View Full Version : Picked up another rectangular tube


lnx64
04-25-2012, 10:15 AM
Saw this and fell in love with the design. It's front POTs all need deoxit, highly sensitive or "stuck" but do turn after some working then start functioning too..

It looks like the tube works too, just needs a tad more on the red drive, as grey is "ever so slightly green". But otherwise seemed to work.

I know nothing about this TV though, so any information would be great.

Needs cleaning.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v395/Evilweredragon/IMG_0347.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v395/Evilweredragon/IMG_0348.jpg

The manufacturer date is worn out and can't be read, but this TV does appear to be solid state mostly, only seeming to possibly have a tube in the HV stage, judging by looking through the cracks..

lnx64
04-25-2012, 10:46 AM
Oooh, and just noticed, Made in the USA! Sweeeeeet!

radiotvnut
04-25-2012, 10:48 AM
That TV is from the '84-'86 time period and is 100% solid state. If you plan on using this TV, you might want to obtain a spare flyback transformer for it. The flyback in these sets was bad about suddenly blowing up and causing a major odor. I've also seen a fair amount of Samsung's with weak CRT's. Other than the flyback blowing up, the chassis was fairly reliable.

lnx64
04-25-2012, 10:56 AM
That's not encouraging. :( It seemed to work fine when it turned on, no odor and was a bright picture.

I'll take it apart later and do a cleaning and get a picture of it inside. It's HV section had a large metal shield, but it may just be a large heat sink.

When it was on, it did have excessive pin-cussion, bowing out on the sides. How can that be fixed?

lnx64
04-25-2012, 01:16 PM
Now when you say blow up, how bad? I have a tendency to fall asleep with the tv on.

radiotvnut
04-25-2012, 04:47 PM
I actually saw one of these blow up once.

A. TV was working fine.
B. All of a sudden, it lost horizontal sync and the picture pulled in from the sides.
C. A few seconds later, I heard a loud BANG followed by smoke and a severe odor.

When I opened the set, the flyback had a huge crack all the way around the case with little pieces of it's internal copper windings hanging out the side.

When the flyback shorted and blew up, it took the horizontal output transistor, the B+ regulator, and the fuses with it.

Sometimes, they will develop a hairline crack in the case. When this happens, HV leaks out and can arc to the metal heatsink. Other times, the area around the crack will carbonize and the transformer will burn, stink, and smoke until the power is killed.

Other times, the flyback will create no fourth of July exhibit or show any signs of it being defective. It will simply short and the HOT will blow before it has time to blow up.

What I described is not limited to Samsung TV's. I've seen it happen alot with Goldstar, Panasonic/Quasar, KTV, Sampo, Emerson, AOC, Kawasho, and other "low end" brands of TV's from the '80's and early '90's.


And, you'll want to be careful when buying a new flyback. It's best to stick with an OEM part, when available. I you have to go with a generic brand, HR-Diemen are generally the best. Try to stay away from "no name" generic brands that are sold ultra cheap from discount parts houses. I've had those blow up within hours of installing them. So, it's best to spend a little more and get a reliable part. I've had more than my share of cheap knock-off parts that either failed to function at all; or, died shortly after installation.

lnx64
04-25-2012, 05:17 PM
I ran it for some time, and it didn't seem to happen.. It doesn't happen to them all does it? I paid $15, so it's not a huge loss, but it'd suck though.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v395/Evilweredragon/IMG_0352.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v395/Evilweredragon/IMG_0354.jpg

The chroma isn't centered, it's shifted just a tad, but that's ok. But the only big issue I'm seeing, is that the picture every once in a while will flash brighter on a single interlaced field.. I don't know if it's happening from the flaky POTs on front, or if it's just picking up interference from the RF.

lnx64
04-25-2012, 08:45 PM
So, I'm afraid to even use this TV now. I think perhaps I'll put it to the side as a backup TV or something.

radiotvnut
04-25-2012, 11:25 PM
I wouldn't worry about it. Chances are good that the flyback has already been replaced at some point. I don't know where you're located; but, I live in the deep south where it's very hot & humid. It seems that those conditions had a lot to do with flyback failures.

lnx64
04-25-2012, 11:29 PM
I'm in Orlando FL, and it doesn't appear the flyback was ever touched.

lnx64
04-25-2012, 11:57 PM
So after some examination of this TV, it has a slight flicker of it's brightness. Not noticeable on bright screens, and only when it's a dark grey screen.

It also has this weird glowing at the top left corner of the screen. It glows there for some reason, even with the brightness turned down, but only when the contrast is turned up.

lnx64
04-26-2012, 12:40 AM
Dude I think the Flyback is a concern. When I was looking inside the vents trying to see if I can see any broken caps for the flickering brightness, I can hear tiny little static sounds that are constantly going.

This is worrying me.. What should I start looking for?

EDIT: Hmm this is odd, I took the TV apart and guess what, it's working fine now, no crackling or flickering. Wha?

EDIT2: When it heated back up while open it started doing it again. Could it be excessive dust?
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v395/Evilweredragon/IMG_0358.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v395/Evilweredragon/IMG_0359.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v395/Evilweredragon/IMG_0360.jpg

dieseljeep
04-26-2012, 08:54 AM
In the last picture, did you look at the area that looks like it got hot. Maybe the PC board needs soldering below that spot.

lnx64
04-26-2012, 11:05 AM
What area? I'm not seeing it.

dieseljeep
04-26-2012, 12:37 PM
What area? I'm not seeing it.

Third picture, PC board top view. Close to R514. Check the soldered side.

lnx64
04-26-2012, 06:55 PM
It looked fine to me. Just checked when cleaning the tv.

I'm running it now to warm it up since cleaning it. I did notice a fuses solder joint was rusted so I reflowed it. I didn't have solder with me though so I reflowed what was there. Someone stole my role of solder.

Username1
04-26-2012, 07:10 PM
you know I vacuum out all the dust in my old transistor sets like that one each year before the summer humidity, especially around the flyback. Use vacuum & paint brush to brush off the dust. pc board too, tube, and tube socket and the electronics on the tube socket too. It looks very clean around r-514, looks like the flyback has not been touched in my opinion. I bet it will run for years, keep it dust free, and keep the brightness below half to keep the tube from over driving and make it last longer. Nice set. I have a few mid 80's Sharp sets they are really good sets.

lnx64
04-26-2012, 07:20 PM
Hope it lasts. :P

This is as good as I could clean it, using a paint brush.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v395/Evilweredragon/IMG_0366.jpg

Not perfect but better than before..

EDIT: The picture still flickers in the dark regions.. Argh! I can't think of what it could be

Electronic M
04-26-2012, 07:30 PM
Cold solder joints have always plagued PCBs. Touching up the soldering might help if that is the issue.

lnx64
04-26-2012, 07:36 PM
I really think it is a cold solder joint.. Problem is, I can't find which one, and I don't have the patience to do every single one.

Anyone in Florida willing to help me out?

The crackling does appear to be gone though..

lnx64
04-27-2012, 12:33 AM
Ok, so since cleaning, the brightness itself isn't going crazy anymore, and the crackling sound has gotten very quiet now (i can still faintly hear it but not as bad).

But, the picture still occasionally has a bright flash in certain horizontal parts of the picture. It's different every time. This only occurs when it warms up though, not when cold.

Earlier I tried tapping parts of the board with a stick but it seemed to have no affect in showing any parts with cold solder joints.

I managed to capture the flicker on video via my iPhone and this is how fast it flashes and it does this as often as every 8 seconds. Each picture is a frame in the video, so at 30fps, it was only 2 frames it showed up.

First frame is before the flash even appears.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v395/Evilweredragon/Flicker1/1.png
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v395/Evilweredragon/Flicker1/2.png
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v395/Evilweredragon/Flicker1/3.png

EDIT: I take that back. It's crackling in the back again. It's just so hard to hear it though, has to be a quiet room, but it does do it, and now the flickering is once every couple seconds..

Here's a recording of the crackling.

http://www.mediafire.com/?yhz99rx9qr7pwqg

It seems to correspond to the flashing on the TV. The louder the crackle, the more flashing.

dieseljeep
04-27-2012, 09:49 AM
I didn't have solder with me though so I reflowed what was there. Someone stole my role of solder.[/QUOTE]

For what that stuff costs today, you have to keep it in a safe.:tears:

lnx64
04-27-2012, 09:50 AM
Especially my non-lead free solder. I don't like lead free solder..

I made a video btw showing the flashing: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9VU97yfXScE

Hopefully this can be easily solved, but if not, what kind of flyback can I install in it? I can't find any OEM flybacks.

lnx64
04-29-2012, 12:20 AM
Anyone in Florida willing to help me out? I just don't have time to do this.

I'll buy you lunch, a good lunch..

Also, is it possible, that the flybacks anode wire, running across the back of the CRT resting on the aquadag coating, like it is in the pics, be causing this whole problem? Should it be standed off? If so, where can I get those spacer things I see on newer CRT's.

mrflex65
04-29-2012, 05:25 AM
Can you tell where the arcing is coming from? Flyback?Maybe the anode cap perhaps?Could even be bad solder joints arcing underneath around the flyback. Could even be in between the flyback and the pcb.:scratch2:Can you pull the board and get better pics of the flyback area?

lnx64
04-29-2012, 12:07 PM
Thats the problem, I can't tell where the arcing is coming from. I'll try to get better pics when I have it opened next.

lnx64
04-29-2012, 01:02 PM
OK here you go. I also installed some spacers on the anode wire since I was concerned about how it was just riding along the aquadag.

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v395/Evilweredragon/TV%20Board/

I also accidentally broke off a corner of the board (and I feel like CRAP about that, I hadn't noticed when I was holding the board the corner fell into a slot on the back cover), but it appears to still be working fine despite that broken corner.

EDIT: Oh, and it's flyback transformer is a FCM-2015AL.. I see only one on eBay that claims "Genuine" but I don't have any way to tell if it IS genuine.

EDIT: With standoffs, still doing it when warmed up.. I'm going to get a rubber tube and try to "listen" for where this crackle is, cause it is related to the flashing.. The crackling comes when the flashing does.

tvcollector
04-29-2012, 01:56 PM
I have a portable Samsung from around this era, and I notice the flyback transformer is a bit loud, like it's about to go Kaboom! I had a quasar from the early 80s go up like fireworks back in the early 90s. We were watching it, all of a sudden we heard a loud bang (Like lighting a bottle rocket fire cracker off), picture went blank and we smelled this odd odor..

lnx64
04-29-2012, 01:58 PM
Well here's the weird thing, that crackling I'm hearing, it is not coming from within the flyback. I used my bamboo tipped stethoscope, and I can hear the ticking from the high voltage, but not that random crackling chatter. So it's coming from somewhere else..

lnx64
04-29-2012, 02:38 PM
I have found the location of the crackling!

I was only probing one part of the flyback, but not other parts, then I found it.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v395/Evilweredragon/possiblecrackle.jpg

Sooooooo, flyback?

mrflex65
04-29-2012, 02:43 PM
Could be a internal connection going bad?:scratch2:

lnx64
04-29-2012, 02:53 PM
I think so..

I cleaned the flyback even more, and it exposed this.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v395/Evilweredragon/IMG_0403.jpg

Yep, it's cracking and falling apart...

So I need a new one.. Anyone have a FCM-2015AL?

For safety reasons, this TV has been set aside and im using my hybrid set again.

DaveWM
04-29-2012, 03:49 PM
http://www.acme-sales.net/portal.php?country=USA

local orlando too

lnx64
04-29-2012, 03:57 PM
Are they going to be reliable? I want to go by what radiotvnut said about cheap ones.

I found a HR one, but it's nearly 33 dollars and not even in America.

If this one at ACME works then I'll use that, I just don't want flybacks blowing up when watching TV.

mrflex65
04-29-2012, 03:58 PM
I think so..

I cleaned the flyback even more, and it exposed this.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v395/Evilweredragon/IMG_0403.jpg

Yep, it's cracking and falling apart...

So I need a new one.. Anyone have a FCM-2015AL?

For safety reasons, this TV has been set aside and im using my hybrid set again.

Yeah, i would say so!It's just a matter of time when it starts arcing externally....:yes:
I dunno if you tried this already,but have the set on with the back off in a dark room and see if you can see it arcing?:scratch2:

DaveWM
04-29-2012, 03:59 PM
I have no idea, I would recommend not getting it then.

lnx64
04-29-2012, 04:04 PM
I did try it on with the lights off, but saw nothing. It took my hearing bamboo stick to hear it even coming from the flyback at the back section.

Dave, I contacted that company via Email, I'm gonna see if they will let me come and see the flyback in person..

radiotvnut
04-29-2012, 04:07 PM
Your only choices may be the HR or the cheap one. The demand for flyback transformers has taken a nosedive, since the DTV switch; and, they are somewhat harder to find than they were just a few years ago. I think I ordered a flyback from that Acme outfit and it worked OK; but, I can't speak for how this one would work in your TV.

The ones I had the most trouble with came from a place called Dalbani. I got one generic RCA flyback from Tritronics that blew up within a few hours. The generic looked nothing like the original and it was a real pain getting the pins to line up with the holes on the PC board.

lnx64
04-29-2012, 04:17 PM
Ill probably do the acme one then. I still want to see their flyback first though. Some of the cheap ones dont have an anode wire long enough for this tv.

mrflex65
04-29-2012, 04:28 PM
Hope everything works out for you! Good luck!:thmbsp:

lnx64
04-29-2012, 04:55 PM
Thanks.. Sucks that today is Sunday, they likely aren't open.

lnx64
04-30-2012, 04:47 PM
Placed an order for the HR one on the Ireland site (only site I could find that even had the HR one).

I want quality, and the ACME place don't allow local pickup, and won't show a picture of the item, thus they lost my sale.

lnx64
05-01-2012, 04:48 PM
Hey, quick question. Due to me having some hearing issues, and closed caption not always being the best solution, I would like to add a headphone jack to the side of this TV. I used to have an old 19" rotary when I was a little kid that had one on the right side. I would like to add one to this TV, and I could easily make a perfect clean round hole for such a jack. That's not a problem.

The problem though, is how the heck do I wire it to this speaker? It's an 8 ohms speaker. I can easily probably use one of those mono ear buds. How can I wire in such a headphone jack?

EDIT: Also, upon removing the old flyback, how the hell do you remove the focus wire out of the CRT socket?!

lnx64
05-01-2012, 08:34 PM
Ok, so Flyback disassembly has started.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v395/Evilweredragon/TV%20Board/IMG_0413.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v395/Evilweredragon/TV%20Board/IMG_0412.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v395/Evilweredragon/TV%20Board/IMG_0407.jpg

I also cleaned around the anode hole, to keep it from arcing from dust.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v395/Evilweredragon/TV%20Board/IMG_0406.jpg

dieseljeep
05-02-2012, 01:03 PM
Hey, quick question. Due to me having some hearing issues, and closed caption not always being the best solution, I would like to add a headphone jack to the side of this TV. I used to have an old 19" rotary when I was a little kid that had one on the right side. I would like to add one to this TV, and I could easily make a perfect clean round hole for such a jack. That's not a problem.

The problem though, is how the heck do I wire it to this speaker? It's an 8 ohms speaker. I can easily probably use one of those mono ear buds. How can I wire in such a headphone jack?

EDIT: Also, upon removing the old flyback, how the hell do you remove the focus wire out of the CRT socket?!

When you're finished replacing the flyback and the set is working properly, check the speaker wiring. See if the set has an output transformer. If not, the audio stage could be coupled to the chassis ground, which might be a slight shock hazard.

lnx64
05-05-2012, 12:48 AM
I'll probably skip it then to just be safe.

Btw, thanks guys for the flyback warning. I finally de-soldered the flyback today and cleaned it up, and holy crap there's a lot of cracking on this case..

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v395/Evilweredragon/IMG_0422.jpg

So right now it just sits on top of the TV. I'd throw out the flyback, but I'm almost tempted to just "play" with it, safely of course.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v395/Evilweredragon/IMG_0423.jpg

lnx64
05-10-2012, 02:59 AM
Still waiting on this flyback. The company I ordered the HR7477 from, Dönberg Electronics, 10 days later, still doesn't have the part to even start shipping it.

Getting upset now.

dieseljeep
05-10-2012, 08:38 AM
Still waiting on this flyback. The company I ordered the HR7477 from, Dönberg Electronics, 10 days later, still doesn't have the part to even start shipping it.

Getting upset now.

My brother had a set like it. I think he took it to Best Buy for recycling. He doesn't even ask me if I want the sets anymore, as I have so many.
Too bad you don't live around here. I have several that work, free to a good home.:yes:

lnx64
05-14-2012, 12:07 PM
Jesus christ! They just told me it "could" be another 2 weeks before they even ship out this transformer.

Screw this, I'm going to probably order from the local ACME company. I just don't want cheap transformers.

mrflex65
05-14-2012, 12:42 PM
Well, that really sucks!:no:Give ACME a try,i've ordered from them in the past and never had any issues with them.:yes:I don't know about the quality of there flybacks though....:dunno:

lnx64
05-14-2012, 12:43 PM
ACME told me the FCM-2015AL they have is a ASTI Magnetics.

On the research I did, it's not a good brand.

mrflex65
05-14-2012, 01:12 PM
I guess there isn't too many places to get them from anymore.I just looked up NTE and even they discontinued them!:no:It's not like the good ole days when you could order them direct from the mfg. or at least a reputable supplier...:tears:

lnx64
05-14-2012, 01:58 PM
Does anyone have a FCM-2015AL they can sell me?

I'm tired of this crap. Getting a transformer for this TV is starting to piss me off. I may just toss the set if I can't get a flyback for it.

mrflex65
05-14-2012, 02:13 PM
http://www.ciconelectronics.com/fc1.html:scratch2:

lnx64
05-14-2012, 02:36 PM
That company is a scam artist that isn't even in business.. Nah, not them. ;) Already have a report on them via my bank cause I had to fight them.

mrflex65
05-14-2012, 03:19 PM
Your always learning something new every day...:uzi:

radiotvnut
05-14-2012, 05:51 PM
Try Moyer's Electronics. They have a large stock of old parts and they may have what you need.

Don't give up. I've sat on TV's for years before I found a part to fix them. 15-20 years ago, I could walk in the local parts house and buy just about any TV part I needed. I rarely ordered anything. Then, it became the other way around. Besides caps, soldering supplies, and NTE semiconductors; I ended up haveing to order most of what I needed to fix a TV. A few years ago, I was talking to the owner of the parts store and he said that when he opened, radio and TV repairmen were his "bread and butter". He said that if he had to depend on TV/radio repair people today, he would be out of business.

Now, as you are finding out, it's getting harder to obtain these old TV parts from any source. Today, most people are not willing to pay to have a fairly new TV repaired, let alone a knob tuned 19" set from the early '80's. So, there's not enough demand to keep parts for these older sets available.

lnx64
05-14-2012, 09:54 PM
I just sent Moyer's an email. Hopefully they turn up good.

I just hope this Irish company screwing me over will refund me. I've already made 2 disputes with Paypal this month. At this rate they will think I'M the one screwing people over.

tvcollector
05-14-2012, 10:43 PM
Goodluck with paypal.. I had to remove my banking account from them.. Boy did it turn ugly, and the phone calls I made to them weren't pleasant.. I would be contacting your bank...

holmesuser01
05-15-2012, 09:03 AM
I saw complaints about Asti Magnetics. What kind of trouble?

I bought video heads from them for years, and only once had to contact them for a replacement... The box was damaged and the head was chipped.

Bought a few flybacks from them. Never had an issue with any of them Some that I replaced are still in use after 15 years.

To the OP: Why give up so fast? Hard-to-find parts have been around since the beginning of TV. We have less problems finding parts for old sets now than we did even 10 years ago.

20 years ago, I had a Mitsubishi 26" set that had a bad tuner. I looked for almost 3 years before I found a tuner for it. It's still running today.

Sit it aside and do something else for awhile.

lnx64
05-15-2012, 10:02 AM
So Asti Magnetics isn't a bad brand? When I see their picture of the FCM-2015AL they make, it looks so different than the original. Makes me worried it won't fit right.

lnx64
05-15-2012, 12:07 PM
I ordered the ASTI from ACME.

I just want a Flyback at this point.

lnx64
05-16-2012, 01:13 AM
ACME already shipped out the ASTI.

mrflex65
05-16-2012, 03:25 AM
You should have it within the next few days.....:yes:

lnx64
05-16-2012, 09:41 AM
says it's on the truck right now. :/

I guess I'm getting it TODAY! Too bad I start work in a couple hours and get off at midnight.

Could call in sick, but i don't want to risk my job.

lnx64
05-16-2012, 11:01 AM
Got it, installed it, it works!


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v395/Evilweredragon/IMG_0461.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v395/Evilweredragon/IMG_0462.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v395/Evilweredragon/IMG_0463.jpg

mrflex65
05-16-2012, 11:58 AM
Well, hopefully you won't have to worry about that dreaded tick anymore....:thmbsp::D

radiotvnut
05-16-2012, 01:25 PM
Glad you got it working! Hopefully, it will serve you well for many years.

holmesuser01
05-16-2012, 05:49 PM
Looking good. When I replace flybacks, I always check the focus just one more time before I button them up.

lnx64
05-16-2012, 11:21 PM
Looking good. When I replace flybacks, I always check the focus just one more time before I button them up.

Me too, that's what I did.. Wanted to make sure it's right..

I need to adjust the vertical position on this TV, it's off, but there's no POT inside for it, and tinkering with the vertical hold has no effect (as my hitachi can use the vhold as a sorta vpos too.)

radiotvnut
05-17-2012, 12:33 AM
You probably have some electrolytic capacitors going bad in the vertical circuit. Not uncommon for a set this age. In fact, I see it quite often on post-2000 BPC TV's.

lnx64
05-17-2012, 12:49 AM
Hmm, so on these old TV's there no easy way to just adjust the vertical position? It's moving "down".. That's why in the new pic with the new flyback, I can see the line 21 stuff, but the bottom is fine (if not way under there).

I might need to get a SAMS manual for this TV.

lnx64
05-17-2012, 02:46 AM
Here's a video. It's unlisted, but I'm sure because of copyrights it'll probably get pulled.

Anyways, here's the TV working in a video..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_UfkNbuiGqQ

lnx64
05-18-2012, 02:46 AM
Oh, btw, how can I get rid of this weird issue where the top and bottom of the picture seem to be slightly brighter than the center? I think it did this with the old flyback too.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v395/Evilweredragon/IMG_0472.jpg