thought It may be sockets at first, so I got all new ones for the y-amps and demod tubes, nice good ceramic ones.

I have just ordered the 33pf caps, and when I pit them in I will swap the places of the coils and replace everything else in the area that I have not also replaced yet and go over every point this time and cut them shorter and re-solder them again.. to try and get rid of any pos hidden oxides

OK this is just getting Weirder and Weirder...

It's MOSTLY seen on the R-Y output, slightly on green and not at all on blue, and Yes, I do see it on the cathodes of the tubes I have the scope lead on the 270 ohm 3 watt resistor and I see it there, when it acts up.

Next target is the 33pf caps ( have to order some ) and the decoupling caps on the Z-demod, I really HOPE I don't have to replace the coils :/

If the set has the standard R-Y B-Y demodulators then the G signal is derived from both of those and luminance so any error in those signals propagates to the green channel.

I'm becoming highly suspect of L33 now, and/or the 33pf cap's reaction to it, I would like to replace both, but as mentioned, when I did a search, I could only find 1 of any given value, and not a given pair of 800uh or 750uh, etc.
Once the new 33pf caps come in ( hopefully today) it may behave better, perhaps things are just so on edge with the thing that the circuit tends to oscillate, and things like changes in temperature, wiggling a tube, tapping on the pcb can start/stop it – just a guess.

I replaced a few more 10% resistors last night with new 2% ones, even though they seemed OK, and again did not see any obvious solder problems, though it is hard to tell with this thing.

Will put in the new caps in the next day or so, but not tonight, too much of a nail-biter going on tonight! :o
but I am wondering about one thing, and this is the same in most RCA CTC color tvs, why is there decoupling capacitors on the power lines for the Z-demod (plate/g2) but not the X? Why not both? :o

As to decoupling caps, just looking at RCA schematics, the answer is that the caps appear to
be connected directly to the B+ line, with no intervening decoupling resistors.

Since X and Z demods are close together on the circuit boards, one cap is about
equal distances from both, and its just by accident which tube its closer to on the schematic.

I found one schematic that had a cap on each ... but they are quite different values,
in parallel.

...
but I am wondering about one thing, and this is the same in most RCA CTC color tvs, why is there decoupling capacitors on the power lines for the Z-demod (plate/g2) but not the X? Why not both? :o

Look closely - that is a common 260 v supply point for both X and Z. Both 3900 ohm plate resistors connect to that capacitor.

Now if I REALLY wanted to get silly here, I could grab a handful of 6181 JW MILLER VIDEO PEAKING COILS (250 uh) and stick 3 in series to get 750 uh, (I have found I can get them in bulk, )
And from what I have seen, putting them in series does work, but I'm not sure how the circuit will react to it, so I'll leave it as a last resort.

Now if I REALLY wanted to get silly here, I could grab a handful of 6181 JW MILLER VIDEO PEAKING COILS (250 uh) and stick 3 in series to get 750 uh, (I have found I can get them in bulk, )
And from what I have seen, putting them in series does work, but I'm not sure how the circuit will react to it, so I'll leave it as a last resort.



i was 1/2 serious about that , really, does that sound doable? I really hate those GE coils...

Just get a 680 or 820 uH coil from Mouser, little axial ones from Bourns (who bought Miller) or API Delavan. I've used lots of those for peaking and they work fine. Do note that any non-exact (even ones suggested by RCA as non-exact replacements don't apply) replacement simply won't work exactly as specified because it will have
a different self resonant frequency. Get a coil with a high one and
you can add a gimmick cap in parallel if you are really picky. Of course, a CTC11 is not a CTC2 or CTC2B with critical color peaking coils.

Just get a 680 or 820 uH coil from Mouser, little axial ones from Bourns (who bought Miller) or API Delavan. I've used lots of those for peaking and they work fine. Do note that any non-exact (even ones suggested by RCA as non-exact replacements don't apply) replacement simply won't work exactly as specified because it will have
a different self resonant frequency. Get a coil with a high one and
you can add a gimmick cap in parallel if you are really picky. Of course, a CTC11 is not a CTC2 or CTC2B with critical color peaking coils.

the closest I could find is, mouser 652-9250A-824-RC

so they should be OK?
I have never replaced coils with new types like this before :o

Well, those 2 new type coils have been ordered, I'm still not sure how it will react to it if I try them, but it was cheap enough.

I'm still wondering if I should also replace that silly focus diode, they DO degrade, but then replace it with what, another NOS selenium rectifier? Or something like a string of 4 of Mouser # 78-SF1600-TAP , I seem to remember EM saying that he has replaced the focus rec tube with a modern diode string before.

Well, those 2 new type coils have been ordered, I'm still not sure how it will react to it if I try them, but it was cheap enough.

I'm still wondering if I should also replace that silly focus diode, they DO degrade, but then replace it with what, another NOS selenium rectifier? Or something like a string of 4 of Mouser # 78-SF1600-TAP , I seem to remember EM saying that he has replaced the focus rec tube with a modern diode string before.
I bought 25 of these for my stocks. https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Rectron/R5000F?qs=7pEAo90IqNHq8pNU2tEYAg%3D%3D
One might be able to handle focus voltage but it runs close enough to it's limit that I typically put 2 in series for safety.

mouser 652-9250A-824-RC : yep, I've used lots in that series, both as peaking coils and
in multipole RF filters. My CT-100 has several (of that series).

I've also used that exact type diode that Electronic M mentioned to good effect.

IT looks like the new caps and coils fixed the R-Y problem, but it's too soon to tell, this set has fooled me a few times before, It now has NEW bypass caps, 33pf caps, and the crappy GE caps between the demod tubes and the Y amps are new, and the set has been on for 2 hours and the problem has not been seen SO FAR...

If it keeps behaving, i can move on to the other odd problems like losing sync from time to time and STILL not being happy with the focus, Most likely that damn selenium rectifier.

Another thing noticed, the main power transformer was getting quite HOT after being on for a few hours or so, so hot that I could not touch it for very long, not sure if this is a problem, or if it is normal or not, or if it's related to anything at all, SO, I took a big old CPU cooling heat sink with fan, and stuck it on there,and NOW it's running very cool, go figure.

Another thing noticed, the main power transformer was getting quite HOT after being on for a few hours or so, so hot that I could not touch it for very long, not sure if this is a problem, or if it is normal or not, or if it's related to anything at all, SO, I took a big old CPU cooling heat sink with fan, and stuck it on there,and NOW it's running very cool, go figure.

What is your sets current draw at the plug?

What is your sets current draw at the plug?


about 410 watts

https://i.imgur.com/JSF6qsg.jpg

so far so good

I AM getting tired of seeing the same 4 episodes of Lost in Space OVER and OVER again...
I need to make a new test DVD. :p

https://i.imgur.com/p7Awz48.jpg

flyback is nice and cool

https://i.imgur.com/xYPHpk0.jpg

that 18 watt resistor is VERY hot.

I think I'm gonna try to sticking a Heatsink on that resistor to try and cool it down a bit...

sticking a heat sink on that resistor did not help much, it's still too hoot for my liking :(
there are several cracks in the bottom area of it, telling me that it will fail sooner or later, the infra red cam says it's over 360f on the underside.
SOOO, I have one of these on the way.

https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/ohmite/b20j1k25e/?qs=pzhRhjEognnwCEfgbDt6Lg%3D%3D&countrycode=US&currencycode=USD

Measure the voltage across it if you can. Watts = V * V / R.
If properly designed with overhead, it should be putting out 9 watts or less. Sounds like it's a lot higher which may indicated a problem somewhere.

Measure the voltage across it if you can. Watts = V * V / R.
If properly designed with overhead, it should be putting out 9 watts or less. Sounds like it's a lot higher which may indicated a problem somewhere.

Those resistors have a very notoriously high failure rate because of running so hot and burning up the points they have been soldered to.

The one in MY CTC-16-XL had the solder lugs so burned and corroded that I just replaced the entire assy with a new 20 watt one.

new resistor is installed
runs a bit cooler
here is the old one
https://i.imgur.com/21yW2pf.jpg

Oddly enough, I have not seen the return of the loss of sync problem return since I put the CPU fan and heat-sink on the main power transformer, letting run MUCH cooler, I do not know if this is directly related or not, or just a coincidence, but after a week now and running it hours each night, it has not done it so far. :o

When I try to look at your images on Imgur.com, I see absolutely nothing (gray screen) when I click the links. All other links work as they should. I am running Ubuntu 18.04 LTS on my computer; could that have something to do with this problem? I would think Imgur.com would run flawlessly on most operating systems in current use.

When I try to look at your images on Imgur.com, I see absolutely nothing (gray screen) when I click the links. All other links work as they should. I am running Ubuntu 18.04 LTS on my computer; could that have something to do with this problem? I would think Imgur.com would run flawlessly on most operating systems in current use.

not sure why, I have had no problems seeing them on other computers that I am not logged into the site, not that should matter, the flag is set for public, funny you should mention Ubuntu... I'm loading FocalFossa on a old lappy tomorrow, will see what happens.
i have BionicBeaver on it now, but it's a VERY old slow HDD, and I'm putting a new faster larger SSD in it.

Pictures look fine for me.

IMO linux based OSs are only for those that know enough to troubleshoot software or are willing and able to google for answers and follow instructions found. I've played with linux but repairing glitches and making stuff work that didn't upon install is usually more of a headache than a scratch windows install with software and customizations I want to add.
Used machines that can handle windows 10 can be had dirt cheap if you browse classifieds long enough.

I am able to see them fine on Linux :)

Selenium rectifier in focus circuit replaced, range of adjustment vastly improved even more now, it's now right in the center of the adjustment coil where it should be, rather than the extreme inner range.

Sill have not seen the return of the loss of sync problem so far, weird...
so I guess next step is to try to seriously set screen vert/horz linearity, and efficiency ( cathode current) and see if anything odd pops up when I try, I'm sure it will, and then on to fine purity and convergence.

When I am finally done with this GE TV, I think I will take on something a bit more... unusual :)
Turning my RM503 into a TV!

https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/EDoAAOSwphNfSta5/s-l1600.jpg

http://www.electronixandmore.com/projects/tvtoscope/index.html

It's been sitting in storage for years, and SORT OF worked when last powered up, it is in bad need of being restored, it will have to be direct A/V input, unless I can find some way to slap a tuner on it, and it will be green! :p


---EDIT---

yes, I know this of off topic, but who cares :P

been looking at the service info for this thing, and it's more advanced than I thought! :O
It's a hybrid, with tubes,nuvistors and transistors.
rather impressive for a 1960 o-scope :o

every time I have tested this TV for the last few weeks, it was worked OK, I dare say I'm ready to try to stick the chassis back in the thing and see what happens.

I DID find someone with a spare safety glass for the CRT that I am/was hoping to get but with this current economy, and shortened work hours, + medical costs T_T I have not been able to devote funds to getting it yet :(

an another note, I did try to fire uo my RM-505, and as expected, it did not work, as iw was not really working when I got it, and it sat for years, It DID show a light on the CRT before the PWS tube blow up , most likely due to age and bad caps, It's really a HOT used in BW TVs, It gave up throwing sparks and a bright blue light, I also noticed one of the electrolytic capacitors was QUITE warm, and after taking it out, and checking on my cheap checker it was VERY leaky, and checked over 2-3x the rated value and 16 oms ESR for a 350 volt section? BAD! VERY BAD! this will take work to get going :(

When I am finally done with this GE TV, I think I will take on something a bit more... unusual :)
Turning my RM503 into a TV!

https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/EDoAAOSwphNfSta5/s-l1600.jpg

http://www.electronixandmore.com/projects/tvtoscope/index.html

It's been sitting in storage for years, and SORT OF worked when last powered up, it is in bad need of being restored, it will have to be direct A/V input, unless I can find some way to slap a tuner on it, and it will be green! :p


---EDIT---

yes, I know this of off topic, but who cares :P

been looking at the service info for this thing, and it's more advanced than I thought! :O
It's a hybrid, with tubes,nuvistors and transistors.
rather impressive for a 1960 o-scope :o

well, I did try to power it up, and the main power tube exploded :(
glowing purple and throwing sparks
here is what it looks like inside
https://i.imgur.com/TOjlwoF.jpg
i have another 6DQ6A coming

Don't want to enable a tangent topic, I always liked Tektronix scopes, seeing many including DuMonts and Hewlett Packard scopes just sitting idle various places.

Finally I got one when Harrisburg Radio closed in 2014, a 516 from late 60s. It needs some standard going-over but its more fun to use than my Hitachi or my RCA WO-91

Turning a rack-mount scope into a TV is a pretty interesting hack, no doubt developed at some point by a tech in a workplace that did not allow a TV.

And STILL, every time I try this set, it has been working A-OK, w/o any problems that I can see at all, so it is ready to be put together, but as mentioned, due to shoulder surgery, I can't lift ANYTHING above 10lbs for quite some time now, and even before that, I would have needed help getting the damn thing down from the 2nd floor to the first, unless I took it all apart, CRT, cabinet, etc, and I really don't want to do that.:nono::tears:

Just minor stuff is left,
putting in the degaussing coil thermistors, the, bulb for the channel selector, and finding the right resistor to put in for the CRT bias.

AND, once it is in the final location, Convergence...

If I could ever get this thing moved downstairs, I'd probably put it right next to my 16XL, just to see how 2 roundie color sets look together, 21FJP22A vs 21FJP22 ( w/o safety glass ).
and perhaps the FADA in the corner.

With all of them on, I'll never have to use central heat to keep warm when it gets cold! :D

This should prove interesting, the channel indicator light was burned out, (ge 259 bulb) , but every place I looked was charging way too much for 1 bulb, or had packs of 10-20, for $10-$15, I only need 1 damn bulb, :(
Then I saw a pack of ultra bright white 3 volt LEDs for $4. (100), and though, why not, should be easy enough to adapt to the 6.3v heater source, and they will last longer than any light bulb!

well, i got it downstairs! :banana:

https://i.imgur.com/ankW5nV.jpg

I still have to go through the entire setup/ convergence with it, but it's in it's final location.

You can REALLY see that it has an set of LEDs for the channel number indicator. :p

I probably have a weak damper, It's still the Original tube that came with the set, and I'm surprised it still works at all.

The HOT and HV rect have been replaced already.
I am seeing some changes in width and focus as i turn brightness up and down , so I will see what a new damper does.

there were 2 choices for HOTs in this set.

https://i.imgur.com/M0UzLQc.jpg

it came with an original GE 6JS6A which looked very tired, I have a 6HF5 in it now that someone claimed tested at %98.

which i have been running for 3-4 months now.

just on a lark, I put the old tube back in, it came on for 40 sec, shorted out, and blew the breaker, new tube back in and working, YUP, tube was worn out!

I probably have a weak damper, It's still the Original tube that came with the set, and I'm surprised it still works at all.

The HOT and HV rect have been replaced already.
I am seeing some changes in width and focus as i turn brightness up and down , so I will see what a new damper does.

there were 2 choices for HOTs in this set.

https://i.imgur.com/M0UzLQc.jpg

it came with an original GE 6JS6A which looked very tired, I have a 6HF5 in it now that someone claimed tested at %98.

which i have been running for 3-4 months now.

just on a lark, I put the old tube back in, it came on for 40 sec, shorted out, and blew the breaker, new tube back in and working, YUP, tube was worn out!

Yeah, that's the only thing I can think of that can be doing it off the top of my head, weak damper, slight changes in horizontal width and focus when brightness is changed, but vert stays almost the same.
This set, like all RCA types up to the CTC-16 line has damper power pulled from the secondary vert output xfomer, at the vertical centering POT, (400v in this set ).
The fact that I see almost no change in vertical height, and the fact that the damper is as old as the set makes me very suspect of it.

:thumbsdn:
Well rats...
tried to do a basic convergence on it and found a broken coil, the core is broken in 3 pieces, and the paper tube is ripped, someone made a big mess of it, I DID find a replacement.

edit

well
pics do say a lot
https://i.imgur.com/d2JYqXT.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/msdSFRu.jpg

And I did confirm that HV does drop down when brightness is turned up, even with the cap off the shunt regulator.

What I don't get with this silly GE clone is, it all seems virtually identical to the CTC-15/16 with only minor differences except for the horizontal circuit, which is quite different, not sure why this was done, copyright/patent issues?
If so, why not for other areas of the set?

Maybe just a matter of timing. When you need to sell sets, go with what you've got.

https://i.imgur.com/qb5up6h.jpg

all 5 of my vintage sets on the same feed! :D

I'm now ready for the savage cold front that is headed here next week, that is, if the power does not go out :(

What is the white one on the left?

What is the white one on the left?


stromberg carlson x-21 "m4b"

was in horrid shape when i got it

https://i.imgur.com/DzWYsx1.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/LeBQKOI.jpg

left in a barn to rot, 1/3 of the wood was ruined on it

EDIT--
I did my best with 2 weeks of scraping, sanding, wood-filling, priming and painting and replacing rotted bits to get it to look ad best as I could, it is a shame they let it go like that.

BUT,, If i ever find someone selling a cabinet like one of these... and I have the $$$ !
https://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/vintage-1955-stromberg-carlson-132744289
but the chances are VERY unlikely :(

Well, the new damper did not help at all with the problem, HV still changes a lot when I adjust brightness , HOT is new, damper is new HV rect is new, I am going to replace the shunt regulator , but I doubt it will fix anything, I will most likely have iti pull it apart and replace the 1.5 meg resistors in the HV regulator circuit that many say is a problem in these sets, I did NOT have to mess with that in my RCA CTC-16XL, but obviously GE uses crappy parts. The most annoying thing is as the HV drifts, so does the focus.

OK, now I'm curious.
using the CTC-16-XL schematic as reference.

https://i.imgur.com/VgMbCbL.jpg

the HV Rect circuit is the same as the CTC-15/GE except for one thing,

the red X es are the resistors i intend to replace to try to get HV regulation stable.

the circles are the difference in the 15- > 16
in the 16, the 1 k ohm resistor off the shunt cathode goes directly to the bias point (390v), in the 15, its tied to the same source as the damper, which goes up to the green wire in the vert output transformer, which has an indirect link to the bias point via the centering pot, etc.
any clue why they changed this for the 16?

Could R134, the voltage dependent resistor, be causing the trouble? It could affect the grid bias on the shunt regulator and hence the HV to the CRT.

Could R134, the voltage dependent resistor, be causing the trouble? It could affect the grid bias on the shunt regulator and hence the HV to the CRT.

that VDR is not in the CTC-15/GE clone, i only used the 16 as reference in relation to the way they power the cathode of the shunt regulator.

this is the 15/ge
https://i.imgur.com/ODgSryy.jpg

as i said, I'm replacing the 1k on the cathode and the 2 "matched" 1.5m with 1%

This is just pure speculation here, as I still do not fully understand how the HV regulator works on this, but after looking at the CTC-15/GE &16(which is almost identical ) , I seem to have a general understanding.
The 6bk4A/B/C regulates by shunting power via the cathode through a 1k resistor to what ever the damper gets it's bias from, SAMs does not say what wattage, I assume to be 1W.
The grid of the 6bk4A/B/C is tied to a 1.5 meg resistor voltage divider ( matched pair) , one to the HV control pot & coupling cap to cathode. ( very low suspect ).
The other resistor is hooked to the FBT winding that goes to the Horz yoke windings, thus there is strong pulses there, this ALSO goes up to the RGB drives, and later video output, and so on, therefore, if these resistors are out of tol, especially the pair of 1.5 meg, it would explain the odd behavior seen when changing brightness, and why I have seen people say to pay attention to those resistors in particular.

I would not have thought it was so hard to get 1.5meg resistors @ 1w, :(
this was the only ones that Mouser had that I did not have to buy in lots of 100. :O
588-OM1555E-R58
getting 5 of them, should not be too hard to find a good match from that, especially when these are of a higher tol than what is in there now.

ONE WEEK after I ordered them, Mouser has finally shipped the resistors I ordered, it seems that they have gotten VERY lagged with their orders, and don't ship the same day anymore...

Mouser's U.S. headquarters is in suburban Dallas, Texas. The area has had lots of trouble recently with burst pipes (frozen) and power outages.

Mouser sent out emails recently blaming the shipping delays on staff shortages and COVID precautions, but the real problem has probably been lack of reliable electric power. Their warehouse uses lots of automation and a website for a power company serving that area showed lots of service outages last week.

COVID has been around for a year and yet they've only had this shipping trouble recently. If power is the real issue, I wish they would be honest with customers and say so.

Hopefully, their performance will get back to normal soon.

I live 4 hours away from them (south) and was also caught in the week long freeze over, but did not loose power.

I would have expected that they would have gotten on their feet by now, it's been over a week and they still seem to be struggling, at this rate, it will take them forever to get back to the almost shipping on the same day you order like they used to be.

They DID finally ship yesterday, but now it's stuck with UPS saying "Preparing for Delivery" Scheduled Delivery 03/02/2021 by 9:00 P.M. , but somehow I doubt it since there has been no update since this morning.

Not that it really matters anyway, I was not planning to change the resistors until this weekend, but I am even MORE sure that it is these resistors, and not a PWS problem, or horz osc/output, cause just on a whim, last night, I hooked a DVM up to the 400v line that powers it all adjusted the full brigtness range, and there was only a change there about 3 volts.

When a warehouse is very highly automated, I would suppose everything basically stops when power is unreliable. However, maybe there's also some good news there, in that once the power is back, perhaps they'll be able to catch up with remarkable speed.

I have also been waiting...and waiting...and waiting...and waiting...for an in stock order to ship. Still hasn't shipped.

All of this is basically another lesson in fast, cheap, and good...pick any two. Customers can't have deregulated, cut throat, "market priced" electricity without losing something. In this case, Texas lost power when bad weather hit because no one forced the electric utilities to spend the money to prepare. And many customers got hit with massive "market priced" bills.

Cheap and fast, but not good and strong.

Update: Received my Mouser order today. Eight days for in-stock parts. Not too horrible, considering power and water issues many have faced in that area over the past couple of weeks.

Yeah, my 1.5 meg resistors did come yesterday about 6:30, 7 days after being ordered, I do hope that Mouser gets back to their normal shipping pattern.

As mentioned, I will not attempt to put them in till this weekend, and I am HOPING not to have to remove the chassis, leaving the tuner & control section installed, and tipping the chassis back in the cabinet to expose the underside.

Hopefully the new resistors will make the HV stable throughout the entire brightness range like it is in my CTC-16XL, I will check other resistors in the horz area while I'm under there, but I don't expect to find much wrong.

What I know it's NOT so far.
Power supply, Damper, horizontal output, HV rectifier or regulator tubes.

new parts installed

https://i.imgur.com/2QcE5R9.jpg

I did have to pull out the chassis, DAMN GE...
but the HV is now more stable.

the 1k on the cathode was quite off, tested at 740k
now i have to slap it al together an go through the entire setup again :(

Where as I DID SEE some improvement in the HV performance with the resistors being replaced, I'm still not 100% happy with it, I still see some blooming when I adjust brightness, and I do not see that with my ctc-16, perhaps I will never be rid of it, I DID just get this set for the CRT anyway, but gonna try a but more, the set had the original GE HOT, in it which I'm sure was worn out, I got a replacement Tested 6HF5 "strong" Gm 98% in it now, but as I have heard many times, those tests are often meaningless. The damper, HV rect, and shunt regulator are NOS tubes. So I'm going out on a limb and trying a NOS HOT, if I see no improvement with it, I will leave the set as is, and use the set a few times a year to keep the CRT awake.

My new HOT still has not arrived, USPS “claimed” it would be here today, but last scan 12 hours ago was over 1500 miles away, somehow I doubt it will be here this week like it says. :(

anyway, meanwhile, I have always wondered why I can't test tubes like a 21fjp22/a with my B&K Precision 490b tester, it was supposed to be their latest and greatest made, and they DID MAKE a socket adapter for that type pf tube.

Looking at the general specs for a 21fjp22... “ heater current 1.8 amps avg”

In the BK 490B manual.
Heater select key.
Used to select filament voltage between 6.3v @ 1A max or 12v @ 0.5A max current...

HUH? SAY WHAT?!?
1 amp? But they give an adapter for a tube that needs almost 2 amps?
You got to wonder, WHAT THE HELL WAS B&K THINKING??!! :O

Well, if it works at 1 amp, you KNOW it's OK. :tongue:

I do intend to try something unusual, right now, I have ( or when when I stop messing with them ) 3 sets in one section of the room by by projection screen, the RCA-CTC-16XL the GE clone and the FADA, and the cords to all can be hidden pretty well behind stuff like the sets, speakers and so on, but the Stromberg and the CTC-90 are on the other side of the room, no way to get cords there w/o being seen, but I DO have a Blonder Tongue MICM-b A/V Mini Micro Modulator (chan 7) not as powerful as the blonder tongue am60 and so series, but I only need it to go about from a space of 6 feet from ANT to ANT, I am thinking of going from the Blonder Tongue MICM to a ANT near the ceiling, and having another ANT 6 feet away going to an old VCR set to chan 7, then out to the sets. chan 3 That outta work, I hope.

New HOT came, and blooming problem through out the brightness range is gone, i guess it did not like the "used tested strong" one.

now to replace the broken convergence coil and finish setup and put it where I want it to be for the next few years.

that worked better than I thought it would!
https://i.imgur.com/fMEfdoF.jpg

signal is a bit weak, but workable, perhaps i can put an amp on the BT modulator?

As mentioned, my attempt to transmit video across the room worked, but not very well, the blonder tongue micm-b is rather low on RF power, so I am going to cheat! :)

I found this cheapy little RF Power Amplifier 1MHz-700MHZ 3.2W HF VHF UHF Transmitter Power Amplifier Module, it SAYS it was made for Ham Radio, but, TV channel 7 is 175.25MHZ, and this thing is just a dumb analog amp, ( transistors, caps, resistors, coils etc) & 175.25MHZ is well within it's bandwidth, so there is no reason why it should not work IMOH, I don't even need it's full power, says to power it at 15v, gonna give it 12, that should be enough to blast the video across the room cleanly.
And if it does not work, I'll send it back! :P

I did a quick test of in in home transmitter today

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PyvuVDXk7Mw

from one end of the room to the other

Video source where the color roundies are and the FADA, to the blonder tongue micm-b -- > RF Power Amplifier 1MHz-700MHZ 3.2W HF VHF UHF Transmitter Power Amplifier Module --> aunt . . aunt -- vcr --> ctc90 & Stromberg .

i have yet to neaten it all up, this was just a test to see if it worked, and it did! :D

This damn GE set is proving to be a real dog, just as someone predicted from the start, you think it's fixed and working, and it acts up again, the R-Y problem has returned, I take a look in the back, and the heater for the X-DEMOD is dark, but why? New tube, new socket, new resistors, etc, I have re-soldered many times, I have to grab it and wiggle it at odd angles to get it to come on and work correctly, same old song and dance for this thing, same as it ever was.... same as it ever was...

At this point, I'd most likely have to pull the chassis again, and point to point small gauge wire at all connections of the color PCB to get this to stop, because I have re soldered it 3 times at this point, and it's still giving me problems, I MAY do this, I may not, as I did not get this set for functionality, but more so as to have a spare 21FJP22 on hand for the CTC-16, if ever needed, as I mentioned, but it would be nice to see RED fleshtone when I turn it on, :(

This damn GE set is proving to be a real dog, just as someone predicted from the start, you think it's fixed and working, and it acts up again, the R-Y problem has returned, I take a look in the back, and the heater for the X-DEMOD is dark, but why? New tube, new socket, new resistors, etc, I have re-soldered many times, I have to grab it and wiggle it at odd angles to get it to come on and work correctly, same old song and dance for this thing, same as it ever was.... same as it ever was...

At this point, I'd most likely have to pull the chassis again, and point to point small gauge wire at all connections of the color PCB to get this to stop, because I have re soldered it 3 times at this point, and it's still giving me problems, I MAY do this, I may not, as I did not get this set for functionality, but more so as to have a spare 21FJP22 on hand for the CTC-16, if ever needed, as I mentioned, but it would be nice to see RED fleshtone when I turn it on, :(

If the heater line starts thermally opening to a PCB socket and it relapses (assuming it isn't a socket problem) I'd just bypass the PCB with wire.

On my CTC15 clone I fattened my traces with solder till they were close to 1/16" thick.

My new CTC16 Stockholm combo had the luminance output tube heater thermally intermittent... Somebody was unsuccessfully chasing the issue as they replaced all the horizontal tubes and the luminance output tube and kept the old ones in a cigar box. Since the hot trace for that tube was really short and the ground trace was long, after reflowing and fattening the traces joints and board ground lugs I soldered a backup jumper between the heater ground of the tube socket and the chassis...I don't expect it to relapse.

If the heater line starts thermally opening to a PCB socket and it relapses (assuming it isn't a socket problem) I'd just bypass the PCB with wire.

On my CTC15 clone I fattened my traces with solder till they were close to 1/16" thick.

My new CTC16 Stockholm combo had the luminance output tube heater thermally intermittent... Somebody was unsuccessfully chasing the issue as they replaced all the horizontal tubes and the luminance output tube and kept the old ones in a cigar box. Since the hot trace for that tube was really short and the ground trace was long, after reflowing and fattening the traces joints and board ground lugs I soldered a backup jumper between the heater ground of the tube socket and the chassis...I don't expect it to relapse.

It is now very clear what was meant when someone said that GE= "good enough"

every time I think I think that it is fixed, it comes back to bite me, I have replaced resistors, sockets, caps, coils, tubes re-soldered 3 times, and the damn thing still acts up! and it's also showing signs of an IF problem now, I lose picture and sound sometimes and have to tap on the 3rd IF area to get it to come back.

I am pretty sure all the parts are OK on the color PCB are OK as I have checked them many times, and the problem is intermittent, like it was from the start, so what I may do, is get 30 gauge bare solid copper wire ( cheap ) and point to point re-enforce the color output areas from the demods to the y-amps, perhaps more.

The plan with this damn thing is, pull the chassis, AGAIN, and since most resistors, caps, sockets have been replaced, and re-soldered over and over and the SOB still acts up, taking the thinnest gauge solid core copper wire I can get, (30 awg, 1075 Feet $11! cheap!) starting at the tube socket pins, wrap it around each one, and embed it into to solder tracing, wrapping around each and every component pin sticking through the PCB, until I reach the end of that given circuit trace.
This is no doubt overkill, but I have been over and over this PCB checking parts and touching up solder joints, and the damn thing still acts up and reacts to physical contact, this will make absolutely positively sure there are NO LOOSE connections....

https://i.imgur.com/gOYoKf0.jpg

here we go again with this damn GE clone...

2.5 hours later
test... fixed this time? will it STAY working? who knows

https://i.imgur.com/Byq6xME.jpg

ignore the inverted pic, I have it hooked up all bass-akwards just to test it.
https://i.imgur.com/JBVckGt.jpg

who know it it will keep working THIS time...

This damn GE CTC-15 clone still acts up from time to time, living up to the “Good Enough” reputation. Over the Christmas holiday, I had all my sets up and running, and the loss of sync ghost popped up again after about 3 hours, where it almost looks like loss of horizontal phase, and it just won't lock on again, shut down for 90 sec, and it's working fine again.
Never did find out why it did this...
The horizontal phase det in the set IS NOT selenium, like in RCA sets, so it's not likely to be that, however the compactron 6bh11 is the original, and may be flaky. (HORZ/AFC/OSC/DISC ).
The sync sep/agc tube is new, so that is not an issue, I may just try a new 6bh11 and see if that changes anything, but it won't be any time soon, since I only run this thing once in a while to keep the 21FJP22 in it awake, mostly.