Restored the picture and sound, vertical is off on the bottom however. Adjusted to no avail, any thoughts? Control might be bad?

There is usually an electrolytic cap in the cathode of the vertical
output ( 13DR7 ?). Probably part of a can. Common fail for years
on many B&W and color sets. Start with that.
Looks like this set will come out nice ! Very brite & sharp pix.
They dont make em like that anymore !

73 Zeno:smoke:
LFOD !

BTW this is the second or third question thread relating to this TV you've posted. It is best to make one topic for the set and ask your questions there so all the info is in one place and we don't have to search to help you.

Something like this?

Yup.
On a similar age 17" Zenith its the triangle marked section of C2.
100 mfd 50V.
You can just hang another across it to test.
BTW do you have the schematic ?

73 Zeno:smoke:
LFOD !

BTW this is the second or third question thread relating to this TV you've posted. It is best to make one topic for the set and ask your questions there so all the info is in one place and we don't have to search to help you.
EM: Actually this is his fourth.

Wind157: Especially since you are new to restoring these, you will have a lot of questions. If you keep all your posts of the same set in the same thread, we can all follow along easily to help you.

BTW, welcome to the forum. Lots of good guys here to help.

Also, if you fill in your profile with at least your location, you may find one or more of us may live nearby and be able to mentor you face-to-face.

.

Understood. Thanks for the help.

Yup.
On a similar age 17" Zenith its the triangle marked section of C2.
100 mfd 50V.
You can just hang another across it to test.
BTW do you have the schematic ?

73 Zeno:smoke:
LFOD !

There are only two cans like that, one is labeled as C2on the schematic but with a circle of that makes a difference? I have no idea how to check if this is good or not let alone get it off

No need to pull old can.
Cans are one to four sections, each a separate cap.
All the negative leads go to the can part. Each cap is marked on the
bottom with a square, triangle, half moon & slash. You see that
stamped into the can also. And it matches the manual.
To test hang one in parallel thats of similar value in mfd & the same
or higher in voltage. Use clip leads to do it. Match + to + - to -
If that fixes it you can cut the wires off the bad section & put the
right value in.

73 Zeno:smoke:
LFOD !

Bear in mind that if the original failed electrically leaky or shorted putting a new cap in parallel will have no effect on the symptoms.

No need to pull old can.
Cans are one to four sections, each a separate cap.
All the negative leads go to the can part. Each cap is marked on the
bottom with a square, triangle, half moon & slash. You see that
stamped into the can also. And it matches the manual.
To test hang one in parallel thats of similar value in mfd & the same
or higher in voltage. Use clip leads to do it. Match + to + - to -
If that fixes it you can cut the wires off the bad section & put the
right value in.

73 Zeno:smoke:
LFOD !

What you said sounds simple put I feel I am over my head. If there are four sections inside this can then I see no method of accessing them

You don't need to open the can. The terminals to the silver can are on the CRT screen side of the chassis near the cardboard wrapped can. If they are hard to get at with the CRT installed then remove the CRT...To do that disconnect the side CRT HV lead, the CRT socket connector, and loosten the bolt on the yoke clamp then slide the CRT forward through the yoke...If it hangs up on the yoke back it up 2" and slip a card between the CRT and yoke...Push the CRT through the yoke primarily with the end of the bakelite CRT base to prevent ripping the base off if it hangs up in the yoke.

I haven't tried replacing a capacitor from the can yet but I wonder if it could be something else. I can adjust it to get a full picture on most of the screen but still solid black on the bottom 2ish inches. Could the picture tube just not be alligned some how? No matter how I change the vert/hort it still doesn't display anything on the bottom.

CRT/yoke alignment cannot do this. It's a case of very bad vertical non-linearity, almost surely due to a bad component and very likely a bad capacitor.

Thanks. The SAMS I found lists that a tube could be causing that issue or the rectifiers. I did order replacement tubes and the a capacitor to replace the on in the can. I assume the rectifiers are not likely the issue?

Almost always the capacitor. I would not just replace tubes. Most of them are probably fine. The new capacitor will be much smaller and can be mounted under the chassis. There likely other capacitors that will need to be changed as well.

Well that was a bust. Replaced the capacitor from that can, just made another component smoke badly and vert didnt work at all until I removed the new capacitor. Unless I'm reading the SAMS and attached the leads to the wrong part of the can.

:saywhat: Um , you took a picture of the smoke ? Really ?

:no: To save you future grief in your troubleshooting endeavors I'll make this short & sweet ;

:thmbsp: At the very first hint of smoke , reach for the power cord to yank it outta the wall rather than the camera !

I took a picture after I unplugged it so I could better identify which component was smoking.

Well go figure, so no matter how I connect the new capacitor there is smoke. I disconnected a cable running to the can assuming maybe I was over powering the smoking resistor but still the same thing. When I disconnected the new capacitor and ran a clip from the disconnected wire the tv works fine.
Bad solder? Or dumb luck?

Does that yellow wire connect to ground or pass thru the chassis to something on the other side in the third pic? Did you observe polarity with the new capacitor, if you connected it with reverse polarity it would pass enough current to smoke a resistor (the capacitor will also be damaged by powering it up with reverse polarity).

Sams is good, but has typos. Always best to learn to read the markings on the part and verify the actual wiring of the set.

The yellow wire connects to another yellow soldered to a tube then the the vert control.
The new capacitor didn't have an indication of polarity but connecting either way didn't make a difference, it smoked that resistor either way.
That said it worked fine after disconnecting the new capacitor and the image filled the screen where it did not before so I assume the yellow wire was my problem. Unless the power of Jesus flowed into the smoking resistor.
This morning the image still fills the screen even the bottom portion that it didn't not prior to trying the new cap except I can't adjust the picture in any more. I assume the smoking resistor is now my problem but at least I can see what that is and where it connects unlike the cap from the damn can.

There should be polarity on the new cap unless you bought unpolarized (but those are not common over 50V rated). If you connected the cap backward the first time then it probably shorted instantly on power up and correcting the polarity after that would not have helped...Once a cap shorts it is dead. You only get one chance to connect a lytic with the correct polarity before power up, before destroying your new replacement...Worse yet if you connect a lytic backwards it can explode and possibly cause injury...Measure twice cut once (ie make sure it is right before power up even if you have to ask us).

Where are you sourcing your caps? You should be going with a legitimate online vendor of NEW capacitors. Places like Mouser, Digikey, Allied, Justradios, Capacitor World, etc are where you want to buy from...Brick and mortar shops who's stocks can languish years to decades, and used parts places like surplus stores are bad sources...Electrolytic caps have a shelf life shorter than their rated life...Lytics need to have voltage applied to them regularly or they go bad...I've personally bought dead caps from Radio Shack and surplus places in the past, but I had a quality capacitor tester at my disposal to realize it and not use those parts.

Electronics are not magic, and while I can appreciate faith, it will not keep the original caps or bad quality replacements going for long.

The faith comment is sarcasm as the cap didn't resolve the issue yet that issue is resolved. Now I have to replace smoky resistor

The faith comment is sarcasm as the cap didn't resolve the issue yet that issue is resolved. Now I have to replace smoky resistor

Got a DMM and can do math? If so it won't hurt to check the original...If it is still within tolerance then you did not let out too much smoke. :D

Can you please post up a picture of that new cap you had installed?

Got a DMM and can do math? If so it won't hurt to check the original...If it is still within tolerance then you did not let out too much smoke. :D

Good point, i will check. I'm pretty sure it's done as the image does line up any more or at least didn't this morning.

can you please post up a picture of that new cap you had installed?

+1.

Here it is

Pretty sure the end that + is nearest is the positive end.

That cap looks like it was made in the 70's. As a general rule, you always want to use new or under 3-year-old electrolytics caps made in this mileneia are failing from age already that part looks like almost as much of a gamble as the originals.

I don't know how familiar you are with sourcing caps, but here is some advice anyway under most parts house web sites there will be passive components listed capacitors will be under them, Lytics will probably be listed as aluminum electrolytic, papers will be replaced by film types, other capacitor types can mostly be ignored. Most originals are of an outdated standard value selection the values 20, 30, 40, 50, 60 have been replaced with 22, 33, 47, 56 respectively (the industry transition happened from the 1940's-70's). So order a 56uF to replace the 60. The original lytic caps had a -50% +100% tolerance so there is tremendous fudge factor in choosing a replacement, but the closest modern standard value is recommended. Voltage rating: is the maximum voltage that can appear across the terminals before the lytic will fail and explode(or vent it's guts in a messy mineral oil steam)...You can select a new cap with a higher voltage rating (higher voltage cost money, and is bigger and less easy to fit so it pays not to go too wild) and the set may even be more rugged because of it, but never select a lover voltage (your new cap will die quickly if you do). When buying from one of the parts houses with a search engine with lots of options I first check the "stocked" box so I'm not waiting 6 months for the factory to make more. I also will select all voltages at or above what I need for a lytic, then capacitances close to the value, then sort by price and look at brands I have confidence in (Panasonic, Nichicon, Illinois Capacitor, etc.) and sometimes compare things like lead length, size and mounting in making the final choice. Honestly once you've got the correct value and a good brand you can't go wrong electrically (though good choices after can make mounting easier). On paper caps go with 630V for everything unless there is a higher voltage part in the set (get the correct voltage for that)...Going lower for some parts to save money/room is not worth the effort for paper/film replacemet.
Here are a couple of links to play with:https://www.mouser.com/Passive-Components/Capacitors/Aluminum-Electrolytic-Capacitors/_/N-75hqt/
https://www.mouser.com/Passive-Components/Capacitors/Film-Capacitors/_/N-9x371/

You can craft an order of the parts you need off of the schematic parts list. New film caps are rated in pF and the body markings are 2 value digits and a multiplier. So a cap marked 153k is 15000pF=.015uF In sams most caps with a voltage rating are paper, and most that start with a "." or are 1000 (pF) or more are paper, the first few are lytic and you can confirm by looking for polarity on the schematic.

The white tubular caps in some of your chassis pictures and the bumblebee paper caps (they look like giant black resistors with color stripes) are as much time bombs as the original lytics.

Damn, I dumped a lot of info on you. Sorry if any is old hat, TMI, or confusing. If you have any questions just ask.

In a multiple-section electrolytic can capacitor, all the negative terminals of all the individual sections are connected to the outer can, and the positive terminals are the separate solder lugs that protrude through the bottom cardboard (not any twist lugs that connect the can to the chassis). When replacing one of these sections, you must remove any wire(s) that go(es) to the positive terminal of that section and connect them to the positive terminal of the replacement capacitor. The negative terminal of the replacement then has to be connected to the same place as the multi-section can (usually chassis ground).

Since you didn't realize the polarity is marked +, you had a 50/50 chance of getting it backward, and you should consider the replacement ruined and discard it.

On modern axial lead caps the negative lead will be connected to the outer metallic case, the positive lead will come out of some insulating material. Never assume the polarity markings on the outside wrapper are correct. I've seen several where the heat shrink cover was installed with the polarity reversed.

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/946/40418596310_9c73911058_b.jpg

That's good info, thanks.

The cap was from mouse and while I saw the plus sign the SAMS nor the can indicated where positive polarity went.

That said the cap still doesn't matter as the problem I was trying to fix with it no longer occurs.

I am assuming the yellow wire coming of the can and leading to the vertical control had a bad solder where it connects to one of the tubes.

I truley have no idea why the picture comes in good now. Smoking a resistor and it works now with keeping the old cap in place? Also the yellow wire running from that can to a tube then to the vertical control doesn't seem to do anything. I have a alligator clipped wire connecting the two yellow wires, after I cut it from the soldered point on the tube, and when I disconnected the clip the picture stayed on.
Not complaining but I don't see how anything I've done fixed the problem with the picture.

Has the vertical oscillator or vertical output tube yet been subbed with another one to eliminate that as a possible problem yet? You will still need to replace that smoked resistor and I would still replace the cap again. That resistor could be a plate bias or something vital for correct operation. This set will look really nice when you get the problem figured out. The jug is in excellent condition.

The tubes seem fine, I have some NOS I switched out and made no difference. I know I need to replace the resistor now. What I don't understand is why the part of the screen that was not displaying an image before now does so when with the same old capacitor. You can see in the attached that the picture on the left is not reaching the bottom of the screen and the picture on the right is filling the screen.
Those are pre/post smoking the resistor but the old cap is still in place. The only other change is the wire going from the Cap's can to a tube then to the vertical control but unhooking the alligator clipping it back to the tube makes no difference in picture quality.
So I guess I will replace the resistor but I am leaving the old capacitor in place as I am getting a full and good picture with it. Why I didn't before I do not know but I am now at the: if it's not broke, don't fix it, stage with the capacitor

Possible the smoked resistor shifted tube bias to counteract the problem. Even if a cap in any given stage is not causing an immediate problem you still need to change the lytics and all tubular caps .001uF and up...They will eventually short and kill something MUCH harder to source.

I assume you think replacing the resistor will cause the vertical linearity problem to start occuring again then?

I assume you think replacing the resistor will cause the vertical linearity problem to start occur again then?

It is possible but not guaranteed...Worry about having the parts meet spec before worrying about having it work perfectly...Otherwise, parts that have not been made in 50 years may be the next to smoke (due to bad caps, etc.)...

When I was a broke college student I used to try and get by replacing the minimum number of parts...So I can tell you from experience in most cases leave well enough alone (on old defective/risky parts ) = causing a worse failure in the near future.

Yeah my luck is typically that I break something when fixing it though.
I suppose I should take the meter and check the various caps. It's just replacing the caps in the can, I feel like I'm flying blind without know exactly where to connect the replacement cap. Wish I could just find a replacement can instead of three separate caps.

Yeah my luck is typically that I break something when fixing it though.
I suppose I should take the meter and check the various caps. It's just replacing the caps in the can, I feel like I'm flying blind without know exactly where to connect the replacement cap. Wish I could just find a replacement can instead of three separate caps.

DMMs and solid state meters only check for capacitance...Most paper caps and ~half of lytics fail by leaking DC current across their terminals. A 400V rated cap may only start to leak with 300V or more across it. SolidState meters only apply around 5V to 12V not even close to being able to smoke out the issue. I use a tube type Heathkit C3 cap tester that can check for leakage by applying up to 450V...The only true validation of a vintage cap is applying its full rated voltage to it, and even then most paper caps and vintage lytics are so unreliable that it could(and often does) test good now, then in a week short dead and burn up some unobtainium coil.

No one makes real cans like those (the last vanished in the early 80's), there is one place that makes repops by stuffing individual modern caps into a can (not how the originals were made)...They charge way more than replacing with individual parts and are not worth it. Find your self an original cap that has been removed from a set and look it over carefully...They are not that complicated. Depending on the size of the can there will be 3-4 outer (negative) lugs connected to the outer metal can and 1-4 inner (positive) lugs connected to the center insulating wafer. The can metal is always negative in tube gear as are the outer lugs. The positive lugs in cans that have more than one section are differentiated from each other with the following symbols "^", "D", "[]", "-"(or" ") those symbols will either be scratched on the insulator around the terminals, or will be cut out of the insulator as an enlargement of the hole the positive terminal protrudes from. The metal on the can will have printed on it a label showing in a table the capacitance, voltage and terminal ID symbol of the positive sections. If you or a 5-year-old were in the same room with me and one of those caps I could teach both of you to read and change can caps (assuming prior knowledge of soldering) in around 3 minutes.

The thing about tube sets is they are eventually going to die at random from original caps as long as you leave them in...Better to change them all now one at a time while it works than wait for it to die...If you kill it while working now you can find your mistake easy if you go one or two caps at a time and check after doing those 1-2. But if you wait for the original caps to kill the set and then recap a dead set you have NO way to know you made a mistake...You'll end up changing every single cap and at the end not know if there are other issues or if you screwed up.

I get that a TV can be overwhelming, I try to advise people that want to eventually restore a TV to get a couple of 5 tube AM radios to practice recap work on those first...Much simpler than a TV, forgiving, cheap, and somewhat disposable for tube gear.

I had figured out how to read the can and it's caps and order a replacement but thanks for the details, they're helpful. I did get the new cap connected and it looks better and the vert control works fully again.
There are 80 some caps, you said you'd recommend replacing all of them above a certain value?
It amazes me any of them still work on a 1957 set. Are there other known to fail components I should look at replacing?

Would it be unusual for a SAMS to be wrong on it's picture showing where and which caps are which?
I asked because the SAMS page showing that has a few paper caps which are have been replaced. I assume someone previously did so. However there is at least one cause I have found where there is a paper can in place but it's not shown in the the image.
Is it logical to assume that there could be variant designs of the same model TV as everything else I can see matches the images, diagrams, part numbers?

Soldering looks original as if nothing has been replaced. Which one in the picture do you think was replaced?

.

Soldering looks original as if nothing has been replaced. Which one in the picture do you think was replaced?

.

This one. I doubt it's been replaced as it's a paper cap but I don't see it pictured either.

Looks original, probably just a production change. Doesn't mean Sams is wrong, often manufacturers make a lot of changes along the line.

This also makes me suspect it's had work done too. The cap in the picture shows a paper cap but the one in place clearly isn't. It isn't new either so either it's been replaced some time ago or a different one was used in the first place.

Not sure where things are at but I think you are referring to C56.
Sams shows a white paper cap. The TV has a bumblebee.
Probably the factory changed suppliers.

As far as the original vert problem goes replace the burned resistor.
See if it still works. Its possable whatever went wrong it shocked a cap into
working again.

73 Zeno:smoke:
LFOD !

I did connect the cap to the wrong spot and now that it's in the right place and old cap removed it works great. Still will need to replace the resistor and other caps but working for the moment.
Thanks for everyone's help.

BTW when we say paper caps we are referring to the dielectric inside the cap and not it's outer casing. The white tubular ceramic caps in some of the pictures and the aforementioned bumblebee caps are paper dielectric caps, and should be changed.

Last question and it probably sounds dumb but it's my luck is pick wrong. When ordering a new cap I want to look for AC caps correct?

delete duplicate.

AC caps are almost never seen in TVs. Lytics and paper caps both new and original are and were rated for DC voltage.

Many new film/paper types are given both AC and DC voltage ratings... ignore the AC rating and choose new ones based on their DC voltage rating.

In most applications a cap would have something like 400VDC across it and maybe 5VAC of signal.... if it can handle the 400 DC then it can handle the 5 ac easily.

Glad I asked then.

How far below capacitance can I go? I need to replace one that is 150 but closest is 120 and that's with being a good deal higher in voltage

Lytics typically were +100%/-50% tolerance on the capacitance so 75uF would be the lowest you can go on a 150uF. Papers typically have a 10% tolerance. Most sets don't mind some variance in the capacitance of lytics, but papers can be more critical especially in any stage of a TV other than audio or power. In some cases (usually paper caps) if I don't feel I can get a precise enough value for the circuit I'll put two capacitors in parallel to get the value I need (capacitances in parallel add).

The closer the better but 120 should be plenty close to 150...If you get excessive hum on the line it filters after the recap you can always tack a 33 or more on in parallel with the 120 after the fact.

Thanks. I ended up finding one at 140 but voltage was 400 instead of 300. Fitting it will be fun.

...

Replacing the caps in a can, the negative of the new cap connects to ground?

Replacing the caps in a can, the negative of the new cap connects to ground?

The negative of the new cap(s) connects to whatever the metal housing of the original can connected to...

Many cans were soldered directly to chassis ground, but others rather than connecting the can to ground, connected it to a floating negative rail.
The original can will have 3-4 outer twist tabs coming from it's bottom...If the twist tabs contact and are soldered to the chassis metal then the can is grounded to chassis....But if the twist tabs are twisted onto a phenolic insulating wafer (the wafer is riveted to the chassis in 2 places) then the can connects to a floating negative rail (and your replacement(s) should then connect to the floating negative rail instead of the chassis). Another giveaway that a can is on a floating negative is when the metal can above chassis is wrapped in a cardboard or plastic insulator.

If that is confusing then ask me for some pictures tomorrow...Visual aid makes my point come across with at least a thousand fewer words. :D

No that makes sense. There are a few of the floating negatives on the chassis. This can however doesn't connect to any just the chassis and the wires leading to their various points.

So I've replaced the capacitors in the can and the image is still off. The top of the image seems to be above the viewable area. When I adjust the height the bottom two inches compact and are black. When I adjust the vert lin it goes to a flat line or with the old cap it wouldn't change at all just compress/cut off the bottom.
Is the all just the nature of this type of set getting a feed that nots meant for this screen?
Then there is the matter of the small gap in image on the left side.

IIRC you have not replaced the bumblebees and tubular ceramic caps in that set yet...Vertical troubleshooting 101 replace EVERY cap in the vertical stages first (no exceptions, total original capacitor genocide!), check for proper operation, then go after tubes and resistors.

See all the caps circled in my edit of your picture? If any of those are in the vertical stage or any vert capacitors currently installed look like them then the vertical will probably not work completely right.

Lytics can cause problems in the vertical (and sometimes are the only problem), but papers can be as bad or worse. On a set this old it is a miracle it works as well as it does now with those lousy old caps.

I already have all those marked for replacing but thanks.

Guess I'll see how it appears after that. I suspect it will be the same. Which if it is then so be it, could be far worse for a free set that's 61 years old

So I've replaced the caps and it actually preforms worse? The screen height issue is still an issue and now the screen flickers consistently.
I'm going back to the old caps before I stick more money into this.

Unless I'm reading the can wrong. I'm assuming the prong in the upper right corner to match the cap that is stamped as square on the can. The opposite prong as the triangle and the semi circle is obvi

Under the red wire is a triangle. Blue is connected to the half moon, as noted, and pin with no obstruction is the square. Outside perimeter tabs are ground.
Ed

When putting a cap in parallel to increase its value, is that just voltage or capacitance too?
Have a paper cap that is .047 with 200 vdc. Can't find a cap that low with a minimum of that voltage. Found one that .05 but not sure if two would cause a problem

Also, wtf is this? Pulled up a few times looking for replacement for paper caps. Do I just solder wires to the silver edges?

When putting a cap in parallel to increase its value, is that just voltage or capacitance too?
Have a paper cap that is .047 with 200 vdc. Can't find a cap that low with a minimum of that voltage. Found one that .05 but not sure if two would cause a problem

When you put capacitors in parallel, the total capacitance is the sum of the two capacitances. I think you understand that?

The voltage rating of the caps is not changed by putting them in parallel. So, for example, if you are replacing .047uf 200v with two parallel caps (say, two .022 uf) they must both be rated 200 v or more. If they are rated a higher voltage than 200, it doesn't hurt.

When putting a cap in parallel to increase its value, is that just voltage or capacitance too?
Have a paper cap that is .047 with 200 vdc. Can't find a cap that low with a minimum of that voltage. Found one that .05 but not sure if two would cause a problem

Capacitance is the ONLY value that adds when capacitors are connected in parallel. The voltage of a parallel capacitor combination is that of the lowest sticker voltage rating of any single cap in the parallel group.

Big space to separate topics:






If you want to combine caps in a way that increases the effective voltage rating then you have to connect capacitors in series...However that only works for a group of caps that all have the same capacitance rating (if not then the voltage will divide unevenly in ways that are a pain to predict). Also if you put capacitors in series the capacitance drops. which can be calculated for any number of individual parts wired in parallel by the formula: Ct=1/[ (1/C1) + (1/C2) + (1/C3) + ...+(1/Cn) ] where Ct is the capacitance of the parallel combo and C1 thru Cn are the individual parts that make up the combo. The ... and Cn mean you can calculate your result for a near infinite number of different caps of different capacitances.


Do NOT buy surface mount capacitors for replacing paper capacitors. Buy ones like these (which I use). https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Panasonic/ECQ-E6473KF?qs=sGAEpiMZZMv1cc3ydrPrF%252bfZ13WJ%2fr1%2 fn1p2vhg7KKs%3d



good luck.

Roger that. I just can't find one with such a low capacitance. Are these bumblebees often hard to find a replacement? Closest I found was what ever this is

Oh so that a surface mount cap, yeah wasn't going to buy that amyway

Yeah, the one in your post #71 is a surface mount part. What is the capacitance and voltage of the original you are looking to replace, but having a hard time finding?

I'll get to those caps later. I'm taking care of the lytic caps first. Two replaced but on the third, which does have some damage, the image gets worse with the new cap. Reclip the old and it's fine again. The values match so I am not sure the problem.

Can you show the other end of the cap. I suspect VNP means volts non-polarized...Meaning you can't replace it with a polarized lytic (though you may be able to replace it with two wired in series in a special way).

Another possibility is that the original is leaky and that leakage is compensating for another problem elsewhere...

Both would make sense. The sams didn't have reference about VNP and you couldn't see the writing until removing it. The other end does have some damage.

Since both ends are rubber insulator I'm pretty sure that is a non-polarized...Most that style that are polarized have one end aluminum (negative) and one rubber (positive).

There are two ways you can replace it; order the correct non-polarized lytic or put two polarized lytics of twice the rated capacitance of the original in series*.
* For them to behave like a non-polarized cap you need to connect both positives together then connect the negatives to circuit OR connect both negatives together and connect the positives to circuit.

I'm going to have to run them in a series anyway unless I find a different cap source. Mouser.com has no polar but highest is 100 volts and this is 400 volts 10uf

Is it common for a cap to be in place but not listed on a Sam's? The .0068 paper cap centered does not appear in the pictured diagram or show in the list of caps with that value. Could the SAMS just be off and Zenith used a slightly different design? Aside from a bumblebee being a paper the SAMS has bee spot on.
Also I removed the cap to find it's value and later turned the TV to test a replaced resistor. The set's picture was noticably better while that cap was still removed. Probably from the new resistor but after I was surprised when I remembered I had not replaced that cap and it worked so well.
And yes I know that could have been bad and will not do so again.

Remember Sam's is usually only a snapshot of one random production run. Sets often had significant changes between and sometimes during production runs. Parts added, parts removed, values and or wiring changes, etc...Always evaluate what is there in the set for originality. If what is there is a factory part/connection then you can assume that is how it is supposed to be, but if the part is the work of an old tv repair by an unknown tech be prepared to doubt it (do note what the change was in case it is needed).

Is it common for a cap to be in place but not listed on a Sam's? The .0068 paper cap centered does not appear in the pictured diagram or show in the list of caps with that value. Could the SAMS just be off and Zenith used a slightly different design? Aside from a bumblebee being a paper the SAMS has bee spot on.
Also I removed the cap to find it's value and later turned the TV to test a replaced resistor. The set's picture was noticably better while that cap was still removed. Probably from the new resistor but after I was surprised when I remembered I had not replaced that cap and it worked so well.
And yes I know that could have been bad and will not do so again.

Is it common for a cap to be in place but not listed on a Sam's? The .0068 paper cap centered does not appear in the pictured diagram or show in the list of caps with that value. Could the SAMS just be off and Zenith used a slightly different design? Aside from a bumblebee being a paper the SAMS has bee spot on.
Also I removed the cap to find it's value and later turned the TV to test a replaced resistor. The set's picture was noticably better while that cap was still removed. Probably from the new resistor but after I was surprised when I remembered I had not replaced that cap and it worked so well.
And yes I know that could have been bad and will not do so again.

I have lost count of the number of times I've seen Sam's that have NOT matched the factory correct original build of a set. Sometimes it is Sam's typos, sometimes undocumented (by sam's) production changes, etc...My point is Sam's is FAR from a flawlessly accurate reference on any set.

If there are not OBVIOUS* signs that something which does not match the Sam's was changed after the set left the factory (say by some ham-handed tech 2-30 years after it was made) then you should ALWAYS assume Sam's is wrong and that the wiring in the actual set is right...Sam's used to pay shops that used their folders for reporting found defects/typos/etc., and some shops made good money showing sam's they were wrong.

*Look at the soldering workmanship brands of parts used, relative dirt/dust, etc, and you will start to spot such things.

We advise beginners to look at/have schematics, not for some infallible reference (documentation is never infallible), but because enough of it is right for it to help you understand generally what is going on, so we can discuss common part ID reference numbers, and so if we have not seen an exact model we can look at the schematic and give the most sound advice.

I can just replace it based on the value printed on it. Set seems to work the same with or without it so keeping it, well it's replacement.
The sams also says this cap has a 3300 uf so I assume that off to.

Never that was a disc, the Sams image is a bit hard to tell where it's pointing in some cases

I can just replace it based on the value printed on it.

Before I could read bumblebee caps I once had a sam's value error royally screw up a resto...Ever since then I replace all caps based on the printed value on the body of the capacitor if it is humanly possible to read it.

I see what you mean, just ordered my last set of caps only to find on is listed as 0.0047 uf but the printed cap I pulled is 0.0015. ugh, guess I get to make another order

Replaced all the caps and the set is working great. Thanks for all the help.