Videokarma.org

Go Back   Videokarma.org TV - Video - Vintage Television & Radio Forums > Early Color Television

We appreciate your help

in keeping this site going.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #16  
Old 09-23-2008, 09:27 AM
kbmuri's Avatar
kbmuri kbmuri is offline
VideoKarma Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Fort Wayne, IN
Posts: 590
Quote:
Originally Posted by ohohyodafarted View Post
Just what do you think the value of a rare, rebuilt 15GP22 with emmission like NOS is going to be worth on the open market?
Whatever the open market brings for it. Just that simple.

Quote:
Originally Posted by eberts View Post
Sounds like you got a fever.
eberts is somewhat famous here for being an abrasive buzzkill who doesn't contribute anything positive. I'm rather loathe to admit it, but I agree with him on this one. You've gotten several estimates from people who have 15GP22's and it's looking like somewhere between $1000 and $2000 is the magic number. Apparently that's not the answer you want to hear. So for some reason you've decided to rant and scold your potential customer base (as wishy-washy and unable to comprehend the "clearer picture") instead of accepting the number as given. Maybe not a "fever", but odd behavior nonetheless.

Rebuild a tube. Demonstrate it has 100% emission on all guns. Prove it won't leak air for a warranty period equal to a NOS tube (35 years). Show it working with vivid colors. List it on eBay and the AK classifieds and AntiqueRadios and on the ETF site. And demand a rebuildable core 15GP22 trade-in or no deal. See what you get.

No need to take a "pole"[sic] for that answer. That's the "open market" at work.

If it makes money, do it. If it doesn't make money but you want to be somebody important and famous by preserving history, do it anyway. If you can't afford that, don't do it.

That's your simple answer. Like it or not.
__________________

Do not attempt to adjust your set.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 09-23-2008, 09:34 AM
Pete Deksnis's Avatar
Pete Deksnis Pete Deksnis is offline
15GP22 demo @ ETF 2007
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Big Rapids, MI
Posts: 761
BTW Eberts, as the caretaker of two functional 15GP22's, I shall certainly be on my guard against other hobbyists looking to snuff me over those bottles

But seriously, no one is pretending this is anything but an opportunity for a very small universe. It will be expensive to pull off. To put it in perspective, since I bought my first CT-100 when I was 23-years-old I have also bought no less than 16 new cars. What's 3000 dollars more if I can get my first 15G glowing again?

Pete
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 09-30-2008, 07:10 PM
Robert Grant's Avatar
Robert Grant Robert Grant is offline
VideoKarma Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Monroe County, MI
Posts: 518
I'm a little curious about all the hub-bub over "full gamut phosphors" in the 15GP22.
I've had the experience recently of being able to watch a 15GP22 set in action (not an RCA CT-100, rather a Westinghouse), and did not notice anything special about the color (I could not adjust the color myself, however).

Rob
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 09-30-2008, 09:39 PM
old_tv_nut's Avatar
old_tv_nut old_tv_nut is offline
See yourself on Color TV!
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Rancho Sahuarita
Posts: 7,184
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Grant View Post
I'm a little curious about all the hub-bub over "full gamut phosphors" in the 15GP22.
I've had the experience recently of being able to watch a 15GP22 set in action (not an RCA CT-100, rather a Westinghouse), and did not notice anything special about the color (I could not adjust the color myself, however).

Rob
To make a long story sort, the major difference from a modern phosphor set (besides being considerably dimmer) is that the green is less yellow and more "kelly green" - this gives the possibility of a wider range of green and blue-green saturated colors.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 10-01-2008, 01:19 AM
WA3WLJ's Avatar
WA3WLJ WA3WLJ is offline
VideoKarma Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Radford , VA ; Work Various
Posts: 133
Which is dimmer ?

Which is dimmer,the modern or the 15GP22 ? Also, which is more yellow?
THANKS.
Reply With Quote
Audiokarma
  #21  
Old 10-01-2008, 01:25 AM
WA3WLJ's Avatar
WA3WLJ WA3WLJ is offline
VideoKarma Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Radford , VA ; Work Various
Posts: 133
Yoda, I'd like to talk to you about Leak Testing

Yoda,

Please send me a PM with your phone number.
I'd like to discuss Vacuum Leak testing and such.
Thanks.

Greg Francisco
Spacecraft Test and Integration Facility
NASA , Goddard Spaceflight Center
Greenbelt, Maryland
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 10-01-2008, 08:55 AM
old_tv_nut's Avatar
old_tv_nut old_tv_nut is offline
See yourself on Color TV!
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Rancho Sahuarita
Posts: 7,184
Quote:
Originally Posted by WA3WLJ View Post
Which is dimmer,the modern or the 15GP22 ? Also, which is more yellow?
THANKS.
Modern phosphors are more efficient/brighter. Modern green is more yellow.
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 10-01-2008, 09:01 AM
ohohyodafarted's Avatar
ohohyodafarted ohohyodafarted is offline
Bob Galanter
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Whitefish Bay, Wi (Milwaukee)
Posts: 1,053
Quote:
Originally Posted by old_tv_nut View Post
To make a long story sort, the major difference from a modern phosphor set (besides being considerably dimmer) is that the green is less yellow and more "kelly green" - this gives the possibility of a wider range of green and blue-green saturated colors.

And thusly, a 15GP22 looks more like true Technicolor motion picture film. I saw Pete Deksnis' CT100 in person, which he has set up better than any CT100 I have seen. The color on Pete's set will knock your socks off if you are viewing the right program material.

If you are reading this post Pete, perhaps you could give us a list of those special DVD's you have that were digitally remastered from the original Technicolor masters, and maybe some links as to where these special DVD's can be purchased.

Pete also has an adapter on his CT100 that allows you to run the set as a "monitor" and bypass the tuning section so you can drive the set directly from the video of your DVD player. I think the video adapter is a great mod and when I get my sets up and running, the video adapter mod will be high on my list of things to do.

Bob
__________________
Vacuum tubes are used in Wisconsin to help heat your house.

New Web Site under developement
ME http://AntiqueTvGuy.com
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 10-01-2008, 09:26 AM
zenithfan1's Avatar
zenithfan1 zenithfan1 is offline
Mark
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Kenosha, Wisconsin
Posts: 4,211
Quote:
Originally Posted by ohohyodafarted View Post
And thusly, a 15GP22 looks more like true Technicolor motion picture film. I saw Pete Deksnis' CT100 in person, which he has set up better than any CT100 I have seen. The color on Pete's set will knock your socks off if you are viewing the right program material.


Bob
I second that, the picture is amazing on that thing Pete, I use a screenshot for my desktop. Also, these full gamut phosphor tubes are designed to utilize the full I and Q demodulator system, something that the60's sets did not do. They only use "y" demod.
__________________
My TV page and YouTube channel
Kyocera R-661, Yamaha RX-V2200
National Panasonic SA-5800
Sansui 1000a, 1000, SAX-200, 5050, 9090DB, 881, SR-636, SC-3000, AT-20
Pioneer SX-939, ER-420, SM-B201
Motorola SK77W-2Z tube console
McIntosh MC2205, C26
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 10-01-2008, 11:27 AM
kx250rider's Avatar
kx250rider kx250rider is offline
REAL TVs have TUBES!
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Los Angeles & Dallas
Posts: 3,239
That early phosphor really does have incredible greens and reds. I've had a CTC-5 with 21AXP22 set up right next to a newer roundie, and there's no copmarison. (nameless other AK member) was the first to demonstrate that for me, with a laserdisc of South Pacific on a CT-100.

Charles
__________________
Collecting & restoring TVs in Los Angeles since age 10
Reply With Quote
Audiokarma
  #26  
Old 10-01-2008, 11:42 AM
Pete Deksnis's Avatar
Pete Deksnis Pete Deksnis is offline
15GP22 demo @ ETF 2007
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Big Rapids, MI
Posts: 761
Quote:
Originally Posted by ohohyodafarted View Post
Pete, perhaps you could give us a list of those special DVD's you have that were digitally remastered from the original Technicolor masters, and maybe some links as to where these special DVD's can be purchased.Bob
Here is a page on my site about the 3-strip technicolor DVD's. I don't know what may be available today; they were in general distribution.

http://home.att.net/~pldexnis/potpou...demo-DVDs.html


------------------


This page on my site documented one step in the quest for a vintage-hardware-based system that could show us what color television at its best looked like in 1954. Using modern instrumentation, it shows that an over 50-year-old 15GP22 is still capable of reproducing the 1953 NTSC color space.

http://home.att.net/~pldexnis/CTC2_h...GP22gamut.html

You will note at the bottom of the page there is a link to the full Monty: a demo of 15GP22 color capability at the 2007 Early Television Foundation museum's convention, which I am sure most of you have seen.


Note also that I did not do it alone; participants included, in alphabetical order, Chuck Azzalina, Wayne Bretl, John Folsom, Steve Kissinger, Steve McVoy, Ed Reitan, and others...
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 10-02-2008, 10:40 PM
old_tv_nut's Avatar
old_tv_nut old_tv_nut is offline
See yourself on Color TV!
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Rancho Sahuarita
Posts: 7,184
One thing that must be noted is that the same signal (from the same DVD) when put into a modern tube and the 15GP22, will ALWAYS show less-yellow greens on the 15GP22. This in no way indicates what the colors from that DVD SHOULD be. In fact, it is very likely that the color was restored while viewing on a modern (very accurate, but still modern) CRT, and that is what the srudio intended on that DVD.

However, one might surmise that IF the studio used an extended range monitor, it might have at some point produced an extended range master which was then rendered to be as good as possible on a modern display. This could include the choice to either keep the correct hue of a true green or go for higher saturation, but not both. There are similar, but much more severe, color rendering choices to be made in converting computer images to printed output.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:44 AM.



Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
©Copyright 2012 VideoKarma.org, All rights reserved.