Dos ANYONE here feel that our old "goodies" were REALLY meant to last 40-80 years??

[rca2000]

I have been musing a bit, after my last two acquisitions from CL--A CTC-40 combo and a 1970 RCA stereo console with the VERY rare RS-246 amp--that was only made for ONE year...and which I have been seeking for OVER 30 years now!! (I happen to have a "soft spot" for the better made, higher--end console stereo of the 60's to early 70's, both tube and SS.)

Some of us have old tv's stereo, radios and other electronics that are from 35-80+ years old. Often--we CAN get them to work again--and often, most of the "high dollar" original parts are still good. But, one CANNOT say the same for ANY remotely modern stuff--built to last no more than 5-10 years or so, and probably with several repairs during that time frame.

I just wonder:: Does ANYONE really think that when they built our old things---they had ANY concern to make them to be able to last--or at least be fixable--30,40,50 and MORE years in the future??

Personally--I do NOT. I figure they made things to last say--15-20 years or so in the "old days" , without too much trouble--but I think that the reason we can get the to work for twice that long--or longer now--is just one of those "unintended consequences" of the way "things were done then".... Build something they way "you" would want it built---and it will turn out be be of VERY high quality--at least--compared to TODAY.

Zenith, in particular REALLY "overbuilt" a LOT of their tv's stereos, radios and such--at least till the early--mid 1970's or so. With the hand--wired chassis and such--they are nearly "bulletproof" and a testament to "build it right--and to last".

RCA--on the other hand--often seemed at least one or two steps behind Zenith in "build quality" , jumping on printed ckt. construction early on, but they STILL were built pretty well...and of course RCA REALLY had the "innovative edge", compared to Zenith--often taking on new and "cutting edge" technologies" that would often set the standard in coming years--such as the first to use IC's in comsumer products, the first electronic tuner, all SS HV ckt, first SS remote setup with NO motors and so on. Sets like the RCA2000, the Direct Address sets, the dimenssia sets--showcased the RCA innovative edge.

Zenith meanwhile--stuck to the "tried and true" ways and circuits---and while they were tops in build--they were often behind RCA in tech.

So--in the end--we all are able to collect and repair their works meany years--even decades--later. Does anyone really think those designers MEANT for it to "be this way".

[Chad Hauris]

I think part of the fact that this old equipment can still keep going for this long is in part due to a higher quality of construction but I think mostly it is because it is so relatively simple with standardized, interchangable parts.

Almost everything except maybe some flyback transformers and yokes and some coils in these sets is a part which was pretty much universally used in similar types of equipment. This makes repair a lot easier when the original manufacturer is gone.

Also I think there was a limit back then to how cheap you could make something and still have it produce an acceptable result. Today you can make a DVD player, for instance that will perform great when first bought but is so cheaply made it just doesn't last.

One thing though, I think the capacitors we have today are for the most part a whole lot better than the old paper caps and cardboard electrolytics. A lot of old radios I work on have had to have capacitor replacements when they were less than 10 years old.

[bgadow]

I've often thought of this sort of thing; the folks in the factory those many years ago, putting together a radio or an engine or whatever-they had their hands on something that we now treasure. Most of what they built is long gone. Many times I've had to stop and pause while working on something, to think of the folks back then on the assembly line.

I have been reading some books written by folks who worked in auto plants and one thing I get from that is their didn't seem to be much pride or thought of any kind to an individual unit. Tedium took over and that car or truck that we see as being so special was just another couple minutes hard work to them.

[miniman82]

I don't really think it matters how long they intended these kinds of things to be around, if anything the fact that they are still here in operating condition proves that when you take care of something it lasts. Same goes for cars, really. Did Chevy envision clubs for '57 Bel Airs well into the 2000's? Probably not, but the ones that were cared for are still around.

[Sandy G]

I think the quality started to slip when the 1st of the "Big Boxmart" stores started rearing their ugly heads in the mid-70s or so-along w/the malls that virtually killed almost every downtown shopping area. The companies started building stuff down to a price, rather than up to a standard. But as to whether they thought stuff should last as long as it has-Mebbe not, but its a silent testament to the quality that was once built into consumer goods.

[jbivy]

Well we have to understand the in "the old days" items were more simplistic and the cost for them (equivalent cost) was much higher. Engineers and companies prided themselves on building sturdy and long lasting items. Where as now, everything is akin to a bic lighter. Good for so long, then when its empty/broken, its disposable.

A friend and I were outside staring at our two cars. A 55 studebaker and a 53 mercury. Remarking how both of our cars were never mothballed, that theyd been on the road since new. That theyd truly lasted a lifetime and now we were trying to make them last a second lifetime. Neither were designed or intended to last that long, maybe 15 years or so. But with minimal maintenance, theyd made it this long. They were just simpler and much more sturdily designed than these modern cars. Like my 1950 motorola and my studebaker, I think the chance that they will be around in 50-100 years is 50 fold of what a modern tv and car will have.

[andy]

...

[Sandy G]

I have an RCA AR-60 SW set from 1935. Cost $495, when you could buy you a new Ford that year for $650. The idea that a 1935 radio could still be working in 2011 apparently was NOT an unreasonable concept for them-It used very high-grade materials & the craftsmanship level was 2nd to none. The only things that have let go are the dial string & the band switch knob-Just simply worn from 75 years of use. The radio still operates as well as it ever did, I guess. I don't know how many tubes & caps have been changed, but the RADIO itself still works... I think there were 2-300 of these things made, there maybe 6-12 of 'em left. Too bad stuff isn't made to "1935" levels of quality...I'd wager this radio would cost, what, $5000 AT LEAST now....

[Dude111]

Originally Posted by Chad Hauris

I think part of the fact that this old equipment can still keep going for this long is in part due to a higher quality of construction...

I definetly agree!!!!

Stuff was made MUCH BETTER and it performed better as a result also!

Its just so sad whats happend to quality and the saddest part is: PEOPLE ACCEPT THIS CRAP MADE TODAY W/O QUESTION!! (They could put up a stink,etc to get something better like they remember)

[Sandy G]

Yeah...I remember, when a bright-eyed tadpole, my neighbor ran the local appliance store. There were generally 2 or 3 levels of cost-and quality. You had the "Popularly-priced" lines, the "Better" grade, & then the "Cadillac-ing it" line. He sold relatively few of either the high or low end stuff, but people who paid a little more expected-and generally GOT- Bigger motors, heavier-duty construction, brass fittings, maybe even stainless-steel guts. Imagine anything like THAT concept in WallyWorld America 2011, where EVERYTHING is basically the "Cheap-Shit" line, something Mr Cross wouldn't have even CARRIED in 1965. If you now want anything approaching what was considered the "Acceptable" quality of 40 years ago, you basically gotta to an industrial supply house, buy commercial grade, & pay out the wazoo for it. And prolly STILL not really get the quality the folks of 1965 got...And NO WAY will you get Tubby Cross to happily fix it if it should go bad, NOBODY really works on anything anymore, bring 'er back & we'll givya a new one...

[6GH8cowboy]

When I was in the tv repair business it was understood that the expected life of a color TV was 10 years with the consideration of at least one moderate repair, like a flyback or a CRT, and of course the ocasional tubes. As far as radios go, the capacitors of the time were horrible. If one is lucky to have one stored in any condition today the replacement caps and resistors are superior and such a radio could last generations more with modest use and a low humidity environment. Only tornados, flood, and ignorance will make them go away. I think only Mason jars were intended to last the years.

[kx250rider]

I think the early 70s Zenith color sets were designed to last "forever". I have a 25DC56 that I got at the Salvation Army store in 1980, and my mother had it on 24 hrs/day from then 'til she died in '88, then later it was in a house fire which melted the knobs off, and I cleaned it up and put new knobs (still available NOS from Zenith at the time), and a few years after that, it was thrown on the floor in the Northridge Earthquake. That busted up the plastic speaker grille and the "Space Command 500" emblem disappeared in the rubble on the floor, and the impact knocked the horizonal oscillator module off it's pins, but once I pressed it back in, the set worked fine! It's still with me, and still works fine...

Charles

[Dan Starnes]

These stories are fascinating. Great read!

[Chad Hauris]

Some other things I was thinking about this topic are, that I wonder if really cheap electronic entertainment devices which at least initially worked well even if not durable would have been around, say, in the 60's, would people have bought them?

Back then, if you wanted a color TV, there was no really cheap alternative. The cheapest color set was a Porta-color and even it was relatively expensive. Even a black and white TV still wasn't really all that cheap.

Another thing is...at least through the 90's and some things today, is that they do run a long time trouble-free with no maintenance needed. I think my parents are still using a Magnavox TV they bought in 1993 with no trouble from it at all.
Back when I was a teenager and we set up one of my CTC-39's in the dining room and it was in use all day, every few months or so I was having to replace tubes, replace resistors, re-solder joints etc.

Although it was easier to work on the tube-type stuff needed constant maintenance, especially TV's and I think the average non-technical person was more content to have something that would work trouble-free longer even if ultimately it was less feasible to repair.

The sad thing is today that even if you wanted to buy, say, a DVD player which was made from a solid aluminum casting and all metal parts and had a linear power supply and all over-rated parts, etc. there is no maker that would make one as almost no one would buy it...I think they would rather buy more $29.95 units rather than one $500 unit. I think only heavy industrial or military applications will pay for the durability.

[Adam]

As far as build quality, I think anybody ever topped what you see in the old Tektronix 500 series o-scopes.