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  #31  
Old 11-06-2011, 08:37 PM
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...nothin' quite like letting other people write your books for ya
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  #32  
Old 11-06-2011, 08:39 PM
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Over in Audiokarma's tube audio forum, someone had an audio amp that had a dead mouse inside it. Said mouse had crawled under the chassis inside the amp, and found some internally exposed powerline voltage, and thus was electrocuted. This was at some terminal strips (metal posts attached to a phenolic plastic strip) with bare wire connections feeding the powerline to the amp's power transformer. Before the mouse bought the farm it had chewed some wax off nearby wax paper capacitors. This audio amp could easily have been that color TV set in your novel.

Electricians occasionally find fried mice and snakes inside circuit breaker panels. Tends to be stinky and yucky...
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  #33  
Old 11-06-2011, 09:22 PM
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venivdvici venivdvici is offline
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Would this be one I could use for the snake? I don't think it has circuit boards but I can't really tell.
http://www.vintagetvsets.com/fm1.htm

So the snake would touch the chassis and an above chassis B+ post. I see B+ a lot. I wish I knew what a B+ post was. Does it have another name?

Thanks for the info!

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Originally Posted by Electronic M View Post
Some thing like a snake is long enough to touch the chassis and at the same time easily hit an above chassis B+ post and get electrocuted to death.

Most companies had circuit boards then which may have buged the snake enough to keep the critter safe (pokey test points and lots of small above chassis components), but someting like a Zenith or a Packerd Bell which had no circuit boards....Many of these 100% hand wired sets by that time used chassis mount terminal strips that could be accessed above chassis (Zenith REALLY liked useing these) often placing several B+ terminals easily touchable above chassis where that snake could comfortably get to them.
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  #34  
Old 11-06-2011, 09:37 PM
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Nice that you're writing a novel that is of interest to us VK'ers. However, way to much technical detail for the average reader to comprehend or even care about. I know your main character is a TV repairman circa 1961, but keep it simple and moving. Ie: Damn, It was an older model RCA color set. He'd worked on his share of these hulking beasts. "I just know this is gonna be a bench job" he muttered, as he started to remove the giant set's back to check the tubes. Sure enough, the acrid scent of burnt electronics invaded his nose. "No simple tube swap here." Guess I'll give her the bad news that I have to pull the chassis and take it to the shop." Then you can get into the woman's reply, how much she paid for the set and there's no damn color shows most of the time. Ect. I'll leave the dialogue to you. If you get into all the details of deguassing the set or changing specific tubes your reader's eyes will glaze over. Have the woman complain and discribe the symptons and your experienced hero TV repair guy do a quick diagnosis, explain the problem, what ever you come up with, and pull the chassis. Hell, it could be the "fringe area localizer switch" for all the woman knows. She just wants it fixed and he wants out of that house.

-Steve D.
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  #35  
Old 11-06-2011, 09:50 PM
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You're absolutely right! I really don't want to get bogged down in the details. And the main story will be a suspense romance (yes, a chick book). I'm writing it from the repairman's POV, and since I'm waaaaay out of my element with vintage teevee repair (but I think it's way cool anyway), I want a sentence or phrase here or there for color. I just want it to be correct, that's all. The repairman would look at a set and identify the exact model in his head, I think. Then again, you'd know that best!

Right now you taught me the phrase "bench job" which I take to mean he's gotta spend time testing to diagnose the problem. You taught me there's an acrid scent to burnt tubes. I didn't know that.

I'm not above making things up. Heck, the location I'm using is made up. But I don't really want to make up television repair details. I think it's cooler when real details are provided.

I swear, this is like learning a foreign language and trying to translate correctly! Thank you.

BTW, nice site! I love the Merrill.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve D. View Post
Nice that you're writing a novel that is of interest to us VK'ers. However, way to much technical detail for the average reader to comprehend or even care about. I know your main character is a TV repairman circa 1961, but keep it simple and moving. Ie: Damn, It was an older model RCA color set. He'd worked on his share of these hulking beasts. "I just know this is gonna be a bench job" he muttered, as he started to remove the giant set's back to check the tubes. Sure enough, the acrid scent of burnt electronics invaded his nose. "No simple tube swap here." Guess I'll give her the bad news that I have to pull the chassis and take it to the shop." Then you can get into the woman's reply, how much she paid for the set and there's no damn color shows most of the time. Ect. I'll leave the dialogue to you. If you get into all the details of deguassing the set or changing specific tubes your reader's eyes will glaze over. Have the woman complain and discribe the symptons and your experienced hero TV repair guy do a quick diagnosis, explain the problem, what ever you come up with, and pull the chassis. Hell, it could be the "fringe area localizer switch" for all the woman knows. She just wants it fixed and he wants out of that house.

-Steve D.
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Last edited by venivdvici; 11-06-2011 at 09:58 PM.
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  #36  
Old 11-06-2011, 10:27 PM
Accumulator Accumulator is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by venivdvici View Post
A few years earlier, she blew almost eight hundred bucks of her late husband's insurance on the new set and complained when all her shows weren't in color. He explained most shows weren't broadcast in color and she should save her money and return it for a nice black and white set. Nope. She wanted to be ready for the color revolution. She'd read in Life it was coming.
Do you mean his life insurance? She could only have blown eight hundred bucks of that after he died. If he is dead then how could he explain the lack of color broadcasts? Is he a ghost?
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  #37  
Old 11-06-2011, 10:44 PM
Accumulator Accumulator is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve D.
Damn, It was an older model RCA color set.
It's 1961, right? A 1958 RCA color set would be still very new.

Did any 3-year-old RCA TV sets ever blow their filter capacitors? Isn't a dried-out or leaky capacitor an age-related failure? Like after 15 or 20 years, minimum?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve D.
If you get into all the details of deguassing the set or changing specific tubes your reader's eyes will glaze over.
That seems true. I would make the symptom a simple rolling vertical hold, the repairman knows it's a sync tube, but he doesn't have a spare in his caddy. Rather than appear incompetent, he takes the chassis into the shop. Then he sends his least-favorite co-worker out later to put the chassis back in, to distribute the tea-n-cookie torture evenly.
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  #38  
Old 11-06-2011, 10:47 PM
Accumulator Accumulator is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by venivdvici View Post
You taught me there's an acrid scent to burnt tubes. I didn't know that.
No. Burned wiring or burned resistors. A "burnt tube" isn't likely. a "burned out" tube is, but that would be odorless. Like a burned out light bulb.
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  #39  
Old 11-07-2011, 01:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Accumulator View Post
No. Burned wiring or burned resistors. A "burnt tube" isn't likely. a "burned out" tube is, but that would be odorless. Like a burned out light bulb.
Exactly. I never said burnt tube produces an acrid scent. As Accumulator said the acrid scent or smell is from an electrical short or rubber insulation or a resistor or any number of other toxic components in a television chassis. A "bench job" means that the chassis is taken back to the shop and put on the work bench to be repaired.

-Steve D.
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  #40  
Old 11-07-2011, 06:48 AM
old_coot88 old_coot88 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve D. View Post
Nice that you're writing a novel that is of interest to us VK'ers. However, way to much technical detail for the average reader to comprehend or even care about. I know your main character is a TV repairman circa 1961, but keep it simple and moving. Ie: Damn, It was an older model RCA color set. He'd worked on his share of these hulking beasts. "I just know this is gonna be a bench job" he muttered, as he started to remove the giant set's back to check the tubes. Sure enough, the acrid scent of burnt electronics invaded his nose. "No simple tube swap here." Guess I'll give her the bad news that I have to pull the chassis and take it to the shop." Then you can get into the woman's reply, how much she paid for the set and there's no damn color shows most of the time. Ect. I'll leave the dialogue to you. If you get into all the details of deguassing the set or changing specific tubes your reader's eyes will glaze over. Have the woman complain and discribe the symptons and your experienced hero TV repair guy do a quick diagnosis, explain the problem, what ever you come up with, and pull the chassis. Hell, it could be the "fringe area localizer switch" for all the woman knows. She just wants it fixed and he wants out of that house.

-Steve D.
You are right of course. In my little rewrite of the author's text, i was trying to accomodate his expressed interest in the technical stuff and having it correct. He then has the option to dial the dialog back to suit the average reader's interest level.
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  #41  
Old 11-07-2011, 11:23 AM
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maxhifi maxhifi is offline
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i think one potential goldmine of info is old 1950s issues of Radio and TV News. The Mac's service column had tons of stories about specific repairs.
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  #42  
Old 11-07-2011, 02:10 PM
47'Plymouth 47'Plymouth is offline
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That's an early production #7..with 5U4s; mine is a "Grenoble"with ultrasonic wireless remote with "Top-Hat"diodes later changed the power supply design let's say mid-'58..due to design problems..got a new power transfomer coming from Moyers in Pennslyvania last one they had in a NIB..potted type
original was destroyed by a lighting strike many years ago
hasn't been turned on for over 30 years; have replaced all of the E-caps tried to power her up on the variac last week to no avail due to the dead short in the primarytry again when i'll receive the new replacement..
Audobon was yery nice in sending one for a model 9 that would work with some modifications to the #2 secondary and split the voltage down with 4
1N4007 diodes to get what i need the 9 used 350 volts..the 7 used @ the 2nd secondary 150 volts
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  #43  
Old 11-07-2011, 08:33 PM
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venivdvici venivdvici is offline
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I thought of a hamster before but it never occurred to me to use a mouse. That makes more sense. Thanks! I like it! And thanks for the detail. It helps me to visualize what happens.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wa2ise View Post
Over in Audiokarma's tube audio forum, someone had an audio amp that had a dead mouse inside it. Said mouse had crawled under the chassis inside the amp, and found some internally exposed powerline voltage, and thus was electrocuted. This was at some terminal strips (metal posts attached to a phenolic plastic strip) with bare wire connections feeding the powerline to the amp's power transformer. Before the mouse bought the farm it had chewed some wax off nearby wax paper capacitors. This audio amp could easily have been that color TV set in your novel.

Electricians occasionally find fried mice and snakes inside circuit breaker panels. Tends to be stinky and yucky...
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  #44  
Old 11-07-2011, 08:36 PM
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venivdvici venivdvici is offline
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Ha! Thanks. It wasn't her late husband but the main character of the story who explained it to her. I had already fixed that to read "Hunny" instead of "he" but great catch!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Accumulator View Post
Do you mean his life insurance? She could only have blown eight hundred bucks of that after he died. If he is dead then how could he explain the lack of color broadcasts? Is he a ghost?
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  #45  
Old 11-07-2011, 08:42 PM
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venivdvici venivdvici is offline
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Hmm, I wonder if this "fix" would work.
'--the main filter capacitor had gone bad. That was strange on a new set, until he remembered reading a few years back some sets were built with cheap caps from the Philippines. Fine with him. The more corners electronics companies cut, the better his repair business.'
=================================
A few years earlier, Mrs. Amato blew almost eight hundred bucks of her late husband's insurance on the '58 RCA Anderson with the CTC-7C chassis and complained when all her shows weren't in color. Hunny explained most shows weren't broadcast in color and she should save her money and return it for a nice black and white set. Nope. She wanted to be ready for the color revolution. She'd read in Life it was coming.

Her problem was, "The picture's messed up. It looks smaller and it's got this dark area across it that keeps creeping up through the picture and the sides are bending in and out." A shrunken raster with a hum bar and accompanying hourglass bending. At her house, he tried replacing the two 5U4 power rectifier tubes, but that didn't fix the problem, so he brought the set to the shop.

With Yoyo out of his hair, he pulled out the heavy beast's chassis. It had twenty-eight tubes, drew three hundred eighty watts, and had over twenty-two kilovolts of zapping power. Once he was familiar with its layout, he found the problem--the main filter capacitor had gone bad. That was strange on a new set, until he remembered reading a few years back some sets were built with cheap caps from the Philippines. Fine with him. The more corners electronics companies cut, the better his repair business.

He replaced the cap, a major job in itself, checked the rest of the tubes, cleaned the tuner and controls, reinstalled the chassis, and did a thorough degaussing and complete convergence and purity set-up. It ran good as new.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Accumulator View Post
It's 1961, right? A 1958 RCA color set would be still very new.

Did any 3-year-old RCA TV sets ever blow their filter capacitors? Isn't a dried-out or leaky capacitor an age-related failure? Like after 15 or 20 years, minimum?



That seems true. I would make the symptom a simple rolling vertical hold, the repairman knows it's a sync tube, but he doesn't have a spare in his caddy. Rather than appear incompetent, he takes the chassis into the shop. Then he sends his least-favorite co-worker out later to put the chassis back in, to distribute the tea-n-cookie torture evenly.
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Last edited by venivdvici; 11-07-2011 at 10:33 PM.
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