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  #16  
Old 11-21-2013, 09:10 AM
Chip Chester Chip Chester is offline
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The reason it works so well is that digital TV is made up of ones and zeroes.
The ones are easy to pick up with a plain stick antenna.
The pictured antenna is obviously for the zeroes.

Chip
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  #17  
Old 11-22-2013, 01:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chip Chester View Post
The reason it works so well is that digital TV is made up of ones and zeroes.
The ones are easy to pick up with a plain stick antenna.
The pictured antenna is obviously for the zeroes.

Chip
And if you wire the stick in parallel with the one pictured you will be able to tune all the TVs on the air worldwide.
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Last edited by Electronic M; 11-28-2013 at 04:24 PM.
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  #18  
Old 11-22-2013, 02:52 PM
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I don't know about that. I live in an area that does not get the CBS or FOX television stations from Cleveland with an OTA antenna. These just happen to be the stations the subchannels of which I watch the most, and it bothers me that I must have cable to see them.

I'm not even sure connecting a standard TV antenna (I guess that's what is meant by a "stick") would bring in the two channels I do not get in digital. I don't know why I don't get those two channels without cable, when every other Cleveland TV station comes in here very well on an antenna. I am guessing it is because channels 8 and nineteen transmit their DTV signals on VHF channels, with the rest transmitting on UHF stations. Another thing that bothers me: My DTV antenna brings in the stations it does get, and well, but the channel list is repeated, in effect showing the same channel twice on one list. Why is this, and what (if anything) can I do to eliminate the duplication of the channel list? It is frustrating and annoying, to say the least, to see my TV bringing in 20+ digital channels (as shown on the scan list), only to find out half those channels are duplicates.

Hmmm. I wonder. If I could get hold of an all-channel indoor TV antenna like a Rembrandt (the kind with the 102" dipoles, the crossed UHF loops, and the 12-position tuning switch), would I finally be able to get channels eight and 19 in digital? Are those antennas even available anywhere anymore? I'll look on eBay; there might be at least one such antenna there. I see on that site just about everything else pertaining to television (including outdoor antennas and even antique rabbit ears), so someone might very well have one up for auction, even as I write this.
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  #19  
Old 11-22-2013, 03:52 PM
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old_tv_nut old_tv_nut is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffhs View Post
I don't know about that. I live in an area that does not get the CBS or FOX television stations from Cleveland with an OTA antenna. These just happen to be the stations the subchannels of which I watch the most, and it bothers me that I must have cable to see them.

My DTV antenna brings in the stations it does get, and well, but the channel list is repeated, in effect showing the same channel twice on one list. Why is this, and what (if anything) can I do to eliminate the duplication of the channel list? It is frustrating and annoying, to say the least, to see my TV bringing in 20+ digital channels (as shown on the scan list), only to find out half those channels are duplicates.
Quick thoughts:

1) I forgot if you said before (and you don't say here) if you are using an outdoor antenna. VHF channels will be more difficult than UHF, generally.

2) Duplicate channels can be caused by not erasing your old channel list when you re-scan your set. Re-scan, and make sure you are not in an "add new channels" mode.

In rare cases (like Chicago) some stations had both a UHF and a VHF signal on the air for some time, and that always resulted in duplicates. If that is the current case for anyone, they need to go through the channel list and manually delete the ones they don't want.
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  #20  
Old 11-22-2013, 06:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by old_tv_nut View Post
Quick thoughts:

1) I forgot if you said before (and you don't say here) if you are using an outdoor antenna. VHF channels will be more difficult than UHF, generally.

2) Duplicate channels can be caused by not erasing your old channel list when you re-scan your set. Re-scan, and make sure you are not in an "add new channels" mode.

In rare cases (like Chicago) some stations had both a UHF and a VHF signal on the air for some time, and that always resulted in duplicates. If that is the current case for anyone, they need to go through the channel list and manually delete the ones they don't want.
I only have one indoor antenna (my ClearTV digital one) on my set. I don't want to go to the trouble of putting up an outdoor antenna.

I've tried to erase the channel list, but it doesn't work. The usual method of unplugging the set for a period of time, then pressing the power on/off button for 30 seconds to one minute, does not work either. The instruction manual (on a DVD, not a printed manual) does not say anything regarding the channel list, except how to add or delete certain channels from it (I cannot physically add or delete individual channels; I must check or uncheck a small circle on the channel list near every station the TV receives, depending, respectively, upon whether I want to include or exclude that channel from the scan list).

I always thought it was the other way around (UHF would be more difficult to receive than VHF), due to UHF's much shorter wavelengths. The only thing I can come up with is that VHF DTV signals are transmitted at lower power than are UHF ones, resulting, of course, in weaker signals that travel shorter distances.

It's at times like this I wish the government hadn't fooled around with the country's television broadcast standards and done away with the old system that had served us well for over fifty years. NTSC was doing just fine, and resulted in at least some reception even if the signals were weak. DTV is all or nothing, meaning if the signal is too weak (below a certain threshold level), there either will be no picture at all, or else the picture will break up into squares and be unwatchable. I like the idea of being able to watch other programs (Antenna TV, MeTV, RTV, et al.) on DTV subchannels, and the much clearer, interference-free picture afforded by DTV, but the reception problems, which no one much had before DTV...well, I don't want to say it's too much, but I don't like those problems any more than asnyone else.

I looked on eBay this afternoon and found many indoor and outdoor DTV antennas, but I'm hesitant to get an all-channel indoor one because it may not work in this area. I don't know, as I said in my post, why channels eight and 19 are so difficult to receive (other than the fact that they are transmitted over VHF DTV channels).

I live within one mile of Lake Erie and get excellent reception from Detroit stations (including their CBS channel 62) using the indoor antenna in the summer. If I could get channel 62 all year long, I wouldn't be concerned as to the loss of channel 19 in Cleveland, which is the CBS station for northern Ohio; however, 62, as well as all other Detroit TV stations, only comes in during the summer.
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  #21  
Old 11-22-2013, 07:53 PM
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I bought one of these off ebay for about half the price. Mounted in my basement on the ceiling. I can get all the channels in my area. They come in clear and being in the basement, never a worry about it being damaged in a storm.

http://www.antennasdirect.com/store/...V-Antenna.html
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  #22  
Old 11-24-2013, 08:24 PM
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Originally Posted by TVTim View Post
I bought one of these off ebay for about half the price. Mounted in my basement on the ceiling. I can get all the channels in my area. They come in clear and being in the basement, never a worry about it being damaged in a storm.

http://www.antennasdirect.com/store/...V-Antenna.html
Those use concentric rings to optimize wavelengths over the "new" UHF band channels 14-51, similar in principle to the vintage JFD unit pictured by Walterbeers
I have seen a few of those showing up around here (SE of Lancaster) where all the transmitters are to the west and northwest.

I have not tried one myself but for Hi-band VHF, it would work on WGAL-8 @ 20 miles which has about double the power of WHTM* on 10 @ 40 miles away on which it would definitely NOT work.

*The ABC channel on 10 is considered "local" but is a major headache for most locations around here, while the other channels are pretty easy.
Unfortunately, only Blonder Tongue or Wade antennas still make a 10-element, single-channel Yagi for VHF and its not cheap.
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Last edited by DavGoodlin; 11-24-2013 at 08:41 PM.
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  #23  
Old 11-24-2013, 09:57 PM
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NowhereMan 1966 NowhereMan 1966 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffhs View Post
I don't know about that. I live in an area that does not get the CBS or FOX television stations from Cleveland with an OTA antenna. These just happen to be the stations the subchannels of which I watch the most, and it bothers me that I must have cable to see them.

I'm not even sure connecting a standard TV antenna (I guess that's what is meant by a "stick") would bring in the two channels I do not get in digital. I don't know why I don't get those two channels without cable, when every other Cleveland TV station comes in here very well on an antenna. I am guessing it is because channels 8 and nineteen transmit their DTV signals on VHF channels, with the rest transmitting on UHF stations. Another thing that bothers me: My DTV antenna brings in the stations it does get, and well, but the channel list is repeated, in effect showing the same channel twice on one list. Why is this, and what (if anything) can I do to eliminate the duplication of the channel list? It is frustrating and annoying, to say the least, to see my TV bringing in 20+ digital channels (as shown on the scan list), only to find out half those channels are duplicates.

Hmmm. I wonder. If I could get hold of an all-channel indoor TV antenna like a Rembrandt (the kind with the 102" dipoles, the crossed UHF loops, and the 12-position tuning switch), would I finally be able to get channels eight and 19 in digital? Are those antennas even available anywhere anymore? I'll look on eBay; there might be at least one such antenna there. I see on that site just about everything else pertaining to television (including outdoor antennas and even antique rabbit ears), so someone might very well have one up for auction, even as I write this.
I use a Rembrandt rabbit ears on a Zenith DTV-900 box hooked up to a 19 inch Zenith TV. They were a wedding present to my parents back in 1959.
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  #24  
Old 11-25-2013, 12:02 PM
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Originally Posted by NowhereMan 1966 View Post
I use a Rembrandt rabbit ears on a Zenith DTV-900 box hooked up to a 19 inch Zenith TV. They were a wedding present to my parents back in 1959.
Those are honestly the most interesting and cool indoor antennas ever made.
I had a set years ago that came with a 1956 Magnavox console, both the VHF and UHF lead-ins were a single quad-lead.
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  #25  
Old 11-25-2013, 01:01 PM
dieseljeep dieseljeep is offline
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Originally Posted by walterbeers View Post
I got a hold of an antique UHF antenna, strange looking device that I found at the Early Television Convention last summer. Hooked it up to my 50" plasma in my basement level family room, and guess what I got 3 more PBS channels that I could barely pick up before with my regular rabbit ear antenna, and picture doesn't even pixelize unless we have really crappy weather.
That's the old Radion Bullseye from the mid-50's. There was 1000's of them in Milwaukee.
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  #26  
Old 11-25-2013, 01:09 PM
dieseljeep dieseljeep is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DavGoodlin View Post
Those are honestly the most interesting and cool indoor antennas ever made.
I had a set years ago that came with a 1956 Magnavox console, both the VHF and UHF lead-ins were a single quad-lead.
That was the later model. The earlier ones looked similar but were only for VHF. They also made Silvertone branded set-top antennas for Sears.
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