Well,

I'm the first to have the first DTV converter box failure, or atleast the first to report a failure on AK. I have the zenith converter box which is sold at circuit city, which is the same as the insignia box sold at best buy. While watching TV this evening with the box, the screen all of a sudden went into intermittent blue horizontal bars and then the unit shut off. I attempted to turn it back on and nothing. The red LED which is on when the unit is switched off even went out so its dead as a door nail now. No reset button on the unit. Wont respond to anything, remote or at the unit. Perhaps something in the power supply failed. Ive yet to investigate. Too late to get into that now. All I can say is that this is pretty poor. Ive only had the box about 1.5 months and it broke already. Im curious if more will fail as time passes in the near future.
This digital transition is a joke. More BS to deal with. Cheap crap converter box is an insult to the Zenith name. I think the quality fell out before the name went on with this thing. Whats next.

And I'll bet the warranty was only 30 days? About the only thing I'd know to do would be to check the caps in the power supply. I've fixed a few modern "throw away" TV's, DVD player's, etc. that had bad caps in the power supply. These caps that I'm finding to be bad are usually the cheapest "off the wall" thing they can find to cram in there. I don't know how the P/S circuit is in your unit; but, many of the switching power supplies in modern cheap junk don't have any sort of over-voltage protection. It's not uncommon for the B+ to run 10 times higher than normal and fry the rest of the unit.

From what I've seen of the inside of those DTV boxes, the power supply appears to be the only area that could be serviced easily. The rest of it looks to be all surface mounted parts that I would not attempt to unsolder!

I've got two Digitalstream boxes from ratshack but they are for future use since I have cable. I do intend to buy more boxes later. After reading this, I'd probably do just as well to buy the Funai made Maggotboxes from Wal Mart.

Could it be your box was meant for sale at Walmart?

And thus, like its 90's TV's, Zenith DTV boxes also don't last very long...

Seriously though, 1.5 months is not very long. There should be some kind of warrenty, and if there's not, the box is shit and another brand would be a better buy.

I just had another thought. The Maggotboxes have a master power switch on the side of the unit. Leaving the master power switch off on those boxes, when not in use, may lenghten it's life.

My cousin has had his Maggotbox Wal-Mart special DTV box for a little over a month and it's not given him any problems.

I actually have kind of a failure to report as well.

I bought my WinTV HVR 1600 TV card mainly to check out all these DTV channels and see what DTV was like. DTV is okay, but the HVR 1600 is turning out to be a piece of shit. It works fine in analog... all well and good, but I didn't buy it for analog. I have several analog TV's so I'm covered as far as analog goes.

Depending on what drivers I use, DTV channels either stutter, or I can't record DTV video. The card is a finicky bastard when scanning for DTV channels... to the point where I have to manually input them. After a LONG talk with hauppauge's tech support, they finally said my card is most likely defective and that I should return it. I'll exchange it for a new one tomorrow, or I'll damn well try to.

I have yet to see any of either the RCA or Magnavox converter boxes returned at my Wal-Mart.

Bill R

Perhaps it would be an idea to replace the caps with something decent as a preemptive measure before they fail if you intend to keep these boxes long term.

Power supply faults in set top boxes are common. I've fixed 20+ of them and scrapped countless more (dead set top boxes are the cheapest source of certain power supply ICs).

If you really wanna keep them running, make an outboard regulated power supply instead of the cheap switching power supplies. 8 out of ten times the PS is what makes the machine crap in this case.

Jordan, very true those supplies are crappy and noisy too.

I haven't had the zeniths break down yet, but I haven't used em much either. One is still in its original box.

I hope they don't all die a premature death...thats a hell of a lot of trash. Not to mention all of the analog sets that'll be tossed after the conversion.

I just bought an Insignia, haven't even opened it yet but this isn't encouraging...:no:

:sigh:I have 2 Insignias, I hope they don't crap out too!

i got two zeniths, one still in box. i haven't had a chance to use either as i don't yet get any channels in my corner of the world... but now i gotta worry about this?! S%$T!!!!:mad:

3 Insignias here, and they all seem to be working fine. Lots of use too.

We will see how long they last.
-
Matt Davala

If you have cable, of course, you don't need the over-air STB (set top box) at all. I'd suggest that those of you who are having trouble with your converters forget about them and get basic cable, which of course will be required to carry local channels as DTV after February 19 next year. Basic cable service in most areas shouldn't cost you an arm and a leg; in fact, Time Warner's basic package (digital basic tier) is $5 a month, excluding the one-time installation charge and $3.79 monthly for the digital basic converter, plus 0.20 for the digital remote. In total your monthly charge will be $8.99. If you have a TV with an ATSC or QAM tuner, all you need is the cable service, which will save you $3.99.

Lady Ayeka: I don't know where in Oregon you are located or what types of reception challenges your area presents, but you should be able to get cable or satellite service even if you have poor or no over-air reception. The problem with satellite, however, is that, while all satellite providers provide digital channels, many do not offer HD television as part of their basic service packages; that is, HD service is available through most if not all satellite providers, but the service is optional and will show as an additional charge on your bill. I don't know what cable providers (if any) are in your area, but if one of them is Time Warner you are in luck as they provide free HD service.

2 Zeniths here and they are used everyday, sometimes a lot. The "TV" in my bedroom is a Commodore 1702 monitor so the Zenith DTV box is the only tuner so I only get ATSC there. (Crossing fingers) So far, so good. I guess like anything else, there are a few lemons out there. I'd take it back and exchange it.

I will be picking up 4 convertor boxes, probably Insignia's since BB is closest, in the next couple of days for myself and for my 95 year-old grandmother's house. We both have satellite (Direct TV), but it cuts out during heavy rains. I can always tell when it's getting ready to rain hard, because the signal cuts out about 1-2 minutes beforehand.

On a sidenote, I am still unable to find a battery powered TV set that can pickup over the air digital broadcasts for use during hurricanes and other bad weather when the power goes out for long periods of time. Best buy no longer carries the Insignia model they had last year. I just hope this need is met in time for next year's "Hunker down, we're all gonna die!. There's a storm off the coast of Africa!" :rolleyes:storm season.

I've been using a Magnavox for almost 3 months. I leave it on almost 24/7 because I videotape TV shows for other family members. The only issue seems to be less-than-stellar performance with weak signals. The top of the case also gets mighty hot. Other than that, it's been rock-solid. :dunno:
Tom

Is it the power supply that gets mighty hot? Or the tuner/RF modulator?

If the PS, then there's several reasons now to use an outboard power supply.

1) it runs cooler.
2) it runs less noisy (RF interference on Ch3 on older sets)
3) it runs less noisy (spikes hard on internal components)
4) it could run on battery!
5) it's a reason to get out the soldering gun and play.

Especially bullet 4, I'd like to modify one to run on NiCad pack or car battery for use with a battery-powered TV during outages.

Except of course if the outage is caused by a storm, in which case the digital signal will probably block and drop anyway, so it would be moot.

I am still unable to find a battery powered TV set that can pickup over the air digital broadcasts for use during hurricanes and other bad weather when the power goes out for long periods of time.
How about a battery powered radio that receives weather channels? My car radio picks up weather channels.

TV coverage of bad weather verges on the ridiculous, anyway. "Hi, this is Brandi Boogaloo standing outside the Boogie-Woogie Arms Motel in Tampa Bay. Look -- it's really really windy and some trees are bending over! Back to you at Hurricane Central, Chaz!!"

Phil Nelson

P.S. No problems using a Zenith box here.

Having TV coverage, espcially the radar images. is almost a necessity here in the central US with the tornados, severe thunderstorms, etc. This is much better than the radio can do.

This is the main reason that I think getting rid of analog NTSC is completly stupid. Analog NTSC will provide usuable (not perfect by any means) information in bad weather for a long while after digital has completly crapped out.

As a case in point, my digital reception was glitching yesterday and the only issue was that it was a little windy. As I am only 30 miles or so from the transmitters, I do not think power is the issue(I believe the issue is the transmitting antenna moving in the wind).

My Zenith DTT900 has a 90 day warranty from the "Date of Purchase". The parts warranty period is one year.

We'll see how this all turns out.

They'll probably boost power a good amount if people aren't getting usable signal.

Is it the power supply that gets mighty hot? Or the tuner/RF modulator?

If the PS, then there's several reasons now to use an outboard power supply.

1) it runs cooler.
2) it runs less noisy (RF interference on Ch3 on older sets)
3) it runs less noisy (spikes hard on internal components)
4) it could run on battery!
5) it's a reason to get out the soldering gun and play.

Especially bullet 4, I'd like to modify one to run on NiCad pack or car battery for use with a battery-powered TV during outages.

Except of course if the outage is caused by a storm, in which case the digital signal will probably block and drop anyway, so it would be moot.

#4 is a very good idea! I will have to open up one of mine when I get it to see how easy (or hard) it would be to add a DC jack and a switch to choose between internal and external p/s's.

Well,

I'm the first to have the first DTV converter box failure, or atleast the first to report a failure on AK. I have the zenith converter box which is sold at circuit city, which is the same as the insignia box sold at best buy. While watching TV this evening with the box, the screen all of a sudden went into intermittent blue horizontal bars and then the unit shut off. I attempted to turn it back on and nothing. The red LED which is on when the unit is switched off even went out so its dead as a door nail now. No reset button on the unit. Wont respond to anything, remote or at the unit. Perhaps something in the power supply failed. Ive yet to investigate. Too late to get into that now. All I can say is that this is pretty poor. Ive only had the box about 1.5 months and it broke already. Im curious if more will fail as time passes in the near future.
This digital transition is a joke. More BS to deal with. Cheap crap converter box is an insult to the Zenith name. I think the quality fell out before the name went on with this thing. Whats next.
Did the box get hot when it was still working? The poorly ventilated enclosures so common on modern electronics often cause SMD components to unsolder themselves from the boards. I've had similar problems with multiple wireless routers in the past few years.

Is it the power supply that gets mighty hot? Or the tuner/RF modulator?

If the PS, then there's several reasons now to use an outboard power supply.

1) it runs cooler.
2) it runs less noisy (RF interference on Ch3 on older sets)
3) it runs less noisy (spikes hard on internal components)
4) it could run on battery!
5) it's a reason to get out the soldering gun and play.

Especially bullet 4, I'd like to modify one to run on NiCad pack or car battery for use with a battery-powered TV during outages.

Except of course if the outage is caused by a storm, in which case the digital signal will probably block and drop anyway, so it would be moot.

From what little I've been able to see, it's possibly some of the digital circuitry that causes the heat! One time I'd left the converter on a blank subchannel overnight, and when I went to pick up the remote in the morning (I park the remote on top of the box) the box was barely more than room temperature.
Tom

Doug, can you see what the failure mode was and if an external supply can be rigged up for them. I really depend on the converter boxes to get a good quality TV signal and would like to keep them going...hopefully its not a case like on some DVD players I've heard of where there is no overvoltage protection and a power supply failure burns out chips on the board.

You could cut a hole in the top of the case and install a small computer fan to help with cooling.

I got some DTV coupons I haven't used yet so I think I'll get a second insignia and measure the voltages from the power supply in a normal condition...that way I may be able to hook up an external supply and know what voltages I'll need.

On a sidenote, I am still unable to find a battery powered TV set that can pickup over the air digital broadcasts for use during hurricanes and other bad weather when the power goes out for long periods of time. Best buy no longer carries the Insignia model they had last year.

This Radio Shack model, although currently sold out on the web, is still available in the stores.

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2855063

http://rsk.imageg.net/graphics/product_images/pRS1C-4042656_rshalt1_dt.jpg

OK,

I went ahead and powered up the box last night to see what was going on. Now it works. What I am going to do is keep it on for the maximum allowable time of 4 hours and see if it shuts down. I opened it up anyway to see what it is all about. I am quite surprized how many radial electrolytics are in these things. There are just a few SMD caps. There are well over 20 radials, even on the RF board. The power supply is a separate panel with a SIP connector to the RF board. Acutally, easily repairable from a mechanical point of view. I am going to wait for it to fail and then immediately check the caps in the PS for leakage.

Git-er-done!

000

Its got a selectable shut off mode, either 1, 2, 3, or 4 hours. Im pretty sure you cannot leave in on indefinitly which is kind of strange. The unit was on for about 2 hours or so and then it just went into this intermittent blue horizontal bar display for a few seconds and simply shut off. There is a LED that glows blue when the unit is on, and red when off (standby). The led went completely out and the unit would not power up in any attempt. I did try powering it up about 30 minutes after it failed and it turned on and then shut off about 5 seconds later and again, no responce when attempted again. Im going to assume there is a marginal leaky cap somewhere in this unit. Im going to pin it down though, assuming it fails. Who knows, perhaps I have a poor solder joint and its affected by expansion of the pc board. These units do get quite warm.

Its got a selectable shut off mode, either 1, 2, 3, or 4 hours. Im pretty sure you cannot leave in on indefinitly which is kind of strange. The unit was on for about 2 hours or so and then it just went into this intermittent blue horizontal bar display for a few seconds and simply shut off. There is a LED that glows blue when the unit is on, and red when off (standby). The led went completely out and the unit would not power up in any attempt. I did try powering it up about 30 minutes after it failed and it turned on and then shut off about 5 seconds later and again, no responce when attempted again. Im going to assume there is a marginal leaky cap somewhere in this unit. Im going to pin it down though, assuming it fails. Who knows, perhaps I have a poor solder joint and its affected by expansion of the pc board. These units do get quite warm.

You could try picking up and dropping the unit a short distance, say six inches, to temporarily reseat any loose chips. Back in high school, that was the cure for any apple III that happened to be malfunctioning.

Its got a selectable shut off mode, either 1, 2, 3, or 4 hours. Im pretty sure you cannot leave in on indefinitely which is kind of strange. The Zenith DTT900 can be set so that the “Auto Off” feature is disabled in the Setup menu. See page 9 of the manual.

You could also try some freeze spray to locate thermal defects.

Well,

I'm the first to have the first DTV converter box failure, or atleast the first to report a failure on AK. I have the zenith converter box which is sold at circuit city, which is the same as the insignia box sold at best buy. While watching TV this evening with the box, the screen all of a sudden went into intermittent blue horizontal bars and then the unit shut off. I attempted to turn it back on and nothing. The red LED which is on when the unit is switched off even went out so its dead as a door nail now. No reset button on the unit. Wont respond to anything, remote or at the unit. Perhaps something in the power supply failed. Ive yet to investigate. Too late to get into that now. All I can say is that this is pretty poor. Ive only had the box about 1.5 months and it broke already. Im curious if more will fail as time passes in the near future.
This digital transition is a joke. More BS to deal with. Cheap crap converter box is an insult to the Zenith name. I think the quality fell out before the name went on with this thing. Whats next.

I have the insignia ns-dxa1 box and so far so good. Took a look in the manual and it has a 90 day warranty so you may want to check that out.
Fun wow, Now we are going to have to fix the new junk to keep our old junk running.:scratch2:
Ed

I bought four of the Insignia'a yesterday, 2 for me, and two to setup for my grandmother. I haven't messed with them yet, though I did take one out to look at it. It only requires 7 watts, so it could be run off of an inverter and jumper pack along with my battery TV that has composite inputs. Should be good for a couple of hours at least since I have a rather large jumper pack.

Still, that's quite a mess of wires and setup time just to watch the weather during a bad storm. I do have a 20kw genny, so it would only be needed if it failed or ran out of diesel.

I received my Winegard RC-DT09 from SolidSignal (a month late, but finally). I have to say I like it maybe best of all. And also, the power supply is outboard already! Just a small 9VDC wall transformer with a typical power-supply jack on the back of the converter box. Real easy to make a 9V NiMH cell pack or maybe just stack a few 9V duracells in parallel for that emergency tornado-warning use. No mods to the box or P/S whatsoever, just buy a new jack from Rat Shack and go.

User menus are comparable to the Insignias or Magnavoxes, reception sensitivity looks the same too. Plastic case is a little cheap, but like a lot of the others in that respect. Physically smallest in size (width anyway). Tiny remote, but gets the job done.

I like it.

I received my Winegard RC-DT09 from SolidSignal (a month late, but finally). I have to say I like it maybe best of all. And also, the power supply is outboard already! Just a small 9VDC wall transformer with a typical power-supply jack on the back of the converter box. Real easy to make a 9V NiMH cell pack or maybe just stack a few 9V duracells in parallel for that emergency tornado-warning use. No mods to the box or P/S whatsoever, just buy a new jack from Rat Shack and go.

User menus are comparable to the Insignias or Magnavoxes, reception sensitivity looks the same too. Plastic case is a little cheap, but like a lot of the others in that respect. Physically smallest in size (width anyway). Tiny remote, but gets the job done.

I like it.

That's very good to know. Here in East Central MS, hurricanes Ivan and Katrina taught us to be prepared for any emergency! We were without power for 12 days following Katrina and we had a 13" color TV plugged into an inverter connected to the cigarette lighter in the car. This Winegard converter should make it easier to use my Panasonic B&W portable.

Haha, that pic looks like my room., speaker cones and heatsinks all around...

Cool Sony monitors.

Radiotvnut, that's rough.... Reasons like this are why analog tv should be kept around in some form in an emergency.

I wondered if anyone would catch the heat sink. It's a FK660 from here: http://www.futurekit.com/products.php?pageid=3&category=FK6

Sad to say the local distributor for them in Fort Wayne went out of business :tears: some time ago (nobody builds stuff anymore). Driving a 15-inch woofer it'll rattle the walls, and I think it was maybe 15 bucks at the time. The Sony monitors are part of a shop project still in the works. They're video only, so I had to patch the DTV-box's audio into a pair of FK660s and some speakers. Just rough-hacked on the floor for testing, a cabinet is planned (woodshop project too) sometime, when time permits.

Quite interesting reading here from an outsider's perspective. Here in Aus we've had digital terrestrial broadcasting since Jan 01. In the early days we went through much the same crap with set top boxes too, all of them suffered various incompatibilities and often would lock up requiring a hard reset. Quality tended to be very poor, with many boxes being complete dogs. The technology is pretty stable now, however the current boxes are built extremely cheap. My Teac box has died after only a few years (although my very early Teac box still works fine). It's disappointing but they're well below $50 now.

Anyway digital broadcasting is really a very good thing. Many people who only had a poor analogue reception here get good digital reception off their same antenna. So instead of snowy ghoasting junk there's perfect picture. Widescreen too. We also get HD broadcast over terrestrial digital.

000

Andy, thats true... Picture it: People will obtain the coupons and use the boxes for their old analog sets, then when those sets die, they'll probably pony up the cash for a new set and either give away or throw away the converter.

The converter boxes were originally designed to last no more than 2 years as recommended by the US government, and they assume all analog sets should go out by now, including your 70s Zenith Chromocolors.

For those who are interested, the link below is to an article in the Austin Chronicle about the digital TV switch. Andy can get a hard copy if he wants(it is in this weeks paper).

http://www.austinchronicle.com/gyrobase/Issue/story?oid=oid%3A634964

Austin Chronicle about the digital TV switch.
http://www.austinchronicle.com/gyrobase/Issue/story?oid=oid%3A634964

In parts of New York City, people have been putting up pirate FM stations for years. As fast as the FCC nails them, others pop up like weeds. I can imagine pirate analog TV stations appearing in low income parts of major cities once licensed over-the-air analog TV shuts down. The audience being all the local low income owners of analog TV sets that can't get anything else. Probably on channels 3 or 4. All a pirate would need is an amplifier that can boost a VCR modulator's output level to something like 100W, and an antenna. Probably cheap and nasty enough to spew harmonic trash in the areonautical or fire or police band around 130MHz (channel 3 and 4 being around 65MHz). Other than that, everything else for a pirate TV station is readily avaliable (camcorder camera (or security camera), microphones, VCRs, DVD players, and maybe a computer that can source NTSC output when playing youtube or MPEG files. As for the business model, pirate FM stations have commercials for ethnic food resturants and such "Carribean style goat's head soup is today's special at Uncle Joe's, at Ave J and 45th"....

Should be some fun DXing coming up... :D

In parts of New York City, people have been putting up pirate FM stations for years. As fast as the FCC nails them, others pop up like weeds. I can imagine pirate analog TV stations appearing in low income parts of major cities once licensed over-the-air analog TV shuts down. The audience being all the local low income owners of analog TV sets that can't get anything else. Probably on channels 3 or 4. All a pirate would need is an amplifier that can boost a VCR modulator's output level to something like 100W, and an antenna. Probably cheap and nasty enough to spew harmonic trash in the areonautical band around 130MHz (channel 3 and 4 being around 65MHz). Other than that, everything else for a pirate TV station is readily avaliable (camcorder camera (or security camera), microphones, VCRs, DVD players, and maybe a computer that can source NTSC output when playing youtube or MPEG files. As for the business model, pirate FM stations have commercials for ethnic food resturants and such "Carribean style goat's head soup is today's special at Uncle Joe's, at Ave J and 45th"....

Should be some fun DXing coming up... :D

That's what I'm thinking too, also, I live near Canada, and a couple LPTV stations. Those will still be on the air after Feb 17th.

I'm going to have a TV on at midnight Feb 17th, just to see what all goes off the air.

Something else too: Who else is going to use the 54-88 Mhz band? I can't imagine wireless phone or internet service using such low frequencies. Why not save that band for some legacy analog TV stations?

wa2ise.... I cannot WAIT for pirate analog tv stations. Hell, if I was an FM pirate (or a ham/radio hobbyist) I can guarantee i'd be scouring town for a transmission rig.... I mean that would just be the ULTIMATE!

I'm planning on setting up all of my vintage sets tuned to all different analog channels, and filming the shutoff. That way I can post it on youtube! Bet many people will post something along those lines...:yes:

Despite all your sayings about the Zenith/Insignia DTV converters, I was actually impressed with the weight and built quality. There are many makers out there right now, like Audiovox for RCA, Funai for Magnavox, Changhong, and LG for Insignia and Zenith. I also bought the Insignia yesterday, and I was surprised how much heavier it is than the RCA. The RCA is really small with plastic shell, but it has a 1 year parts and labor warranty, The Insignia/Zenith one uses better quality parts but with only 90 days labor warranty.

Geez...one guy reports he has an issue and the whole farking world of converter boxes is turned upside down.... :lmao:

All products have infant mortality failures.

I've got two Digitalstream boxes from ratshack but they are for future use since I have cable. I do intend to buy more boxes later. After reading this, I'd probably do just as well to buy the Funai made Maggotboxes from Wal Mart.


I've read the Digital Stream boxes run extremely hot.

I've also read the Magnavox boxes have low sensitivity.

The Zeniths are still the overall favorites/top rated from what I've seen.....

At least in an unscientific, impromptu test conducted in my living room laboratory, the Insignia (Zenith) beats the Magnavox hands down in terms of sensitivity. I've got a Silver Sensor antenna on the ground floor pointed in the general direction of downtown Chicago (35 miles away) and can receive all of the local channels with either box. However, there is a PBS station in Gary, IN which is impossible to pick up with the same setup using the Magnavox, but it comes in with acceptable signal strength using the Insignia.

Still keeping an eye on the reviews as I have one coupon left...

-Jim

That's what I'm thinking too, also, I live near Canada, and a couple LPTV stations. Those will still be on the air after Feb 17th.

I'm going to have a TV on at midnight Feb 17th, just to see what all goes off the air.

Something else too: Who else is going to use the 54-88 Mhz band? I can't imagine wireless phone or internet service using such low frequencies. Why not save that band for some legacy analog TV stations?

I know that some of the TV stations will go back to the original VHF-Lo (54 - 88 Mc) or VHF-Hi (174 - 216 Mc) channels with their HDTV signals after the switch. One exception is WPXI, Channel 11, here in Pittsburgh, they will keep their HDTV signal on Channel 48 with The CW going on Channel 11 for better coverage.

The LG (Insignia/Zenith) are still the best converter boxes out there.
Look at cnet’s reviews: http://reviews.cnet.com/4566-6487_7-0.html

In most of their reviews you will see they mention that the LG (Insignia/Zenith) performs better in Reception and has better composite video quality.

Maybe one out of 10,000 boxes are a dud, and drh4683 probably got one of them, but that doesn’t mean there all bad. The important thing is to make sure you plug your converter box into a surge protector if you want it to last, since most electronics today can’t handle an electrical spike.

So be safe and use protection… :thmbsp:

I am the same distance from downtown Cleveland as N9ZQA is from downtown Chicago, so I could have the same results here with a digital TV converter as he had (one or more stations being unwatchable). The problem in my area, however, is the OTA signal of one analog station (the NBC affiliate in Cleveland) does not reach here at all, so there will probably be no digital reception of that station either. This area is not the best for OTA television reception anyway (the only major network station that reaches here well enough to watch on an antenna is channel 19, the CBS affiliate), which is why most folks here have cable or satellite. One of the very few exceptions is the local bowling alley across the street from me, which still uses a fringe-area TV antenna on a rotor. I don't know if they will get a new TV or try to get a DTV converter for their existing set (I think they only have one TV in the entire building).

I've read the Digital Stream boxes run extremely hot.

I've also read the Magnavox boxes have low sensitivity.

The Zeniths are still the overall favorites/top rated from what I've seen.....

I have two digital stream boxes and they do run hot. I will be on the lookout for a zenith for the third!
DTV= Disgusting Terrible Vision

I'm not really convinced that digital is better than analogue for TV ...yet!
My parents live in an area of Sydney that is fairly close ~12km to the transmission towers. Analogue TV is fine except for one channel which seems to get a bit of ghosting. They also have a few planes flying overhead as there is a beacon for the airport nearby. This causes a shudder on analogue and a momentary total loss of signal on digital, and depending on which box is used, a horrible sound through the audio. There are also numerous random glitches where the picture just pixellates and becomes unwatchable, also the muting cuts in and blue screens. This is experienced over a number of houses, a number of different STBs and various aerial solutions. But they all lead to the same conclusion, the level of technology in these boxes, and the digital broadcast is simply not yet good enough and we only use the STB for channels which are only on digital, the rest of the time we use analogue. It can only be worse for country areas. Rain also seems to upset it, which is pretty poor performance. Plus digital channel changes are very slow.
Some boxes get very hot, these usually fail within a couple of months, usually with bulging, leaky electrolytics in the power supply.
I have found here that a few Topfield units have given good service, they can even survive a time submerged, when they were removed from the Hunter river last year after the floods, two plain Topfield boxes were OK, the Topfield PVR worked for a few more months and the LG box never worked again, they were all off at the time.
I have found that extended warranties, which I usually avoid, are a good idea with set top boxes.
Cheers
Tony

Consumer Reports give a couple of the GE boxes high ratings:
http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/electronics-computers/televisions/digital-tv-converter/ratings/dtv-converter-boxes-ratings.htm

I'm not really convinced that digital is better than analogue for TV ...yet!


I'm on the fence about that. I certainly don't want Analog TV to leave, if anything, just for emergency use.

Here are some pros and cons I've gathered from my experience with DTV:

PROS:

More channels

No fuzzy picture/ghosting/color drop out/ sound hissing/crackling.

Higher resolution AKA: More detailed picture. On a standard analog TV, it looks like you're watching a DVD.

Good reception with a rooftop antenna.

CONS:

Reception issues when using anything less then an outdoor antenna. Getting distant channels from other cities may prove difficult to impossible. On windy days, you may still get picture drop outs that last for a half second. Very bad when trying to record something.

Some channels are over compressed, leading to compression artifacts, especally during motion.

Changing channels is slower. Even back in the days of dial TV's, one could click through the dial much faster.


Now, I think that with time, DTV will iron out these flaws better. As it stands now, I don't want Analog to fully disappear yet.

I'm on the fence about that. I certainly don't want Analog TV to leave, if anything, just for emergency use.

Here are some pros and cons I've gathered from my experience with DTV:

PROS:

More channels

No fuzzy picture/ghosting/color drop out/ sound hissing/crackling.

Higher resolution AKA: More detailed picture. On a standard analog TV, it looks like you're watching a DVD.

Good reception with a rooftop antenna.

CONS:

Reception issues when using anything less then an outdoor antenna. Getting distant channels from other cities may prove difficult to impossible. On windy days, you may still get picture drop outs that last for a half second. Very bad when trying to record something.

Some channels are over compressed, leading to compression artifacts, especally during motion.

Changing channels is slower. Even back in the days of dial TV's, one could click through the dial much faster.


Now, I think that with time, DTV will iron out these flaws better. As it stands now, I don't want Analog to fully disappear yet.

Ditto on that, and also, if anyone is thinking of buying a box made by "Access HD", Don't... they suck. It takes this thing forever to do anything I.E. change channels, auto search {took like 7 min} and the picture quality was not as good as a "Zenith" "Insignia" or LG.

The Zenith takes too long to change channels too IMO. Little annoyances.

I'm not really convinced that digital is better than analogue for TV ...yet!
My parents live in an area of Sydney that is fairly close ~12km to the transmission towers. Analogue TV is fine except for one channel which seems to get a bit of ghosting. They also have a few planes flying overhead as there is a beacon for the airport nearby. This causes a shudder on analogue and a momentary total loss of signal on digital, and depending on which box is used, a horrible sound through the audio. There are also numerous random glitches where the picture just pixellates and becomes unwatchable, also the muting cuts in and blue screens. This is experienced over a number of houses, a number of different STBs and various aerial solutions. But they all lead to the same conclusion, the level of technology in these boxes, and the digital broadcast is simply not yet good enough and we only use the STB for channels which are only on digital, the rest of the time we use analogue. It can only be worse for country areas. Rain also seems to upset it, which is pretty poor performance. Plus digital channel changes are very slow.
Some boxes get very hot, these usually fail within a couple of months, usually with bulging, leaky electrolytics in the power supply.
I have found here that a few Topfield units have given good service, they can even survive a time submerged, when they were removed from the Hunter river last year after the floods, two plain Topfield boxes were OK, the Topfield PVR worked for a few more months and the LG box never worked again, they were all off at the time.
I have found that extended warranties, which I usually avoid, are a good idea with set top boxes.
Cheers
Tony

I live in a flight path here in the Pittsburgh, PA area, many times, I get pixelation when airplanes fly over although I've seen a small increase when it rains hard or wind blows, we have trees in the back. I didn't notices as much pixelation when it was winter and the trees were bare. Here in Pittsburgh, all HDTV are on UHF channels but a few will migrate back to VHF after the change so I'm interested to see the effects on that. I have three boxes, my aunt gave us her second one, 2 Zenith (LG really) DTT-900's and one DTT-901.

I'm on the fence about that. I certainly don't want Analog TV to leave, if anything, just for emergency use.

Here are some pros and cons I've gathered from my experience with DTV:

PROS:

More channels

No fuzzy picture/ghosting/color drop out/ sound hissing/crackling.

Higher resolution AKA: More detailed picture. On a standard analog TV, it looks like you're watching a DVD.

Good reception with a rooftop antenna.

CONS:

Reception issues when using anything less then an outdoor antenna. Getting distant channels from other cities may prove difficult to impossible. On windy days, you may still get picture drop outs that last for a half second. Very bad when trying to record something.

Some channels are over compressed, leading to compression artifacts, especally during motion.

Changing channels is slower. Even back in the days of dial TV's, one could click through the dial much faster.


Now, I think that with time, DTV will iron out these flaws better. As it stands now, I don't want Analog to fully disappear yet.

Yeah, although the FCC is shoving this on us, I guess I learned to embrace the future, at least the converter box program address most of the concerns. Still, I think we should have kept analogue on the VHF channels at least.

I'm on the fence about that. I certainly don't want Analog TV to leave, if anything, just for emergency use.

Here are some pros and cons I've gathered from my experience with DTV:

PROS:

More channels

No fuzzy picture/ghosting/color drop out/ sound hissing/crackling.

Higher resolution AKA: More detailed picture. On a standard analog TV, it looks like you're watching a DVD.

Good reception with a rooftop antenna.

CONS:

Reception issues when using anything less then an outdoor antenna. Getting distant channels from other cities may prove difficult to impossible. On windy days, you may still get picture drop outs that last for a half second. Very bad when trying to record something.

Some channels are over compressed, leading to compression artifacts, especally during motion.

Changing channels is slower. Even back in the days of dial TV's, one could click through the dial much faster.


Now, I think that with time, DTV will iron out these flaws better. As it stands now, I don't want Analog to fully disappear yet.

One thing I noticed is the dtv goes out when there is a lightning storm and high wind. How is this system going to work when we get bad weather?
Like, That is when we really need the tv to work. This is gonna really be interesting here in buffalo ny when we get a snow storm off the lake.
They are running atsc and ntsc now, Why not just run both? GREED would be a good guess.
Ed

Further on the UHF/VHF thing, in Sydney the signals for DTV appear mostly on VHF, and in Newcastle, just 130km away the signals are all UHF.
In Sydney my parents have outdoor VHF and UHF antennae, in Newcastle I have an indoor UHF aerial. My parents live about 11km to their transmitters, I live about 40 to 50km from my transmitters. The end result is, funnily enough, I get more reliable reception with the indoor antenna. This is across a wide variety of STBs to be sure as well. At Newcastle with the same indoor antenna I get terrible reception on analogue though.
It's a funny technology at this stage still.
Cheers
Tony

I was going to buy the Insignia model DTV converter, but I see Best Buy is now supplementing their converter inventory with the APEX DT250 converter. In fact, the display floor stacks of the 'sigs are declining, and the APEX appears to be taking over. Same price.

Anyone have any experience with this model?

We have two insignia's and two magnavox and had no problems with any so far. We live about as far as you can live from most transmitter's in our market and befor dtv we couldn't get sqwat on the regular outdoor antenna sitting in the attic. When we hooked up the converter boxes it was like free tv heaven!:banana: All of a sudden we could get all channel's from Orlando and Tampa if we wanted to turn the directional antenna a little bit. Most channels have two or three or more channels.:yes::thmbsp: The picture is as good as satelite as far as I can tell.

wa2ise.... I cannot WAIT for pirate analog tv stations. Hell, if I was an FM pirate (or a ham/radio hobbyist) I can guarantee i'd be scouring town for a transmission rig.... I mean that would just be the ULTIMATE!

I'm planning on setting up all of my vintage sets tuned to all different analog channels, and filming the shutoff. That way I can post it on youtube! Bet many people will post something along those lines...:yes:

Trust me it's no fun when the Federilas have you and your old lady handcuffed in front of your door with an Ak pointing on your back while they load up tens of thousands worth of gear not related to Pirate radio... The thrill is gone for some free banders. Yeah they took all his Collins gear too :thumbsdn:.

-Mike