Damen from Portland contacted me about an estate sale in Seattle and wanted to know if I would like to go. This was Tuesday night and the the sale was on Thursday. He sent me the link and what I saw was the best estate sale ever!! Roundies, Roundies, roundies!!! All kinds of equipment, CRT's, radios etc. I of course said OK. I left from Caldwell, I and made the 400 mile trip to Portland. We left Portland at 4:30 Am the next morning and drove 190 miles. We arrived about an hour after the sale started. We immediately went into the garage where the CRT's were located and purchased all 5 21" round CRT's for $20( all tested good except for 1 which will be looked at since the filaments wont light). After we were granted entrance into the house we headed toward the tV'S. They were scattered all over and stacked up. We bought all the roundie color sets except 1 RCA combo. We had no room for it and felt bad for leaving there. For $120, we got a 1956 or 1957 RCA color set with a good crt and CTC-5B chassis, 1 zenith color set with good crt, 1 maggie combo with a crt that went to air, 1 admiral 23" tabletop remote set with good crt and remote, 1 rca parts set with a good 23" CRT and chassis, 1 RCA swivel color tv with good crt, 1 21" colcor rca tabletop color tv and 1 RCA 21" color console with good crt. Some pictures will be posted but wont be able to post more until I get home tomorrow. Damen and I will keep you up to date on any progress we make with the sets. it was a long trip but well wotrh the effort.

pics

last pics

Wow congrats! Sounds like a fun trip and great score with fair prices. You really got to be willing to travel to get good stuff and this looks like the score of 2011.can't wait to see more shots

Ah HATE Yew !!-Yosemite Sam, Esq..(grin)....EXCELLENT Scores !

Nice score, it pays to be willing to drive. I dig the maggie, looks like it may have a tube stereo (no astrosonic badging).

Great haul! I'm next door to Seattle, but can't buy much these days (no room). There are a couple of pieces of test equipment I might have been interested in, though.

Phil Nelson

What chassis is in the Zenith? It looks like a '63. Great scores!!

Nominated for cateract of the century:

http://www.videokarma.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=170944&d=1309507768

lol

What chassis is in the Zenith? It looks like a '63. Great scores!!
It is a 29jc20 and the picture tube is a Zenith tube and checks a little over 80 on all three guns. Its a neat
set and Its a 62 from what I have read online I am hopeing it will be a good performer.

Nominated for cateract of the century:

http://www.videokarma.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=170944&d=1309507768

lol

A few hours baking face up in the hot sun with some wedges putting pressure should pop that right off safely.
It will improve the look of that set 500% when that is fixed.

Wow congrats! Sounds like a fun trip and great score with fair prices. You really got to be willing to travel to get good stuff and this looks like the score of 2011.can't wait to see more shots

Ok.I get the wiling to travel to get good stuff but how does one get to an estate sale in the middle of the week when there's this thing called a job and a boss? I can't even attend saturday estate sales,auctions,garage sales etc since I work 6 days a week to make a living.:scratch2:

I've even had to overpay for most of my record collection because of that fact. I had to pay the flea market dealers on sunday for the same records they were picking up at saturday sales for probably a fraction of what I was paying them. I hate to think of the good stuff I've missed while at work. I've been told I've missed a few. I personally knew a guy that picked up a Beatles Butcher cover lp at a yard sale for $10 in a box of records and sold it for $5,000 on ebay.Think of the roundies you could get for $5,000.

A past thread talked about a CTC-5 faceplate that had the word "color" etched in the glass. Is that true for this set?

I can clearly see 'COLOR' in the glass of this one.

It is a 29jc20 and the picture tube is a Zenith tube and checks a little over 80 on all three guns. Its a neat
set and Its a 62 from what I have read online I am hopeing it will be a good performer.

WOW! That was my first thought and then I was like, nah, those NEVER show up. Those are great sets but I hear that they are a bit hard on the flyback, watch your cathode current and you should be fine, assuming ths fly's good.
Awesome 5 score too! I'm happy for you!:banana:

Yes the word "COLOR" is on the glass. It's silk screened on the inside. The model number for this set is 21-CT-7835. This is the info I found:

The Stanwyck


21-CT-7835


Mahogany Grain


CTC5B, 5C(U)


1956 T5 Super

Great catch! Think, all of these could have easily ended up being landfill this week.

Hope the 21AXP22 in that CTC-5 is good, the one in my CTC-4 was gassy and had a purple neck with HV applied.

We did test it and it was good. Wont know for sure until it's powered up

It would be a real shame if that ctc-5b was sent to the dump. Luckily i snagged it for $35. :)

AAWWWEEEEESSOOMMMEEE!!!

You lucky dawg, you hit the mother load!

Good luck getting them working.

PS: miniman, cateract of the year is more likely. There are about 89 yearss left in this century, and given how bad 1960's sets are now, I'll make the prediction that by the end of this century that any CRTs with their original cateracts will have completely lost the CRT to safety glass bond, and likely have the PVA turn to dust ,fall off on it's own, or be in a state where it can be removed by hand(or finger nails). That is my take.

Tom C.

I wont need to remove the cataract since the crt went to air. I'll replace it with another one.

I wont need to remove the cataract since the crt went to air

Would'nt hurt to use it for practice / experience! I would keep the safety glass in case you break one on a good crt.

yep, keep it, esp if the lens is not scratched, then remove and save as often they are scratched.

WOW! What a great score of goodies! :yes: All this will keep you out of trouble for a while...;)
I hope to see a colour roundie in the flesh one day, highly doubt I'll ever see one here in NZ though...:(

If you are ever in the US, I'm sure anyone here would be happy to show you one. Working condition no doubt.

If you can cover shipping, I have a cheap Philco roundie with a good tube looking for a home...

Got to work on the Zenith today checked all the tubes most look to be original the horizontal output tube was missing and one of the 3DG4 tubes is cracked I pulled the CRT I thought it was going to be the non bonded glass front that needed to be cleaned between it but it was a cataract all the way threw the lens fell off when I removed the tape so I cleaned it up and reinstalled the lens with black foam weather striping and tape and the set looks much nicer. The code date on that tube is 61-45. This set has several black beauty caps in it so I am thinking I will recap this set before I turn it on.

I'll make the prediction that by the end of this century that any CRTs with their original cateracts will have completely lost the CRT to safety glass bond, and likely have the PVA turn to dust ,fall off on it's own, or be in a state where it can be removed by hand(or finger nails). That is my take.

damen
I pulled the CRT I thought it was going to be the non bonded glass front that needed to be cleaned between it but it was a cataract all the way threw the lens fell off when I removed the tape so I cleaned it up and reinstalled the lens with black foam weather striping and tape and the set looks much nicer
Shoot! My prediction came true faster than I thought possible.:eek::nerd::king:
Hmmm, now what other nice nice things can I predict..... :scratch2: mmmbuhahaha :naughty:



Nick, if he passes on that Philco, and the price is right I could probably give it a home.

Glenz, here is a couple photos of my roundy running.
http://i1095.photobucket.com/albums/i469/ElectronicMemory/DSCN0430.jpg
http://i1095.photobucket.com/albums/i469/ElectronicMemory/DSCN0432.jpg
http://i1095.photobucket.com/albums/i469/ElectronicMemory/DSCN0456.jpg

We now return you to your regularly scheduled programing....

Tom C.

I'd hate to think what it would cost to ship a set to New Zealand....Hmm tempting though... :)


If you can cover shipping, I have a cheap Philco roundie with a good tube looking for a home...

If I ever plan to travel to the US some day you guys will be the first to know.... I expect a 'full demonstration' of a colour roundie, a Zenith porthole and one of those cool RCA Projection Sets and more plus a road trip to an old TV shop thats been locked up for 30 years...Am I asking too much??....:D:D:thmbsp:

If you are ever in the US, I'm sure anyone here would be happy to show you one. Working condition no doubt.

Thanks for those photos EM :) From what I've seen of your early sets the picture quality looks really good and such natural colour, those colour bars pretty much say it.


Shoot! My prediction came true faster than I thought possible.:eek::nerd::king:
Hmmm, now what other nice nice things can I predict..... :scratch2: mmmbuhahaha :naughty:



Nick, if he passes on that Philco, and the price is right I could probably give it a home.

Glenz, here is a couple photos of my roundy running.
http://i1095.photobucket.com/albums/i469/ElectronicMemory/DSCN0430.jpg
http://i1095.photobucket.com/albums/i469/ElectronicMemory/DSCN0432.jpg
http://i1095.photobucket.com/albums/i469/ElectronicMemory/DSCN0456.jpg

We now return you to your regularly scheduled programing....

Tom C.

love the pics!that roundy looks as good as it did when new.

Those pics are before I had and fixed a vertical failure. The gray scale is slightly off now but still good. I also have always had what I think are drive bars that I have to get around to trying to fix. The focus tends to vary with scene content (which also reaks havok with convergence). Most of these problems don't show in photos, but are just bad enough to bug me in person so I still have work left on this set.

Glad you liked the pictures.

Tom C.

WOW! That was my first thought and then I was like, nah, those NEVER show up. Those are great sets but I hear that they are a bit hard on the flyback, watch your cathode current and you should be fine, assuming ths fly's good.
Awesome 5 score too! I'm happy for you!:banana:

You were right about the flyback it's bad:tears: not much hope for this set I guess now I see why the set had so little use and from what I read in other trends it is almost impossible to find a fly for one of these I also read only Zenith made the flys for these. I have to wonder if there was none available back in the day and maybe that's why it was taken out of service with such low hours. The fly in it looks barely used except for some wax on the bottom of the cage and the tubes in the cage are original and still look new not darkend and dusty like you see on other old sets. I seen that someone had checked with Moyers and they had none to.

Do some research, you will find a flyback you can sub in there if you are willing to spend the time. It will most likely require changing the bracket and maybe changing some of the wiring around but it can be done. Zenith is one of the tougher ones to sub so look at other Zenith sets for something similar.

It is a 29jc20

:D Congratulations, and I am envious! Been looking for one of those for a LONG time.... That's the early one with the two 3DG4 B+ rectifiers. If it ever comes up for sale, please keep me in mind...

Charles

You were right about the flyback it's bad:tears: not much hope for this set I guess now I see why the set had so little use and from what I read in other trends it is almost impossible to find a fly for one of these I also read only Zenith made the flys for these. I have to wonder if there was none available back in the day and maybe that's why it was taken out of service with such low hours. The fly in it looks barely used except for some wax on the bottom of the cage and the tubes in the cage are original and still look new not darkend and dusty like you see on other old sets. I seen that someone had checked with Moyers and they had none to.

Perhaps SOMEONE, somewhere, DOES have a "spare" 29JC20 flyback, .. that worked the last time it was fired (in 1989), maybe even in a nearly complete chassis.... hanging around unused.....

Perhaps SOMEONE, somewhere, DOES have a "spare" 29JC20 flyback, .. that worked the last time it was fired (in 1989), maybe even in a nearly complete chassis.... hanging around unused.....

....perhaps someone does. What is the Zenith part number? That'll speed things up, as a lot of us have parts, but to what chassis they go to, I dunno. With no Sams for your set, and no part number, I am unable to help, and my parts stash is quite large. Have you run the part number against Thordarson and Triad (http://www.triadtransformers.com/tv81.html) cross references?

I'd love to help, but something to go on would be nice...

Cheers,

....perhaps someone does. What is the Zenith part number? That'll speed things up, as a lot of us have parts, but to what chassis they go to, I dunno. With no Sams for your set, and no part number, I am unable to help, and my parts stash is quite large. Have you run the part number against Thordarson and Triad (http://www.triadtransformers.com/tv81.html) cross references?

I'd love to help, but something to go on would be nice...

Cheers,

Thanks..That would be cool if someone did have one the part number is S-53620 I am checking a couple of places to.

I checked, and don't have either the 95S-53620, or the 895-00737 replacement specified by Zenith in their 1983 parts catalog listing.

Cheers,

More digging reveals the S-56538 is the listed (in 12/1969) Zenith replacement for your S-53620. Triad D-327 replaces the S-56538. My Thordarson guide lists the Fly 274 as a replacement for the S-56538 as well....

Cheers,

This is the first set out of the ones we picked up in Seattle. It is a CTC-16XL from 1966. I removed the cataracts and reinstalled the CRT and cleaned out the cabinet. Not too dirty. The chassis was very clean. It needed several tubes. All the caps check good. There was some bad solder so I went over all the boards carefully and re-soldered anything that looked flaky plus all the grounds. I cleaned all the controls and tuner. I was rewarded with a raster and a very decent picture. It will need a convergence touch up. I checked the cathode current and its about 208ma, I made a permanent jumper for convenience on a small terminal strip. I made some minor adjustments to the vertical height, horizontal centering and grayscale. I set the HV to 24KV as per Sams. The electrolytics stay cool even after several hours of running. This is a very easy chassis to work on. Much easier than the CTC-9. here are some pics

I like the CTC-16, very easy to work on. I routinely replace the HOT coupling caps (think there are two a .01 and a .0068 IIRC), the 1kv caps on vert and audio out transformers (white ceramic tube caps). The .0082 1kv vert out plate cap. I do the 1kv just cause I cant really test them with my cap tester.

Then there are the 3 .01 coupling caps in the 6GU7 grids on the chroma board. the one that is right next to the tube and a power resistor ALWAYS test weak, the other two generally test ok, but I replace them anyway.

I also like to replace the .1 video coupliing cap to the 12xxx video out tube, and the .1 in the AGC (just because AGC is a pain if its not right). All the hi value lower volt brown drops are suspect, but if they sit right next to a heat source I like to check them.

I will order all new caps sometime in the future. right now it works very well.

Yea no hurry, I have replaced those and had no visable change. the only one that I really matters is that HOT coupling cap, if its leaky at all it will cause the HOT current to be high. I like to use a VTVM to check the neg voltage at the grid, and a scope to check the PP.

Just checked the cathode current on my 16xl today. 180ma, lower your line voltage a little. I wish there was an easy way to run these with the fly cage open because the thing just cooks in there. Im tempted to bend the lid 180 so its pointing up when closed. Some people cut holes and put fans. I dont like the idea of fans because thats forced dust injection, I do however try and run all my sets with the can open. Lowers the flyback temperature by about 80 degrees

I have no easy way to lower line voltage. Line voltage is 120V. I suppose you can add a filter to the fan to keep dust down. It's almost hard to believe how good of a picture these can produce when working correctly. I'll check the current again tomorrow and readjust if necessary.

If you cant get a center tapped filament transformer you can easily wire it to lower the voltage by 12 or 6 volts.
Yes they do produce an awesome picture but that fly is vary fragile. You want to do whatever you cant to keep it cool.
Its not the end of the world if it fails, you can sub just about any non Zenith round tube fly in there but its a major PITA. The last NOS fly for that chassis went for like $125.

Yeah i saw your you-tube video on the fly replacement.
I have an extra 16XL with a good fly. The line cap blew up and it's a mess underneath, so parts it is. I already used the Hor. center pot on this one. I have another 16XL in the garage that may be fixable but I have not looked at it closely.

I bought an RCA TV Isotap for real cheap on Ebay not long ago, you should be able to do the same I'd think. Makes a huge difference to HOT current, everything runs so much cooler and IQ doesn't suffer at all.

...

Good point, my 16 has the tap but like miniman I have an isotap.

I've got an RCA schematic as well as the Sams for my 16E. Naturally, if your line voltage "was" actually low then the original soldered connection was rated for 110-120Vac. RCA specs the high line tap at 128Vac so with todays line voltages being what they are that may be the better tap.

Would I be correct in saying that we should be concerned with the peak to peak value as opposed to RMS?

I have no easy way to lower line voltage. Line voltage is 120V.
Look up "line buck" and autotransformers. You can rig something like a 6-volt, 4-amp power transformer to cut the line voltage down by 6 volts for up to a 480-watt TV. Essentially, you connect the transformer's primary and secondary to cancel itself out and put the TV in series with the result. There was a discussion of this either here on VK or on the antique radio forum recently.

When I repaired my 1967 CTC-28 I hooked up the power line to the high line voltage tap. I think a few years later they began to use the normal/high switch.

On a 1968 Sylvania D12 set, it actually has a normal/low switch to boost the power transformer voltage in low line voltage areas.

I used a 1970's RCA XL-100 power transformer to buck the line voltage going to a Harman-Kardon A300 amp. The amp was causing 6V6 tubes to short out due to high B+ voltage caused by high line voltage. Some of the old equipment was rated with a 115 or 117 volt AC supply and todays higher line voltages can cause excessive power supply voltages.
I used one of the secondary windings (I think CRT filament) as the "buck" winding in series with the primary winding. You just have to make sure the phase is correct and measure the output voltage before connecting..one way of connecting the leads will add to the primary voltage and the other will subtract.

Here it is all recapped and working. I was very lucky A friend in Georgia sent me a good used flyback and all systems are go :banana::banana: 213 is as low as I can get the cathode current Sams shows 190 I will use a fan on the fly to keep it cool and hope this one will last.

Wow! Great job! That picture is very sharp and the color looks awesome! I like that cabinet style too! :drool:

check your line voltage, if you have a variac see how low it can go before the width is a problem, check the cathode curret at 117vac

is this a real zenith crt?that looks as good as it did when brand new!beautiful picture that puts modern sets to shame

check your line voltage, if you have a variac see how low it can go before the width is a problem, check the cathode current at 117vac
I had it at about 117v when I did that test and I did go down lower and the cathode current went down I will have to play with it and see how low I can go with the line current with out problems.

is this a real zenith crt?that looks as good as it did when brand new!beautiful picture that puts modern sets to shame
Yes it is a Zenith tube with code date of 1961 and still checks like new I believe it is the original.

just a couple other things, did you check the cathode current with the beam current near zero (if the sams says that way), did you replace the HOT grid coupling cap as part of the total recap? do you have some other HOT's you can try (in case the one you have is a bit gassy) how does the the shunt tube current look (I think that one still used the shunt vs the pulse type). Do you have a scope, if so you can check the PP horz drive or use a VTVM and confirm the neg voltage.

I was doing some reading about other drains on the fly that can account for higher than normal currents. thats such a nice looking picture it seems like all the other stuff is working correctly (it mentioned the convergence board as one thing to check).

just a couple other things, did you check the cathode current with the beam current near zero (if the sams says that way), did you replace the HOT grid coupling cap as part of the total recap? do you have some other HOT's you can try (in case the one you have is a bit gassy) how does the the shunt tube current look (I think that one still used the shunt vs the pulse type). Do you have a scope, if so you can check the PP horz drive or use a VTVM and confirm the neg voltage.
Thanks Dave for the info I will try a different HOT and not sure which one is the coupling cap I have not checked the current on the shunt and I do not know how to use a scope but the negative voltage on the HOT was very close but it does show the plus voltage on the HOT is 135V on the sams and I get 145v there is a .15 Cap to ground I replaced there but the B+ on the other side of the 7w resistor to that pin is very close . The caps on the convergence have been replaced but I will do some more checking on that board to.

it all sounds like its real close, prob just down to tubes. If the VTVM voltage on the grid of the how is close then you are prob ok. The voltages on the sams dont always match the voltages on the service manuals, besides I think they generally say +-20%. Who knows could be difference in the kind of meters being used.

The pic is great so I would not mess with it too much other than seeing if you can lower the input AC. That is def a great set.

I generally run my sets at 105-115 if they are going to be on for any length of time. I just set them up at 115 and adj after warm up to the lowest voltage that still fills out the screen. the FLYs seem to run cooler this way, but I must add I have never sat down and tried to document how much cooler.

is this a real zenith crt?that looks as good as it did when brand new!beautiful picture that puts modern sets to shame

I'd be curious what the EIA code is too.
That is a wonderful looking set and how fortunate of you to score a flyback!

there is something about a zenith crt.i can remember going to the box stores back in the early to mid 60s and watching the sets.the rcas looked good,admirals were pretty nice but the zenith roundies were superior.the ctc15 imho was the best roundie rca made but those zeniths!very close and depending on the look you prefer.i always thought the zenith sets had a more lifelike fleshtone.that set is a beauty and i am happy for your good fortune.just wish it were me!