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Old 09-22-2002, 09:56 AM
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jshorva65 jshorva65 is offline
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They Don't Make TV's Like They Used To ... but they should!

I've got several projects going at the moment that I hope will ultimately benefit the vintage video community. I hope to make restoration easier for everyone who is interested in restoring sets and make money where I can. I have a larger dream, though. Ultimately, I'd like to become a key player in the revival of the American electronics industry. I see no reason why it can't be American workers who are loading parts, setting up and supervising robotic assembly machines, tending wave-soldering tanks and doing quality control. Sure, it would mean the end of the $99 disposable color television, but it would also mean that the sets would be back to having an average life expectancy of 20 years or more. These cheapie sets are hard-pressed to hold up for 20 weeks. I wonder how many AK members are currently members of the Antique Wireless Association? I am. We may be able to gather enough like-minded people from the AWA to form a committee, research the issue, and present a case to lobby Congress for legislation that would help to pave the way for a revival of the electronics industry here. With sets that last longer and are built to be repairable when they do start to experience component failures, the lost art of tv repair would also be revived creating even more jobs for technicians, parts suppliers and dealers of used sets. That would put an end to our glutted market of technicians who are forced to work as telemarketers now since there aren't enough good tech jobs to go around (I did a two-year stint in a Customer Service job for a company that was a thinly-disguised telemarketing outfit ... and is now in deep trouble with the Feds for accounting fraud). Too many repair shops have been put out of business by the cheap disposable sets of today. Even with the rapid-fire development of new technologies and "obsolescence" factored into the equation, quality sets are still a good idea. Those who want the latest bells and whistles will still buy the newest sets as soon as they're introduced, trading in their used sets for a break on the price. The used sets could be sold to those who don't care about having the latest features. Much like the market for used cars, the used tv market could offer something for every budget. As for the argument that we Americans are greedy for wanting good jobs, I don't see anyone clamoring for the current manufacturers to pay a living wage to their workers in third-world countries. The environment? Pollution is going to be worse in countries with no environmental protection laws, so the tree-huggers are cuddling up to the wrong tree if they think that pushing industry out of the USA saves the planet.

Speaking of vintage sets, is there anyone out there who might want to team up with me to develop a set with a modern solid-state chassis in a vintage-replica cabinet and/or a replica cabinet designed for use as an aquarium to help discourage the destruction of authentic vintage tv sets for "color convewrsion" or "fish conversion"?

I suppose I should get off my soapbox and get back to work on that 10" B/W Fada recap in the basement. Please spread the word that there are some out here in tv-land that want to see some changes.
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Old 09-22-2002, 01:55 PM
Marlin Mackley Marlin Mackley is offline
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Boy John it looks like you got ahold of one of those charged caps in that Fada! I am of course in agreement with you on principle. I am afraid many folks don't care what the background of a product is, just how cheap. Witness Wal-mart and the millions of Wal-morons buying chinese goods (sometimes deceptively labeled) from a company that knowingly digs up historic grave yards and holds whole cities hostage. Just type "Walmart boycott" in Google to see several examples, including my site. CHINESE PRODUCTS.

I have often thought of making new wood cabinets for the throw away sets, hoping for a limited market. I have plans to replicate a couple of unique television sets in a year or so. One is the 1939 world's fair GE that sold on ebay for $13,000 a while back, the other is pictured at the top of my TV page: http://home.earthlink.net/~marlinmackley/vintaget.html

Marlin

Last edited by Marlin Mackley; 09-22-2002 at 01:58 PM.
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Old 09-22-2002, 04:29 PM
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Eric H Eric H is offline
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Hey Marlin, that set looks like a Seeburg Trashcan with a Congo drum on top
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Old 09-22-2002, 04:45 PM
Marlin Mackley Marlin Mackley is offline
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eric:
Don't laugh! That is what I think they made it out of! At lease the congo drum. The profile is an exact match to the drawings I extrapolated off the photos. I went so far as to price a 10" drum to cut up for it. Whack off the top edge and Viola! I wish I had a way of knowing if that was a real set or not. I have never found anybody that has seen one. Hmm... I think I will start a thread with a photo of it and maybe it will be recognized.
Marlin
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Old 09-22-2002, 10:04 PM
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jshorva65 jshorva65 is offline
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I've heard that China helped to fund the 9/11 terrorist attacks, but that's unconfirmed and off-topic. I wouldn't put it past them, though.

I spoke with Rob today, and he pointed out that there are very few components in a modern tv chassis that can be easily replaced so most troubleshooting would be board-level work. Actually, that was the way the early solid state tv chassis' were designed. I recall a commercial for one brand of set from the early 1970's in which the set was shown without its cabinet. One of the features of the set was "Plug-in circuit modules for easy servicing." I worked at a repair shop in the late 1980's that also sold used tv sets, and most of the used sets they sold were RCA (CTC-48, CTC-58 and CTC-68), Magnavox and Zenith modular sets from the early 1970's. Modular designs would be a great thing for the next generation of TV sets.

How many auto mechanics and used car dealers would be in business if cars were made the way tv sets are made now? I predict that cars will be the next item to become "disposable" if the trend continues. There is still a market for ten-year-old cars because everyone wants a car, not everyone can afford a new one, and cars are still built to last longer than their warranties. A good market existed for ten-year-old tv sets when they were still built to last ten years for the same reason.

I learned something after two years in the telearketing business ... people will buy anything as long as the seller can convince the buyer that the product is desirable. The unscrupulous telemarketing firm where I worked expected me to convince senior citizens who had good long-distance plans that the plan we were selling (lower price, but lots of restrictions and catches) was a good deal ... and that's the reason I'm no longer a telemarketer. There was a time when quality was inherently desirable, but the manufacturers of disposable products have convinced some of us that price is more important than quality, just like an unscrupulous telemarketer. The way to bring back the American electronics industry will be to convince the American consumer that quality is worth the higher price and that a quality set will retain a significant value for trade-in or resale. The used car market is proof that a quality product will retain value.

Last edited by jshorva65; 09-22-2002 at 10:26 PM.
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Old 09-23-2002, 03:20 PM
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ha1156w ha1156w is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by jshorva65

How many auto mechanics and used car dealers would be in business if cars were made the way tv sets are made now? I predict that cars will be the next item to become "disposable" if the trend continues. There is still a market for ten-year-old cars because everyone wants a car, not everyone can afford a new one, and cars are still built to last longer than their warranties. A good market existed for ten-year-old tv sets when they were still built to last ten years for the same reason.
Okay we're way offtopic for this one, but here goes....

I hate to tell you this buddy, but it's already well past that point. I'm seeing cars in the junkyards that aren't wrecked and only 6-7 years old. I restore antique cars on the side and am loathe to think of what the hobby will be like in 10-20 years with the proliferation of specialized sensors and computerized circuits that are only available from the manufacturer yet shut the car down if even the slightest problem is detected. The amount of plastic is awful in new cars. Ever look at a 20-year old GM? They didn't UV stabilize the plastic, so literally everything with a plastic clip or a molded rivet is falling off. Nothing you can do about it either. They don't use screws to put together the interiors of cars anymore...it's all clips and friction joints. Make it cheap and easy to manufacture and just get it through the warranty period....

I drive a Volvo 240 that is probably the last over-engineered car that can be worked on without special equipment (except a couple of suspension bushings...grrrr). But newer volvos aren't even the same. The 960's/S90's are notorious for corroding blocks that leak, valves that stick open, and oil consumption. Try to rebuild? Nah....the piston ring kits alone are $2000 IF you can get Volvo to sell them to you. Not all parts are available from the dealer, much less in the aftermarket areas.

Go to the Chevy truck forums at http://forums.pickuptruck.com/postli...=&Board=UBB11. Boatloads of threads about massive engine failures on 2-3 y.o. trucks, and just as many about BRAND NEW gas engines that sound more akin to Diesels (complete with example sound files!).

A buddy of mine who works at the GM plant nearby in the design engineering area. They actually have people hired to DESIGN LIFESPAN LIMITATIONS into parts. Excuse me? They *want* it to fail? They're designed to be low maintenance to please rental and fleet buyers (their biggest sales segment) and who cares beyond the initial ownership. Service and parts are highly profitable to automakers. That responsibility falls in the consumer category -- fleet & rental don't keep cars more than about 3 yrs typically.

Computer modeling has taken all forms of electrical and mechanical engineering and allowed the tolerances to be so close that the day it will die can be predicted with fairly certain accuracy. Remember how they used to determine the wattage of a resister and double it for safety.....no more! The computers can tell them that all scenarios say that no more than a x.yzqr% "nudge" factor is the closest required. Bearing needs to be s.tuv millimeters thick for n rotations meaning x months/years before failure? For each fraction of a cent they save, multiply that savings over 3 million units sold worldwide.....a lot of those partial cents vehiclewide add up and we all know vehicles are made by accountants and not engineers these days <wink nudge>

Anything without a limited lifespan creates a lost revenue stream. Everyone wants to go to the holy grail of corporate America -- the subscription model, where the customers pay frequently. All corners of modern industry are looking for ways to FORCE people to buy a new one of whatever it is they're selling. It's like a disease or something

Peace,
ha1156w
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