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  #46  
Old 02-08-2004, 02:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by jstout66
I have seen ads for Philco in "Life's" from 1967-68. They were advertising table-top Color BIG screen televisions, for like $298.00. Have NEVER seen one and was suprised someone was making them that late. Figured Philco had ALOT of 21FJ's to dump. Our repair shop was in Motorola, Zenith and RCA land, and I think they were done with the roundies by late 66. I sent Doug one of the Philco ads, maybe he will post it! (I'm too dumb to figure out how) I can't imagine Magnavox making round-screen sets after 1966......

Neither can I. I think Magnavox was promoting its rectangular-tube sets (including its fabulous 3-way entertainment centers, which all used 25" rectangular CRTs) from 1966 on, and most other manufacturers had abandoned roundies by then as well, so your observation that Moto, Zenith and RCA "were done with roundies" by the latter part of 1966 is accurate.

It's interesting that Philco, however, was still turning out roundies in the late '60s. You may be right about them having a warehouse full of 21FJP/FBP22s to get rid of.

BTW, I saw the Philco ad you mentioned. I believe we have come full circle as far as TV design goes, as most of today's color sets are table models--and they still weigh the proverbial ton, even though they do not have power transformers. (The heaviest component in today's CRT-based televisions, IMO, is the CRT itself--the larger the screen, the heavier the tube.) I have two of these sets, a Zenith and an RCA, which are both very heavy. I have the RCA, the TV in my living room, on a wheeled utility cart; the Zenith is in my bedroom on a dresser.

One could get a hernia lifting either of these sets incorrectly. The Philco in the ad you mentioned was never intended to be a portable (though I do realize the picture in the ad was just for advertising purposes); one could *definitely* injure himself lifting one of those monsters if he didn't do it right. Those Philco table models were meant to be put in one place and left there; they were far too big and heavy, IMO, to be put on TV stands of the period, most of which were flimsily made of wire and brass-plated tubing with plastic casters at the base. They were designed for TV sets no bigger than about 19", with voltage-doubler B+ supplies (no power transformer) and series-string tube filaments.

I think those big Philco table-model sets might even ruin today's entertainment centers, which are not designed to support TVs weighing over 150 pounds or so (the one in the ad must have weighed at least that much). For another example, the weight limit of the utility cart on which my living-room RCA TV sits is 64 pounds. Put one of those big late-'60s Philcos on it, and it will cave in in no time flat, ruining it and the TV almost in the blink of an eye. (I have a suggestion as to how to build those larger sets into cabinets, but I won't mention it here.)
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Last edited by Jeffhs; 02-08-2004 at 02:23 PM.
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  #47  
Old 02-23-2004, 08:50 AM
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Late model roundies

I was sorting through my Sams over the weekend, pulling out the duplicates so I could fit them all in the cabinet space I have. I kept an eye out for the last roundie in Sams. Several show up in 1969, including Magnavox, Airline, Muntz & I think Philco. But the last one shows up in August of 70, and its a Magnavox! It does seem strange that a company with a reputation for higher-line products would sell these so late. (but then, it wouldn't be the only example I've seen of cheesiness from the old Magnavox)
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  #48  
Old 02-23-2004, 09:02 AM
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I might have to disagree a little with the fact of the 1970 Magnavox round set being a cheesy product...yes the CRT was old technology (round) but the chassis was the same as on the highest-end Magnavox color set, minus the pincushion circuitry.
I was also looking through Photodact folders and found some real cheap 23" color console designs...some of these were basically a Portacolor series-string chassis with upgraded horizontal output/damper tubes.
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  #49  
Old 02-23-2004, 11:42 AM
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Bryan,
I have to agree with Chaud. These are probably the same chassis used in the 25" Maggies. We also get back to previous posts that suggest that Magnavox, like other manufacturers in the late 60's, had a wharehouse full of 21" tubes and masks and mounting hardware. Plus cabinets and backs ect. Some accountant may have suggested that a profit was still to be made on assembling and selling these as loss leaders. They would advertise them at a very attractive price and display the 21" next to a 25" set. Usually the customer would go for the bigger (higher priced) screen. Unless they were real bargin hunters and snapped up the last of the roundies.
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  #50  
Old 02-23-2004, 12:21 PM
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Maybe that's where all the roundies in "Colossus: The Forbin Project" came from !! <grin>-Sandy G.
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  #51  
Old 02-23-2004, 01:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Chad Hauris
I might have to disagree a little with the fact of the 1970 Magnavox round set being a cheesy product...yes the CRT was old technology (round) but the chassis was the same as on the highest-end Magnavox color set, minus the pincushion circuitry.
I was also looking through Photodact folders and found some real cheap 23" color console designs...some of these were basically a Portacolor series-string chassis with upgraded horizontal output/damper tubes.

I didn't know that the GE Portacolor chassis were anywhere near powerful enough to drive 23" CRTs. My best guess is that the basic design of the chassis was modified to include beefed-up flybacks and, as you mentioned, H-output and damper circuits. The original chassis could not possibly drive a 23" tube in its unmodified state.

Also, I wonder how a series-string chassis could be powerful enough for CRTs larger than, say, 19 inches. There were many b&w sets of this screen size which used series-wired tubes and voltage-doubler B+ supplies, but I cannot imagine such a chassis in a color set with a 23" tube. I would think any voltage-doubler supply powerful enough for a large-screen color set would be very expensive to produce.

I never considered Magnavox's TVs as being "cheesy" designs, either--at least not until recently (as in since the 1990s); now, I am inclined to agree with the poster who made that statement. Until Magnavox was acquired by Philips, they were very well-built sets which lasted years and gave their owners very little trouble, aside from a tube replacement now and then and possibly a reconvergence every year or so. I saw a pic of one of Magnavox's best 1960s-era consoles in this forum not long ago. Remote, power tuning (VHF and UHF, which was very unusual in most sets having that feature--most sets with power tuning, including Zeniths, only had it on the VHF tuner), and, in Magnavox's fabulous 3-way color theatre consoles, the total remote control system (their deluxe "Phantom" remote, which not only controlled all basic functions of the television, but those of the AM/FM radio and even reject and changer functions of the phonograph as well). These are sets the likes of which we will probably never see again (witness the fact that almost all TVs made today are table models; most folks wanting consoles nowadays simply purchase a nice wooden TV stand or an entertainment center and put the new set, along with perhaps a bookshelf stereo unit and a VCR, in it or on it).

However, as I said, Chad, I am inclined to agree that today's Magnavox-branded TVs and VCRs are made very cheaply, as are most other formerly American makes which were once the top of the line in TV and home entertainment.

The 1970 Maggies were still very good sets. I once knew a man whose mother owned a Magnavox TV that lasted her some 25 years or more, so those early Maggies were built to last. IMO, it was not until the company followed the former RCA and Zenith to Korea that Magnavox's quality started its downward spiral; it's been going downhill ever since. If you want quality in any of these former American makes, I would say look for an older set, say 1960s-70s vintage. Back then, RCA, Zenith, GE, Magnavox, et al. were still American companies manufacturing quality products. The older sets, when properly restored, will likely go trouble free for years, unlike the so-called Zenith, RCA, etc. sets today that typically only last about two years before developing serious problems (for example, the CRTs in today's Gold Star-built "Zeniths" typically short after a couple years, taking much of the video circuitry, not to mention the power supply, etc., with them). I have an RCA-branded set, CTC185 chassis, built in 1999 in Juarez, Mexico that has been trouble-free for the most part (have had it four years as I write this), but I have a feeling that my set is the exception rather than the rule.

The older consoles were much better looking than today's table models, even the RCA-branded sets in their "diamond mist" high-tech silver-color cabinets, but as I said, owners of these plain-looking sets often put them in entertainment-center cabinets or on wooden stands finished to match the decor of the living room or family room, den, etc. This is yet another reason I'd hang on to American-made consoles, if you have the room for them; most TV manufacturers except "RCA" and "Zenith" no longer make consoles. In fact, I have a feeling that the cabinets housing RCA- and Zenith-branded console sets are not as well made as earlier console cabinets (like the TV sets' chassis themselves). Why should a company that cuts corners right and left on the TV chassis make a fuss over the cabinet, unless they subcontract the cabinet work out to a reputable cabinet maker such as the fine furniture manufacturers in North Carolina? I honestly believe that is what RCA and Zenith have done with regard to console cabinets; if this is true, the cabinets, if not the guts, of today's high-end RCA- and Zenith-branded CRT-based TVs are still probably as good as they always were in the '50s until the companies went to Korea. These are also, IMO, sets one need not feel guilty over gutting for the cabinet when the chassis or CRT, or both, eventually go West. The chassis of these modern sets may not last very long, but the cabinets, if made as well as I think they still are, will last years and will be fine furniture pieces to be enjoyed long after the guts have been scrapped.
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  #52  
Old 02-23-2004, 02:52 PM
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The junkier stuff I've seen refers to some cheaper transistor radios from the 60s, clock radios, that sort of stuff. I have a few & they just don't strike me as anything special. I was cleaning out the shed where I have a late 40s Magnavox console radio & was surprised to see how empty the cabinet was, especially compared to the prewar Capehart I just lugged upstairs. No, its not junk, just not what I expected.

I like all old tvs and radios, don't get me wrong; for some reason Maggies have just never done much for me.
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