I scored this set on craigslist yesterday just a few miles from home :)

It came with an original service manual and a few boxes of goodies.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8084/8273132225_e4be71e4cf_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8273132225/)

It's missing the back but everything else seems to be there.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8497/8274199560_03ecfaee38_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8274199560/)

If I can get these blobs of white goo off (latex paint ?), I think I can salvage the original finish. Worst case I'll just need to refinish the center panel.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8353/8273131885_64e5493c24_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8273131885/)


The serial # is 29885
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8065/8275859279_768a7b6bb6_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8275859279/)

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8477/8276918872_993f0d65b2_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8276918872/)

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8494/8275858081_97efb128db_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8275858081/)

I don't like the looks of that getter :no:
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8340/8276918132_fc45a5f9c0_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8276918132/)

Congrats! Is this going to be your next restoration?

Yet another case of a gaping hole in my collection not being filled....

Nice score :)

Great find!
The white glop looks like it could have had a Motorola VT-71 sitting on top of it and dripping mask goo?

I've seen tubes with funky getters that still work fine.

Congrats! Is this going to be your next restoration?

Maybe, I'm not sure yet. I certainly want to finish a few outstanding projects first, but I'm anxious to see one of these sets in action.

The young man I bought the set from said that he was going to restore it with his grandfather, but he passed away before they got the chance :tears:

Here are the goodies that came along with the set. Maybe I'll use some of these parts in the restoration :)
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8202/8276032005_e1bf5f51af_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8276032005/)

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8083/8277090964_7885c840c5_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8277090964/)

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8222/8277090752_0902acd999_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8277090752/)

Great find!
The white glop looks like it could have had a Motorola VT-71 sitting on top of it and dripping mask goo?

I've seen tubes with funky getters that still work fine.

Thanks. It is similar to the VT-71 goo, but even harder. The emissions and cutoff were in the red even after over an hour at elevated filament voltage.
So, I used the auto-restore function on my CR70. After an hour, the emissions are still holding steady in the green. Cutoff still stinks though.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8352/8277090562_7607eab3d9_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8277090562/)

Very nice set. Especially nice when you score one so close to home.

Now, let's take a closer look at the chassis.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8077/8276116335_f4ac673ab3_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8276116335/)

I discovered what appears to be some gold paint over-spray in one area. Luckily, it 's coming off just by scratching with a fingernail.
The decals are a bit worn out. I think repros are available so I might try carefully sanding out the old ones, apply new ones and burying them in fresh lacquer.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8354/8277174810_27b12287c2_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8277174810/)

As for the chassis, it appears to be complete with just a few old repairs.
I think it will be a fun project :yes:
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8077/8276116727_7b0973cacc_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8276116727/)

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8206/8276116525_a9c7d63e76_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8276116525/)

Very nice set. Especially nice when you score one so close to home.

It sure is. I picked it up while finishing off my Christmas shopping so I guess it was an early present to myself ;)

Always liked the 630's, great sets and cool score. Make my GE 800C I just got look cheap and crappy.

Is that cad plating that has oxidized on that chassis or something else?

Matt

Great score. The 630TS set the bar for early TV design, in some ways.

Love those goodie boxes. I have used a little Weller gun like that almost daily for about 100 years.

That greeny stuff looks more like household cooking grease and/or tobacco grime to me. You wouldn't find cadmium on aluminum IF cans and electrolytic cans.

Phil Nelson
Phil's Old Radios
http://antiqueradio.org/index.html

Hello Bob lucky score I wish I could have kept mine but I had to sell it but thats the way life goes atleast Icould say that I had one at one time...Timothy

Ahhh HATE Yew ! -Yosemite Sam, Esq. (grin) Seriously, what a WONDERFUL Christmas present ! Looks to be all there, very decent cosmetics, CRT might be iffy, but, maybe not...Ya done GREAT !

Wow. Seriously nice score! Nice box o'parts as well. Looks like Santa is being good to you this year. I'd do everything I could to try to preserve as much of the original finish as possible. Love the pix. :yes:

...Love those goodie boxes. I have used a little Weller gun like that almost daily for about 100 years.
That looks more like the 'bigger' (dual heat, dual headlight) gun. I also had a 'little' (single heat, single headlight) Weller that i used for 100 years:bs:. Acquired in trade with another kid for a McCoy .29 model plane engine.

Great find and great parts stash. Sending you a PM about the Golden Throat sticker.

Great score. The 630TS set the bar for early TV design, in some ways.

Love those goodie boxes. I have used a little Weller gun like that almost daily for about 100 years.

That greeny stuff looks more like household cooking grease and/or tobacco grime to me. You wouldn't find cadmium on aluminum IF cans and electrolytic cans.

Phil Nelson
Phil's Old Radios
http://antiqueradio.org/index.html
The older Weller soldering guns are the only ones I like. The new ones have the aluminum barrels and set screws to hold the tips.
I buy them, whenever I see them at garage sales, ETC. :thmbsp:

Re: Weller guns. Ditto. I got mine, 100/140 watt, in the case, with solder and tips, at a flea market for $4.00. Was hardly used. It's the older style with solid hardware.

Odd that I've never run across one of these or an 730 on the Minneapolis/St Paul Craigslist. But then I suppose they were about the earliest TV's collected, and so I guess most got scooped up years ago. Hopefully there's still a few lurking in some dusty hiding places. :scratch2:

Re: Weller guns. Ditto. I got mine, 100/140 watt, in the case, with solder and tips, at a flea market for $4.00. Was hardly used. It's the older style with solid hardware.

My favorite is the D440. 145/210 watts. They quit making it, IIRC, in the early 70's. It uses the same tips as the smaller guns and not as cumbersome as the D550. It's more suited to old TV and radio restoration. :yes:

Great find and great parts stash. Sending you a PM about the Golden Throat sticker.

I this the sticker ? Sure, I could use a new one. PM sent.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8357/8280223012_8aaaf59be3_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8280223012/)

The other labels on the back are in better shape.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8075/8279177937_9dd0a8a9be_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8279177937/)

I took a closer look at the Weller gun and discovered two in the box. The larger has some damage to the bakelite but the smaller WD-135 on top is in very good condition.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8363/8280222702_eb594f0f56_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8280222702/)

About the Weller guns, I've had trouble with the trigger switch getting stuck on a couple of 'em I have. usually stuck on.

I haven't tried using the Wellers yet, but I sure hope they work or are repairable. They fell much better in my hand than the modern versions :yes:

I swung my my local hardware store and picked up these goo removal products. I hope they do the trick.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8501/8281789287_68dc21be97_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8281789287/)

I haven't tried using the Wellers yet, but I sure hope they work or are repairable. They fell much better in my hand than the modern versions :yes:

I swung my my local hardware store and picked up these goo removal products. I hope they do the trick.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8501/8281789287_68dc21be97_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8281789287/)

Be careful with the Goof-off. It's a tough on some plastics and finishes.
Don't ask me how I know. :tears:

Thanks for the warning. I read the label and it contains Acetone! Definitely bad for plastics and some finishes so I'm trying the other stuff first.

If all else fails try scraping it off level with a putty knife. Maybe some gentle heat will soften it up?

Congrats Bob on the new addition to the family. Next up is the 721TS

Golden Throat labels went in the mail last night.

Would it be fair to say the 721TS (I have one - not started yet) is a level or two below the 630TS, which we all agree is a brickshithouse of a TV?

i ask this only after a comparison of schematics, noticing differences in AGC, IF, sound etc

BTW-I have that same service manual for 630TS/648PTK, its a good and thorough text on teh 630TS

My unscientific view is that the 630 and 721 are very similar in performance, despite the difference in tube count (30 tubes for 630 vs. 21 for 721). I watched my 721TCS for about 4 hours yesterday and was again impressed with its great picture & audio, and its stability.

The 630 does have extra IF stages in the video and audio, which might make it better in weak signal areas, but that's not a factor now, when we are not listening to distant stations. It also has a 6AL5 DC restorer, and two 5U4G LV rectifiers rather than one. That accounts for a few of the extra tubes.

If you compare the rest of the tube lineups, you see that the 721 often uses a single multi-function tube where the 630 uses two. For example, the 721 uses one 12AU7 tube for the 1st and 2nd video amps, where the 630 uses two (6AU6 and 6K6GT).

In that sense, the 721 just seems like a newer design, not an inferior one. Older TVs used more octal tubes for single functions. As time went by, the general trend was to use more glass mini tubes that could do multiple jobs. That not only reduced cost, but it may also have improved reliability, since fewer parts means fewer failure points.

Perhaps others will disagree, but that's my quick take.

Phil Nelson
Phil's Old Radios
http://antiqueradio.org/index.html

I agree with Phil about the 721s design & performance and would love to get one someday.

First, I tried the "Paint Erase" which was having some effect, but not much. Then switched to a heat gun and a plastic knife and popped the crud right off.

After cleaning with GoJo and a Howards rubdown it's still pretty noticeable.
This will give me a chance to try out a touchup kit from The Restoration Studio (http://werefinish.com/premium_furniture_touch_up_paint.htm)

If it doesn't work out, no big deal. I have some medium brown walnut toner lacquer on hand.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8070/8284793117_0718e18722_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8284793117/)

Uhh, I dunno if I'd fool w/that any more...That IS a 65 yr old TeeVee, after all...Its bound to have had some "Love Pats" thru the years...In a way, they add "Character". It looks pretty darn good the way it is.

I once had a chance to see a 721. The first thing I noticed was there was no DC restoration. Secondly, the picture is slightly softer due to the narrower IF response (three IF stages instead of four). The number of tubes in the IF does not affect sensitivity as much as picture detail and the 721 has about 1 MHz less wide Video IF bandwidth than the 630.

It is interesting to note that the later intercarrier designs allowed set users on strong signal stations to adjust the fine tuning lower on the nyquist slope to improve picture detail and on weaker signal stations move it higher for better signal to noise performance at the expense of detail. The late 40's RCA sets were all split sound design which meant that the fine tuning was set for best sound, ignoring the picture. Hence a side-by-side close comparison will reveal the less expensive design of the 721.

But I would expect that most viewers would not be so critical and at about four feet from the face of the 10BP4 it would be hard to tell the difference in resolution. The DC component loss on the 721 is to me an issue however.

Hi All;
I would be courious to know the difference, like a picture of 630 and another of the 730 with the same picture on it.. So I could tell the difference.. Does anyone have both sets that they could do that with.. Like a side by side comparison..
THANK YOU Marty

I was just flipping through a 1948 issue of Tele-Tech and came across this ad for converting the 630 to a projection set.
I wonder how well they worked :scratch2:
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8354/8292362656_8a029ef5d3_o.png (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8292362656/)

Not i was not expecting THAT, I am used to seeing the units converted with a Norelco ProTelGram unit, this is something quite different.

NEAT! Now to fins one of those units NOS :)

Matt

Hi All;
Now it may be me, or my lack of proper perspective.. But, the Leads on the 0--30KV meter, look a little on the thin side.. Not anything I would want to handle, while measuring even 10KV.. Even though I wouldn't mind a schematic for making one.. I could find an old meter lying around and make something that would tell me close enough the voltage of my old set.. a meter of 0 to 15 would be all that I would need..
THANK YOU Marty

Hey. I just stopped by.

Nice find, Bob. Don't go too wild on that origional finish. You'd be surprised how much it can be reconstituted, but I know you know what yer doing.

So, how many TVs does that make, "Admiral" Bob?:smoke:

Hey. I just stopped by.

Nice find, Bob. Don't go too wild on that origional finish. You'd be surprised how much it can be reconstsuted, but I know you know what yer doing.

Thanks. I'm using a technique I believe you used recently of filling in the voids with fresh lacquer and carefully sanding level. So far, so good :)

... So, how many TVs does that make, "Admiral" Bob?:smoke:

Good question. It's been a while since I counted so I just did a quick count and came up with around 60 :eek: I say around because some are incomplete or damaged.

Good question. It's been a while since I counted so I just did a quick count and came up with around 60 :eek: I say around because some are incomplete or damaged.

You Vintage Maniac...:smoke:

I cleaned up the filthy cabinet with some GoJo and was surprised to see such a difference between the top cover and the rest.
It looks to me like the center cover is walnut while the rest is mahogany. Perhaps it's not the original top and came from a walnut 630TS ?
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8077/8326236323_516482b35a_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8326236323/)

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8496/8327295804_dbff9e81ca_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8327295804/)

I this the sticker ? Sure, I could use a new one. PM sent.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8357/8280223012_8aaaf59be3_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8280223012/)

The other labels on the back are in better shape.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8075/8279177937_9dd0a8a9be_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8279177937/)

I took a closer look at the Weller gun and discovered two in the box. The larger has some damage to the bakelite but the smaller WD-135 on top is in very good condition.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8363/8280222702_eb594f0f56_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8280222702/)

My cousin worked at the weller plant in Palmer township where they assembled these years ago, he still has a stash of them and spare parts.

I cleaned up the filthy cabinet with some GoJo and was surprised to see such a difference between the top cover and the rest.
It looks to me like the center cover is walnut while the rest is mahogany. Perhaps it's not the original top and came from a walnut 630TS ?

Oh yeah. It's very possible.

Who knows? Maybe they were swapped by accident in the back of a TV Repair Shop eons ago.:smoke:

Here's a shot of another mahogany 630TS and you can see it's lid is QC rather than face cut and the color matches the cabinet.
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5216/5462011595_5970fbffd6_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/5462011595/)

Since the lid for this set is already splotchy looking and the color is off I'm even more inclined to refinish it while leaving the rest of the cabinet original. Or perhaps someone out there has a spare mahogany 630TS lid or wants to trade :scratch2:

Bob,

I hate you! Just kidding, that sure looks terrific. Thanks for sharing your TV with us.

The projection lens gimmick from the above ad is very similar to the "100 inch tv" ads that circulated at the end of the crt television era. You received a bare unhoused lens along with instructions to attach this "kit". You basically found a cardboard box that covered the entire face of your television, mounted the open top of the box to cover the screen, while maintaining a proper depth to the box so your crummy plastic lens would focus properly once mounted to the other end of the box. You then took the whole hideous mess to the far end of the room, turned it upside down, and you had a crude projector, making a blurry dim image on the opposite wall of the room. I imagine left and right would still be reversed.

I imagine the 630 lens would be much the same, though you would have to swap some yoke wires to deal with the lens inversion. You really don't want to try playing a 630 upside down.

Hey, you can make your own with the instructions here!

http://www.bigscreentv.20m.com/photo.html

edit: never mind, I just read the WHOLE ad, and see that you are converting a 630 to run on a 5tp4, rf hv supply, etc.

Given the RF high voltage supply they were offering and the NY location, I wonder if that firm eventually became these guys:

http://www.spellmanhv.com/

I had two of these 630's in the past and sold them. They play so well and have such a solid quality about them. I have the chance to get another one that is working and in beautiful original condition. I may go for it. It's just such a large heavy set to try to display!

Hi All;
I was just looking thru this posting and I noticed that 1. Bob's set has the same 4 metal tubes, in the same place's.. And 2. that the Large Dog Bone mostly Green resistor is also there.. Along with other smaller caps and such.. There seems to be a few small differences, due to mostly I think to repairs..
THANK YOU Marty

I started taking a closer look at the chassis to check for bad components. First up the bleeder resistors. I've read these are often bad so wasn't surprised that both sections of the big one on top are open. The candohm below it measures OK though.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8506/8423357026_b684f667c5_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8423357026/) http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8076/8423356848_4c519b7a69_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8423356848/)

Next, I took a look inside the HV cage. The plate cap is gone from the 6BG6 and that HV cap is not mounted very well. I'm guessing it's a replacement.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8330/8422263251_d9dbe97756_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8422263251/) http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8235/8422262567_d713996181_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8422262567/)

Hi All;
Bob, If I am looking at the correct thing in your last picture.. The High Voltage cap in your set is in the same place as the one in my set.. Only the one in my set is about twice as thick, but it is mounted in the same place.. Both clips are the same also the springy open type..
THANK YOU Marty

I'm thinking of using an adjustable 1500 ohm 25W resistor to replace the dead 1360 17W section like this one: http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Ohmite/D25K1K5E/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMtTURnxoZnJAGLMQEl%2fBQ%252bXdwmdWfHx MQQ%3d

Yes, I used an adustable resistor to replace that one in my 630TS. It's the most practical way to get that oddball value.

Phil Nelson

Hi All;
Bob, If I am looking at the correct thing in your last picture.. The High Voltage cap in your set is in the same place as the one in my set.. Only the one in my set is about twice as thick, but it is mounted in the same place.. Both clips are the same also the springy open type..
THANK YOU Marty

Thanks for the confirmation.

Yes, I used an adustable resistor to replace that one in my 630TS. It's the most practical way to get that oddball value.

Phil Nelson

I knew I read about that somewhere ;)
I just checked another 630TS chassis and all sections of both resistors are open :sigh: I may up spending more on power resistors than electrolytics!

Hi All;
In my set the the 1360 is fine, the 6750 is fine, the 12 is open or missing, the 93 is bad as well, the 230 is good, I haven't checked the 56 nor the ion trap coil.. But, I am thinking to go get the variable resistor just in case I need it.. Bob, Thanks for the Mouser link.. When I got my Electrolytics I also got the two resistors..
THANK YOU Marty

I'm not sure what you mean by the 56 ? There's a big 6300 inside the HV cage with a couple taps that's worth checking. Mine is good :)

Hi All;
Bob, yes, that's not in that part of the group with the two large resistors.. But it is part of the long divider chain.. The 56 (R232) is in parallel with the Ion Trap Magnet (coil) L202 and L203, which then goes thru the Focusing Resistors and coil, non of which I have checked for now (R182, R183, R184 and L195).. which ends up at --100 Volts, which also is the Center Tap of the Transformer.. The end of R186A (--18 Volts and R185A 230 ohms leads to R232... At least in my version of the schematic.. If there is no Ion Trap Coil and resistor, then I suppose it would be just a resistor.. I have heard that some sets had no Ion trap Electro-magnet, but a perment Magnet.. I realize that there are different versions of the 630 Schematic.. I also have not Checked the other Large Resistor in the High Voltage cage, I will do that when checking out under the 1B3 and see its condition..
THANK YOU marty

OK, got it. That's just a 1 watt resistor so I didn't check it yet.

I'm thinking of using an adjustable 1500 ohm 25W resistor to replace the dead 1360 17W section like this one: http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Ohmite/D25K1K5E/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMtTURnxoZnJAGLMQEl%2fBQ%252bXdwmdWfHx MQQ%3d

Well, two 680 ohm 10 watt resistors in series also would do it, and they are just $.79 for the pair at Just Radios. (no affiliation)

Jas

Sure, but I'd need to find a way to mount them. I can reuse the original mounting screw with the Ohmite.

This past weekend I finished checking and replacing the bad caps and resistors on my 630TS. I used two 680 ohm resistors for the 1360 as well. Be sure to check the 1 Meg ohm resistor under the HV rectifier, mine read over 8 Meg! I guess my set had lots of hours on it as more than half of the resistors were outside their tolerance and most of the paper caps were way off value and had high leakage. I tried reforming all of the electrolytics and found three of the cans completely open with the other three reading on the low side after reforming. I am going to try those three that did reform to see how well they work. In the long run I plan to replace them before I finish the restoration. I have to wait for a tube order before I can go beyond the DC supply power up check.

Dave

Good luck with your set. I continued on with some testing tonight. The ion trap and focus electromagnet appear to be good. Next, I'll check out the yoke and power transformer.

I also did a little test cleaning. That greenish/grey coating does clean off the caps and chassis fairly easily, but not not looking forward to doing it :drool:
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8372/8429024086_7b4a4cda13_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8429024086/)

It turns out modern 25W Ohmite resistors are 2" long and will fit nicely using the old hardware :)
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8078/8427931801_ac10453c95_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8427931801/)

While rummaging around for power resistors, I came across this one in a box that came with the set. It's identical to the existing HOT resistor except it's bad. Perhaps it's the original and was replaced long ago :scratch2:
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8357/8427931609_30fd41cfce_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8427931609/)

I continued on with some testing tonight. The ion trap and focus electromagnet appear to be good.

A silly question I'm sure, but how did you ascertain that these components are good?

Not silly at all. I compared their resistance to the value indicated in the schematic. I can check the yoke and flyback with my EICO 944. As for the power transformer, I figure I'll pull the 5U4s and fire up the set.

I finally found some time to test the power transformer. It's good :thmbsp:

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8074/8435153032_98a91003f0_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8435153032/) http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8095/8434069213_8a20849617_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8434069213/)

Great Score Bob! Congratulations!

Thanks. My new resistors arrived this afternoon and I just finished installing them. I put some heatshrink over the unused lugs.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8323/8436189931_a52d9e8a83_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8436189931/)

Now onto some cleaning. I'm using a light application of Naval Jelly wiped down with a damp paper towel after a few minutes. Then a little spray of contact cleaner to flush out any remaining crud. I noticed Winky Dink came up with a similar technique recently (http://www.videokarma.org/showthread.php?t=257284) :)

You can see how this chassis might have looked when new in the section that was protected.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8357/8439948042_23d1ebc55c_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8439948042/)


http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8052/8439947128_3b6df76587_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8439947128/)

Making progress.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8355/8438859931_78c9cd7eb3_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8438859931/)

The focus magnet and yoke supports cleaned up very nicely too.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8046/8439946894_d968bed66c_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8439946894/)

I found this label on one of the tubes. That address is close to where I found the set.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8497/8438860983_1dfdc70455_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8438860983/)

Good thing I popped off the HV cage. One of the missing focus coil screws was hiding in there!
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8498/8438860713_121c3ea93e_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8438860713/)

While you have access to the 1B3 socket, check the 1 Meg resistor. Mine measured over 8 Meg.

Dave

Thanks for the tip. Mine measures just a hair over 1Meg - the 3.3 ohm resistor is good too :)

Given the RF high voltage supply they were offering and the NY location, I wonder if that firm eventually became these guys:

http://www.spellmanhv.com/

I think so. The website indicates the company was formed in 1947, about when
the ads for these projection set adaptors first appeared.

Cliff

Cleaning inside the HV cage.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8357/8440653552_6664932ce9_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8440653552/)

That's better :)
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8329/8439562321_bd1e2d5959_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8439562321/)

VERY nice and clean! That might inspire me to try some good cleaning on my sets. My CT-100 has a rather grungy-looking chassis and deserves to look better, for one.

Avoid abrasives. You can get a lot done with isopropyl alcohol, Naval Jelly, and non-scratch plastic cleaning pads.

Phil Nelson

I dug up some wing nuts and thumb screws and remounted the focus coil/yoke properly.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8497/8447036850_b716bd82b4_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8447036850/)

I'm a little surprised at how poorly the HV cage cover fits. Seems there should have been more clearance between the FC and yoke supports. It's rubbing against both.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8235/8447053234_17860dec8a_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8447053234/)

Bob, is that cage "blued steel", some kind of plating or is it just paint? If it is blued, you may try some gun blue from a sporting good store or gun shop. I have found some transformer bells that were blued but somewhat rusty. They responded very well to cleaning and bluing. What comes to mind is a lot of Allied Radio Knight-Kit transformers.

I'm pretty sure it's just paint. I didn't really put much effort into cleaning it yet and I expect it could be made more respectable. The same can't be said of the cover over the bleeder resistors on the left. That paint has blistered from the heat and some rust has set in.

Bob, is that cage "blued steel", some kind of plating or is it just paint? If it is blued, you may try some gun blue from a sporting good store or gun shop. I have found some transformer bells that were blued but somewhat rusty. They responded very well to cleaning and bluing. What comes to mind is a lot of Allied Radio Knight-Kit transformers.

You were right! It is some sort of bluing. I cleaned it with some Naptha then buffed with Meguires Swirl X. I don't doubt that gun blue would work even better.

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8380/8468860383_58704eae1a_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8468860383/)

Any of you 630TS restorers have tips on removing these two electrolytic cans ? The bracket looks like a PITA to get out since at least one nut is blocked by a can.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8528/8469955146_10076a9cc2_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8469955146/)

Can't you just break off the twist lugs to take the cans out? (Not a restorer but used to do this all the time.)

Hi All;
Bob, take out the little can first, take off all the wires and then straighten out the Twist tabs.. Then do the same to the longer one.. Then take the two screws off of the side of the Bracket, that should give you just enough movering room to Back out the longer cap.. If not, You might have to loosten the Screws and nuts a little on the transformer, to get the last quarter inch of room.. Them moving the Bracket out away from the back of the set, you should be able to slide out the cap.. Make sure before taking either cap out the you can wiggle them out some, and that the twist tabs are not still holding the cap in place..
THANK YOU marty

Sure, I could break off the tabs except that I plan on restuffing and remounting the cans.

Thanks Marty. I wasn't sure there would be enough clearance to get out the larger cap. These must be a real pain to service if the horizontal centering pot needs to be replaced!

Bob,

I don't know if you go to a Hamfest from time to time or are a member of a local club. What I did was buy a box of NOS electrolytic cans a few years ago at one of our club auctions. That way, I can just cut off the tabs to remove the capacitor Then I replace the steel "common" ring with a new one. However if one saws the can off, this would not work. I always un-crimp the can and pull the guts. I do really like the looks of a "stuffed" electrolytic can over placing discrete capacitors below. Maybe most of what I have done is stereo tube integrated amplifiers (HH Scott) and there is little to no extra room below deck. Takes me about an hour to do one.

Just a thought.

Glad to see progress. I love these old sets. Who Wudda Thunk that 60 years later, anyone would care about these sets?

Any of you 630TS restorers have tips on removing these two electrolytic cans ? The bracket looks like a PITA to get out since at least one nut is blocked by a can.


I was able to get the larger can out through the bracket and the lower terminal strip with a bit of patience and wiggling. I removed the wires from the capacitor and straightened the mounting tabs. The smaller upper can was still in place at the time.

Sure, I could break off the tabs except that I plan on restuffing and remounting the cans.
Gotcha. I was coming from the mindset of a half century ago when we were replacing with new off the shelf parts.

Hi All;
Bob, I took out all of the cans at once, which was a mistake for sure.. But, now I know.. So, I am Paying for that mistake now.. Live and Learn.. And I have all three manuals / schematics, Sams, Riders and RCA.. If, you do have to loosen the Transformer Screws, it shouldn't need more than about a 1/2 turn, or so.. My only thought about talking the smaller cap out first, was that it would give you some more wiggle room.. And since it has a common resistor tied to both caps, it would be easier that way.. Your choice..
THANK YOU Marty

try Mouser; on page 906 those new 12 mm E-caps too restuff the cans with!!..you can reuse the can to cover up you're restuffing!:banana::banana:Jody

I probably would have just hacksawed those caps off in place. But I'd have to take steps to protect the wiring I see down underneath, next to the transformer. Then thread new cap leads thru the rubber gasket to the cap terminals. It would look like hell, though :D

Hi All;
Personally, I wouldn't Hacksaw a Cap, to me that would be an insult to the idea of Restoration..
THANK YOU Marty

a Dremel tool with a cutoff disk would be awhole lot better:yes::D

Thanks for all the tips :yes:
try Mouser; on page 906 those new 12 mm E-caps too restuff the cans with!!..you can reuse the can to cover up you're restuffing!:banana::banana:Jody

Yep, already ordered them a few weeks ago :D Incredibly small, very long life (10,000 hrs), 105C and high ripple current. The best caps on the market AFAIK. Also a bit expensive but I figured this set was worth it.

I've gone back and forth between un/recrimping the cans and cutting them open. Here's an Admiral chassis I'm also currently working on with one of those new skinny caps in my hand for comparison. I used a very sharp utility blade to cut them open cleanly right at the shoulder.

I will be un/recrimping the RCA caps though.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8385/8471948608_7f2725de79_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8471948608/)

I was able to remove that large electrolytic from my 630 just by removing the wires and solder, straightening the locking tabs, and wiggling it out. Here is how they turned out after the uncrimp, restuff, and recrimp. It certainly is a tight fit, but I had just enough room to get it out and back in.

Dave

That's how I did those cans, too. It has been so long since I did my 630 that I had to find old photos to check.

These days, I would usually cut the cans at the base, but there isn't much room for cutting there. Use a solder sucker and wiggle things, and you can get the tabs loose eventually. If you lose a tab in the process, it's not the end of the world.

Phil Nelson

You guys are lucky, your 630 had those cans at least, someone had removed them from mine and just wired in loose caps will-nilly, stuffed some of them through the fiber washer to hold them in place, others hanging in space, hacked up the wiring, it was a nightmare fixing it, luckily I had the cans from a junked set to restuff.

I just got this 630 from my tech. yesterday. He fully restored the chassis. Interestingly, while the cabinet's fine original condition would lead you to believe it had limited use, the chassis has a replacement CRT, and needed several tubes replaced. It was well used!
This is the third 630 I owned and this one will be a keeper!
http://i1131.photobucket.com/albums/m554/decojoe67/DSC00319_zpsfbec422c.jpg

I just received a reproduction back from Amptech Systems and it's a perfect fit :)
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8526/8601780804_5bf477bc3e_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8601780804/)

I also got one for my 721TS and a custom one for my Stromberg Carlson TV12.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8109/8600680805_d566b54b51.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8600680805/) http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8382/8601781270_d36dfbae78.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8601781270/)

[QUOTE=bandersen;3065702]I just received a reproduction back from Amptech Systems and it's a perfect fit :)
I also got one for my 721TS and a custom one for my Stromberg Carlson TV12QUOTE]

Excellent Bob! It's amazing what is available nowadays.

Those backs are very nice.

I just got this 630 from my tech. yesterday. He fully restored the chassis. Interestingly, while the cabinet's fine original condition would lead you to believe it had limited use, the chassis has a replacement CRT, and needed several tubes replaced. It was well used!
This is the third 630 I owned and this one will be a keeper!
http://i1131.photobucket.com/albums/m554/decojoe67/DSC00319_zpsfbec422c.jpg

I Love Lucy... Show #69 Lucy And Ethel Buy The Same Dress.

Looks good on a correct era set.

I've got the whole Lucy series on 16mm film.

I Love Lucy... Show #69 Lucy And Ethel Buy The Same Dress.

Looks good on a correct era set.

I've got the whole Lucy series on 16mm film.

Your good!:thmbsp:
The clarity is so much better in person on the set. We've all seen these shows many times over, but they are still great classic. Also there is no other early show the equals in picture quality with it. Desi has to be thanked for coming up with using motion picture film on them instead of 16MM kinescopes!

Desi's big beef with CBS was that he and Lucy were dead-set against moving to NYC to do the show live, then have the 'lousy' kinescopes for the rest of the country.

Since CBS owns the show, now, I imagine that they are glad they gave in to him on this.

Desi's big beef with CBS was that he and Lucy were dead-set against moving to NYC to do the show live, then have the 'lousy' kinescopes for the rest of the country.

Since CBS owns the show, now, I imagine that they are glad they gave in to him on this.

The Arnaz family must still be getting royalties from the series. :yes:
It's been said that it's the most syndicated program ever!
Numorous foreign languanges were either dubbed in or subtitled. :D

[QUOTE=holmesuser01;3065741]Desi's big beef with CBS was that he and Lucy were dead-set against moving to NYC to do the show live.....[QUOTE]

They likely would have come to NYC to do the show with no problem, but they had just purchased their dream ranch home in Chatsworth, CA and that's what caused the resistance. The studio also did not want Desi for the part of Lucy's husband, but, once again, Lucy got her way!

Amazingly, I found a spare mahogany lid! The finish on it was miserable so I've been stripping it off. It's very thick which makes me wonder if additional layers of finish were added over the years.
I think it will look a whole lot better than the face cut walnut top it came with :yes:

If anyone is in need of a 630TS/830TS walnut top, just let me know.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8390/8634496649_e169716c54_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8634496649/)

I'm back to working on this set and encountered an issue right away. R150 is 150K while the schematic and parts list clearly shows it as 47K. It sure looks like the original though.
Could someone have gotten confused on the assembly line and used a 150 for R150 instead of 47 ? Or is it a production run change ?

Does anyone have a 630TS chassis handy they can check ?

It's used in a voltage divider network for the brightness control and DC Restorer.
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3826/9254764735_a7ac469258_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9254764735/)

My restored 630 (#36103) chassis has that resistor replaced with a 47K. A picture of that area before restoration has bad focus, but does look like its fuzzy colors are 47K.

Dave

Thanks. I'll go with 47K for now and see what happens.

I encountered another difference this evening - R177 is 2700 in my set but 1800 on the Rider's schematic. However, the RCA service info that came with the set shows 2700. I also notice at the bottom of the page Rider's has W93530-20 while the RCA just has W93530. Both do show 150K for R150 though.
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3769/9264521825_18cd259b73_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9264521825/)

I've have been making progress in spite of the schematic confusion and have this section just about done. I'm surprised at all the cap brands - Aerovox, Cornel Dubilier (C-D), Sprague, Micamold, etc.
No way that electrolytic in the middle could be reformed since it's blown a gasket.
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5501/9264521373_883f6becd2_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9264521373/)

I assumed the cardboard cover was held on by a blob of tar and tried heating it. No luck so eventually I just torn it off and discovered some sort of varnish was used.
Oh well. I'll cut it open, restuff and fabricated a new tube from something.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7366/9264522357_0389c915a1_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9264522357/)

I cut the can open, unrolled the insides and found evidence of a short.
I wonder if that's why the main voltage divider power resistor was open :scratch2:
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5503/9272524826_bcc1697a02_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9272524826/) http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3765/9272524330_785034ab7e_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9272524330/)

I managed to extracate the two caps under the chassis without too much trouble.
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5523/9301044293_cf452b13f5_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9301044293/)

Most of the caps have shown signs of leakage externally and shorts internally.
http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2817/9301046947_b711957558_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9301046947/) http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3712/9303830702_383ebfcbe9_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9303830702/)

I don't need reminding why it's not a good idea to use old dried out caps, but others might....

I managed to get them all opened up and installed new caps. Plenty of room with these "skinny" Nichicons.
Next, I'll re-crimp the bases and start the unpleasant task of reinstalling them correctly!
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7453/9308884759_4a325143e4_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9308884759/)

Hi All;
Bob, it makes me wonder, if maybe some one had tried to plug in the set, at a later time, and that caused the Cap-shorts and the Burned out Resistor-dividers.. Just a thought.. Glad you are making good progress.. It looks good..
THANK YOU Marty

Bob-

Nice work on those capacitors. I gave up on unsoldering the ones that were grounded to the chassis on my 8TS30, because I could not get enough heat on the terminals, even with a 140-watt gun. How did you do it?

I used my Weller WES51 iron with temperature controlled tip. It will pump more current into the tip to try to keep the temp up. Even so, it was just barely up to the task on some lugs. Another 10 watts or so and it'd be perfect.

I find guns to be nearly useless because the tips cool down rapidly. That includes my Weller 260 watt gun.

The biggest challenge so far in this set is actually the wiring. It appears to be waxed cloth over a tar like substance. That tar has gone rock hard over the years and is very brittle. I can make the wires pliable by gently warming them with a heat gun but as soon as they cool down, they're rock hard again. Too much heat and the tar oozes out.

I've been using Sprague "orange drops" when they'll fit. Otherwise axial Mallory caps.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7303/9316571496_0d090e2af8_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9316571496/)

I've made a couple concessions to modern components so far.

One is this 5K, 5W resistor which had already been replaced with a big dogbone. The modern replacement is so small and brown it's hardly noticeable anyway.
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5337/9316583392_4b3e0fe5bf_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9316583392/)

The other are the AC line bypass caps. I expect these old Micamolds would make a nice bang if I tried to use them.
http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2878/9313894499_2fd73065f2_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9313894499/)

I've reached about the halfway point :)
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5342/9316681978_b77f4e4b0f_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9316681978/)

Re: different branded caps: the set was postwar and the manufacturers were cranking out radios and televisions as fast as they could after the war's shutdown of consumer electronics: I suspect they bought parts from wherever they could find them, as also seen in sets using a mix of styles of tubes.

That makes sense. I've also found some resistors in parallel to get the right value.

Might as well polish before installing. No more yellowy nicotine tinge.
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5458/9316639601_ee283551ed_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9316639601/)

Here's another puzzler. This 150K resistor isn't shown in the RCA or Riders service info.
http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2806/9322986328_a503ac51c0_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9322986328/)

I did find it in the Sams but it says for 630TCS (console) version only :scratch2:
http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2879/9320191859_d0435615c1_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9320191859/)

Tight quarters down in this area so I decided to pull the control out.
I found a 330K that read 3.3M lurking down in there,
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3684/9337305160_0e2708fed6_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9337305160/) http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3788/9334519505_8f8c63e1c4_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9334519505/)

That is a tricky area on these sets, especially when you're restuffing and have to put those big caps back into the set. I wish I had thought of removing the control when I was working on mine.

It definitely helps, but it's still tricky.

I've taken a break from under the chassis to finish cleaning the topside.
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3704/9346908355_ff3c2f2c38_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9346908355/)

I discovered this trap slug had broken loose and gives me a chance to see what's inside. So glad it didn't get lost or damaged!
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5327/9346908691_dc97bcdab8_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9346908691/)

Bob, how do you recommend repairing that broken trap slug? I have a broken one on my Crosley too. In fact, think it's the exact same one that's broken too.

I'm planning on using some wood glue.

I was wondering what type of glue to use. Know some cements can be damaging to some materials - especially vintage stuff. THANKS!

I've never actually glued one of those coils back together before, but I figure wood glue will work well on that material without harming it.

I'm just about done down in this cramped corner. The original 0.005 mfd cap across the audio output transformer had been replaced with a 0.01 mfd.
I put it back to 0.005 mfd but didn't have any more nice yellow Aerovox caps to restuff.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7399/9368831378_54a6e70297_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9368831378/)

I'm finally finished with the recapping!
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3712/9383693852_fa323823be_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9383693852/)

Next came testing all the tubes. I found quite a few that were weak or had shorts and the 1B3 HV rectifier had an open filament.

I also found two 6BC5s and a 6AU6 in place of 6AG5s. Maybe those are valid subs? I'm not sure so replaced them.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7355/9391084950_d7960ddb87_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9391084950/) http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7394/9391084430_7bfbbfb6ee_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9391084430/)

I'm going to go through the resistance test chart to double check my work then try powering it up.

First power up was a mixed bag.

The good news - nothing blew up, the voltages seem reasonable and I am able to hear our LP VHF channel 6 :)

Bad news - HV very weak at around 2 KV so no chance of a raster. Drive control had no effect :(

Odd news - I'm receiving some FM radio stations loud and clear on VHF 2 and 3 :scratch2:

http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3815/9391917750_15ec0043e6_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9391917750/)

Hi Bob;
I have the same thing, because, of the Sound being on a different set of IF circuits than the video, the sound when it is out of alignment, can pick up some of the FM stations.. In fact, when I first powered my set up, that was How I know I had B+ was that I had picked up a local FM station.. As, I didn't have any picture either.. but, mine was mostly all of the adjustments all out of wack.. But, I do remember a time when I had low HV at about the same as you 2KV, I don't remember though what it was.. I think largely adjustments..
THANK YOU Marty

There's not much to adjust in the horizontal section. All the resistance and voltage readings are within spec. I'll try swapping out some tubes then fire up a scope and check waveforms. I can the the three or four mica caps in that area too.

Odd news - I'm receiving some FM radio stations loud and clear on VHF 2 and 3 :scratch2:



You're likely picking up an "image". As the IF in your set is likely around 22MHz, and the local oscillator being higher than the desired reception frequency, if the FM radio station is strong enough, and located 44MHz higher than channels 2 or 3, the FM station will be heard.

I finally caught the station ID and it's 107.9 FM which is a very strong station. Subtracting 42.5 (21.25 MHz audio IF carrier) results in 65.4 or almost the 65.75 audio carrier of channel 3. Thanks for solving that mystery :)

The waveforms on the cathode of the HOT and damper are dead on both in frequency, shape and amplitude.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7362/9398570544_4f904a4f21.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9398570544/) http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3808/9398568842_44fe02fbc2.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9398568842/)

So even though I had previously tested the flyback, etc. inside the HV cage, I decided to take another look. Right away I noticed this mica cap between lugs #1 and #4 which does not appear on the schematic.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7342/9398569936_5b8fb0c27a.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9398569936/)

I compared it to another 630TS chassis and there's no mica cap here but a paper cap has been added. Hmm, I think I'll remove that mica cap and recheck everything.
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5450/9395802141_1cac7d97f1.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9395802141/)

Removing the mica cap had no obvious effect so I tried replacing the HV cap. All I had on hand was 1000pF rather than 500pF like the original. That seemed to help a little and I'm up to 5.5 kV now.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7354/9396706853_afbb5382d7_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9396706853/)

I figure that should be enough to see some glow on the CRT. Then I remembered that the ion trap electromagnet would mess up these test CRTs and removed it from the neck.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7373/9396708241_e3535e14b1_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9396708241/)

Still nothing until I rotated the focus control fully CCW. Finally, a trace!
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3784/9399474614_41c683ddfb_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9399474614/)

Swapping out the 6J5 vertical oscillator tube got me some height.
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3725/9399473868_2b5632d373_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9399473868/)

Finally, I feed in a signal and after a lot of tweaking got stable image and decent sound :)
http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2805/9396707563_653db825d1_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9396707563/)

Hi All;
Bob, I Knew You could do it.. Congratulations.. :D :D
THANK YOU Marty

Thanks, but I haven't really fixed it yet, HV is only half of what it should be and FM radio reception is overpowering on channels 2-4.

I tested the mica caps in the horizontal circuits and they're fine. I also replaced the 1 Meg and 3.3 ohm resistor under the HV socket. No improvement. That pretty much just leaves the flyback.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7307/9399708539_0ee168389a_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9399708539/)

When I first got the set, I tested the flyback using an EICO 944 and Sencore VA-62. I got odd readings on both indicating there might be an issue. However, I got identical readings with another 630TS fly and I figured the odds of them both failing in the same way were unlikely. Also, since I do get horizontal deflection on the CRT it seems to me the fly must be OK :dunno:

Hi All;
Bob, Do You have a B&K 1077 or something similiar ?? With the B&K unit, you can both Test and insert Signals from the Picture Tube back.. As well as test your Horizontal Section.. Also, since you mentioned your Cathode on your HOT, You should look arround there to see If you have it wired up correctly, just a thought..
THANK YOU Marty

Another great tv coming back to life in your skilled hands!

This is kinda like watching a suspense movie...you know it's going to turn out good in the end, but it's exciting to watch as it goes along.

Hi All;
Bob, Do You have a B&K 1077 or something similiar ?? With the B&K unit, you can both Test and insert Signals from the Picture Tube back.. As well as test your Horizontal Section.. Also, since you mentioned your Cathode on your HOT, You should look arround there to see If you have it wired up correctly, just a thought..
THANK YOU Marty

Yes, I have a 1077 and VA62. All the resistance, voltage and waveforms match the service info within 20% or so.

Another great tv coming back to life in your skilled hands!

This is kinda like watching a suspense movie...you know it's going to turn out good in the end, but it's exciting to watch as it goes along.

Thanks. I must admit this was one of my least favorite sets to recap but now that it's coming back to life I'm liking it more and more :)

I think I might be on to something regarding the flyback. I dug up a crusty old fly from an Admiral 30A1 which crosses to a Thordarson FLY-1 same as the RCA.
http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2873/9401802919_a86dbb039c_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9401802919/)

I cleaned it up and did a ringing test with a VA62 and got 12. The manual says 10 or above is good. The best I can get with the RCA is only 3 :no: Perhaps that has something to do with why the original 1B3 filament was burned out.

The resistance readings are slightly different, but they are physically identical. Also the 30A1 horizontal circuitry is nearly identical to the RCA so I'm pretty sure it's a legit substitute. One way to find out for sure ;)

Eagerly awaiting the result. Do I have time to make a cup of tea?

Hi All;
The suspense is killing me.. Will Bob, get another FLY to do its thing, or will it be another FLY on the wall.. Among the many Fly's on his walls, in the summer.. What will He get, a squashed fly or a good FLY..
THANK YOU Marty

I didn't get much sleep last night and worked all day but a pot of coffee is brewing right now. I'll try to make the swap later tonight.

Luckily, that's a common fly and I have several to choose from :)

I pulled the RCA flyback completely out of the set and it now tests good with 10 rings! Sencore clearly states you can test it in circuit so long as you pull the rectifier tube.

So perhaps the problem likes in the width or linearity coils that connect to the fly or maybe the yoke ?

Where's the choke?

Where's the choke? It uses the speaker field coil for the power supply choke. Why do you ask ?


I ended up testing four flybacks in all. With my Sencore VA62 and YF33, they test between 9 and 10 rings where 10 rings and up is considered good. My Eico 944 showed them all well into the good although the RCA did buzz during testing.
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5347/9411524028_993ceeb112_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9411524028/)

Then, I tried testing the horizontal yoke coils. They showed bad on all three meters. So I pulled a couple nearly identical yokes out of Admiral sets, and they too test bad but about the same as each other.

I dug up a NOS yoke from the early 50s and it tested very good on all meters. That leads me to believe that for some reason these meters are not capable of testing very early yokes properly.

The yoke currently in the set is an RCA 201D3 and I have a spare 201D1. The D3 has a 56pF cap while the D1 has a 39pF I wonder if that's the only difference ? I figure I'll swap out the caps and give it a try.
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3773/9411523334_b332f0239e_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9411523334/)

I left the original yoke in the set and replace the flyback with an Admiral. That did the trick :) Glad I tried that before messing around with the yoke.
I popped in the full sized CRT but couldn't get an image until I tried a PM trap rather than the electromagetic one. I'll have to investigate that further.

http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3736/9410311395_a38b415562_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9410311395/)

http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5448/9410311849_a182f34b4c_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9410311849/)

After a few minutes of operation, the vertical holds gets very touchy and retrace lines appear. The contrast is pretty touchy too and the sound is poor. Even so it's a big improvement :yes:
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7304/9410312269_83c678f39b_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9410312269/)

I finally found the sweet spot for the electromagnetic ion trap :) Note that this isn't the CRT that came with the set. It had tested weak so I put it aside in favor of this strong one. I think I'll dig it out later tonight and see what sort of picture it can produce.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7447/9419267582_17917d88ca_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9419267582/)

I finally figured out why my fluke 80K-40 HV probe was giving me troubles. The cup the tip screws into had broken loose from the resistor divider!

I soldered it back together and can now say with some certainty that I have 8.5 kV on the CRT anode while the schematic calls for 9kV.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7426/9418730187_3ac736f827_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9418730187/)

I replaced a leaky mica cap in the vertical oscillator and video detector circuits. Also, the 6AU6 final video amp tube was acting weird. After running a while, it would be quite hot and the picture would start fading away. Probably a short was developing in it so it was replaced. All that took care of my vertical hold issue and improved the contrast :)
The other micas are suspect as well and will be replaced once my order arrives from Mouser in a few days.

http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3712/9450535934_cb9a12401a_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9450535934/)

...
I ended up testing four flybacks in all. With my Sencore VA62 and YF33, they test between 9 and 10 rings where 10 rings and up is considered good.
...


I've never tested a Flyback using a test instrument.
I also have a Sencore VA62 -- I'll have to give it a go to see
how its done.

Carl

I just tried a VA62 and a VA62A on my 630TS flyback in circuit. Both read 3 rings with the leads connected to the HOT cap lead and HV rectifier cap lead with the rectifier removed. Not sure how accurate my Heathhkit HV probe is, but it reads about 8KV on the CRT anode with a bright picture. My flyback also had an extra capacitor on it, but I left it off during the re-cap. My picture is a bit narrow so it may benefit from a little added capacitance to get more width.

Dave

Thanks for the info. I get 3 rings in circuit too. I think it's from the yoke loading it down.

Now that the set is running well, I decided to reinstall the original flyback and give it one last try before writing it off. Surprisingly, it works just fine! Around 9.7-10.3 kV depending on the drive control setting.

I have no idea why the HV was low earlier :scratch2: I've replaced, swapped and adjusted so much at this point...

Looking good Bob :thmbsp:...Mr Mica Cap strikes again..in some ways I'm kind of glad that NZ TV sets aren't old enough to have those types of micas in amongst the circuit but then again a certain brand of resistor were used in a number of NZ models which are really bad for being very high so that in itself keeps one busy! :)
Cheers Glen.

Thanks. At least these micas are fairly easy to get at and are common values.

Here's a test with the original CRT the set came with. It didn't show very good emissions in my tester, but it looks fine to me.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7322/9476842402_4b6cd11b67_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9476842402/)

I started going through the alignment procedure tonight. The video IF barely needed any tweaking which didn't surprise me since the picture was quite good already.

The audio IF on the other hand were off quite a bit. Now I have plenty of volume and FM stations aren't leaking in but there is some background hiss. That's after performing the VTVM type alignment. Next, I'll try the visual approach and get an S curve up on the scope.

That was all with channel #3. The sound on channel #4 is identical to 3, but the video has snow. Tweaking the channel oscillator helped but nowhere near enough :scratch2:

Here's what I have for the S curve. Background hiss is unchanged using the OTA converter box I use on the workbench. I tried a different brand and it had much lower volume. I'll try a blonder tongue modulator next.
http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2880/9618205595_e34e62bc4b_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9618205595/)

The bandwidth is around 4 MHZ. That's the 2nd from left section where I can make out vertical strips. The last bar is 4.5 MHz.
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3783/9618202041_e0b4591a47_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9618202041/)

Vertical linearity needs a slight tweak, but the horizontal looks great.
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3677/9621441450_00c2ab3e68_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9621441450/)

I decided to cheat a little for the time being and stick this chassis into a cabinet from another set that's in better shape. I'll continue working on the original cabinet when I can.

http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2865/9622804215_109e034d15_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9622804215/) http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5329/9622804735_230dcfbfd4_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9622804735/)

It also a somewhat later production (C61036 vs C29885) that used a plastic channel plate versus a brass one.
http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2857/9622805185_f4ab5fbc68_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9622805185/)

Here's a better look at the stand.
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3711/9622806179_3d274823eb_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9622806179/)

I've had trouble with low volume, even on newer sets, with the Magnavox converters. The other makes seem to be a little better with the volume. :yes:

I too had low volume with a Magnavox converter. An Access DTA1010 was noticeable better. Once I get the set back together, I'll try a Blonder Tongue modulator.

I don't know what is up with these low volume modulators. A few of the DVD players that I have are low volume as well. It was mentioned in another thread a few years ago that the RF may be down somewhat to keep these things from too much radiation and causing interference back when RF analog was still happening. I don't know. But I have to agree, low volume seems to be the "norm".

Now the Blonder Tongue seems to have none of those problems. Cool...

The nicer BT modulator models have separate controls for video, audio and RF levels so you can tailor them for your set.

The nicer BT modulator models have separate controls for video, audio and RF levels so you can tailor them for your set.

Yes exactly. I bought a BT CATV system amplifier. But I found that I didn't need it. The output from the modulators was quite adequate.

I'm making good progress touching up the cabinet. My goal is to fill in any voids in the lacquer (mostly from aligatoring) and touch up and finish loss.

I'm doing the main panels first, then the trim.
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5502/9681135419_5db89941ab_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9681135419/) http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5504/9684365452_26612277c5_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9684365452/)

After a light sanding with 320 grit, I give it a couple coats of lacquer then more sanding. Any pits or cracks are filled in with a small brush then sanded flush. Finally, a couple more coats sprayed on.
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3757/9649758038_257c301a32_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9649758038/) http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5466/9681127755_3037abc4ba_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9681127755/) http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7379/9681127291_48d6759bce_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9681127291/)

I figure I'll touch up the trim with Mohawk brown mahogany for the medium trim and deep red mahogany for the very dark trim.
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3796/9681128225_b71e8732dd_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/9681128225/)

How long after you apply the lacquer do you wait before you can sand?

It depend on the temp and humidity and also the type of lacquer used. With Deft lacquer sanding sealer, usually a couple hours is enough but it's not as hard as gloss nitro cellulose based lacquer. The gloss I'll let sit least 12 hours or maybe less on a hot dry day.

If you don't wait long enough, it may be a little gummy or shrink after you've leveled it and you'll need to apply more lacquer and sand it again.