Videokarma.org

Go Back   Videokarma.org TV - Video - Vintage Television & Radio Forums > Early Color Television

We appreciate your help

in keeping this site going.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 07-23-2018, 07:55 PM
Techguy46 Techguy46 is offline
VideoKarma Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 8
Zenith 29JC20 21"--cataract and convergence

First big challenge is getting the cataract off the tube (21FKP22). The blear covers all but about the central six inches. I have watched a few youtube videos on cataract removal, mainly using heat. The tube is now out and sitting in the top of a garbage can. The plan is to set it out on a RILLY hot day, then if that isn't enough hit it with the heat gun. (I am in TN, so yes we have days in the upper 90's.) I would appreciate any advice or warnings concerning this operation.

The second big challenge is that the plastic frame for the convergence coils (and magnets) (looks like a 3-leaf clover) is busted in two places, so the coils are kinda ski-wacky. Suggestions for repair? I am guessing something like JBWeld. Or by some miracle are these available? What do I know?

Thanks HUGELY
Techguy46
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 07-23-2018, 09:00 PM
Electronic M's Avatar
Electronic M Electronic M is offline
M is for Memory
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Pewaukee/Delafield Wi
Posts: 14,758
There are two types of cataracts the green Halo and the moldy white. Green you can cut cold with a guitar string. The white you either heat or soak in water. If it is white and that far in it should be an easy fix.

You may be able to glue the clover. On my 29jc20 they just installed a newer style clover and spliced the wiring to the board.
__________________
Tom C.

Zenith: The quality stays in EVEN after the name falls off!
What I want. --> http://www.videokarma.org/showpost.p...62&postcount=4
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 07-23-2018, 10:09 PM
bgadow's Avatar
bgadow bgadow is offline
VideoKarma Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Federalsburg, MD
Posts: 5,814
For the "white" cataract, I think the water method is safest but it can take weeks. I've done this a few times; it doesn't work well with the "green" type.

I've done a number with heat, best with a decent heat gun. I actually did one on a dud (aired tube) using a propane torch and it seemed to work just as well though I'd be cautious doing it with a "live" tube. I also tried infrared bulbs on a dud one time and it worked well but the crt cracked underneath-too hot!
__________________
Bryan
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 07-25-2018, 10:13 AM
dieseljeep dieseljeep is offline
VideoKarma Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 7,562
Quote:
Originally Posted by Techguy46 View Post
First big challenge is getting the cataract off the tube (21FKP22). The blear covers all but about the central six inches. I have watched a few youtube videos on cataract removal, mainly using heat. The tube is now out and sitting in the top of a garbage can. The plan is to set it out on a RILLY hot day, then if that isn't enough hit it with the heat gun. (I am in TN, so yes we have days in the upper 90's.) I would appreciate any advice or warnings concerning this operation.

The second big challenge is that the plastic frame for the convergence coils (and magnets) (looks like a 3-leaf clover) is busted in two places, so the coils are kinda ski-wacky. Suggestions for repair? I am guessing something like JBWeld. Or by some miracle are these available? What do I know?

Thanks HUGELY
Techguy46
The set must have the original CRT. The CRT is RCA sourced, but it was numbered 21FK instead of 21FJ. Why?
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 07-25-2018, 01:54 PM
Electronic M's Avatar
Electronic M Electronic M is offline
M is for Memory
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Pewaukee/Delafield Wi
Posts: 14,758
Quote:
Originally Posted by dieseljeep View Post
The set must have the original CRT. The CRT is RCA sourced, but it was numbered 21FK instead of 21FJ. Why?
Because they had to buy it from the one 'FK'ing supplier they never wanted to give business to.
__________________
Tom C.

Zenith: The quality stays in EVEN after the name falls off!
What I want. --> http://www.videokarma.org/showpost.p...62&postcount=4

Last edited by Electronic M; 07-30-2018 at 10:06 PM.
Reply With Quote
Audiokarma
  #6  
Old 07-30-2018, 08:24 PM
reeferman's Avatar
reeferman reeferman is offline
VideoKarma Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: St. Louis
Posts: 583
Cloverleaf

I have a NOS cloverleaf. Might reproduction be a possibility with 3D printers? It would definitely have to be flexible to work.

As mentioned earlier, installing the hard plastic convergence assembly is the way to go.

Phil

Last edited by reeferman; 08-05-2018 at 03:41 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 07-30-2018, 10:10 PM
Electronic M's Avatar
Electronic M Electronic M is offline
M is for Memory
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Pewaukee/Delafield Wi
Posts: 14,758
Quote:
Originally Posted by reeferman View Post
I have a NOS cloverleaf. Might reproduction be a possibility with 3D printers? It would definitely have to be flexible to work.

Phil
Sure it should be possible. There are 3D scanners and printers around, and a variety of types of plastic filaments available...Once it has been scanned and any needed adjustments have been made to the CAD file then it should only be a matter of selecting the best-suited filament and figuring out how many copies to make.
__________________
Tom C.

Zenith: The quality stays in EVEN after the name falls off!
What I want. --> http://www.videokarma.org/showpost.p...62&postcount=4
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 07-31-2018, 08:01 AM
iong iong is offline
VideoKarma Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 102
Zenith 29JC20

Anyone know if Zenith 29JC20 (First Zenith Color) Has as nice picture as a later roundy like 26KC20?
Perry
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 07-31-2018, 03:08 PM
Electronic M's Avatar
Electronic M Electronic M is offline
M is for Memory
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Pewaukee/Delafield Wi
Posts: 14,758
It was on par with my 25MC33 before I sold the MC...Granted I'm using direct video injection since the tuner IF needed work and I was not prepared to open that kettle of fish.
__________________
Tom C.

Zenith: The quality stays in EVEN after the name falls off!
What I want. --> http://www.videokarma.org/showpost.p...62&postcount=4
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 07-31-2018, 07:32 PM
iong iong is offline
VideoKarma Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 102
Zenith 29JC20

Where did and how you connect the direct color video input?
Perry
Reply With Quote
Audiokarma
  #11  
Old 07-31-2018, 09:20 PM
Electronic M's Avatar
Electronic M Electronic M is offline
M is for Memory
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Pewaukee/Delafield Wi
Posts: 14,758
There was a thread on here where someone else explained it. IIRC (it has been ~3 years since I did it...) all I had to do for the video was unhook the outputs of the two video detector diodes from the set and connect the unhooked connections downstream of them directly to the center conductor of the video cable I used...This also defeats the RF sound circuits IIRC.
__________________
Tom C.

Zenith: The quality stays in EVEN after the name falls off!
What I want. --> http://www.videokarma.org/showpost.p...62&postcount=4
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 08-04-2018, 04:21 PM
Techguy46 Techguy46 is offline
VideoKarma Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 8
Progress!!

Nice hot day, set the tube out with a black plastic bag over it around 8 am. By noon it was around 150 deg all over the face (used one of those laser temperature meter thingies) and the lens popped right off! Easy peasy. I will try to post some pics.

Next step is thorough cleaning and sealing.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg IMG_1378.jpg (86.4 KB, 79 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_1381a.jpg (69.1 KB, 79 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_1382a.jpg (85.8 KB, 74 views)
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 08-04-2018, 08:56 PM
Electronic M's Avatar
Electronic M Electronic M is offline
M is for Memory
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Pewaukee/Delafield Wi
Posts: 14,758
Nice work! When a cataract is that far in it is easy to fix...When one has just started forming to the point that 1-2" of the edge is cloudy they are not as fun to fix.

BTW is that a 5" SONY 1/2" EIAJ RTR videotape in the background of the first pic?
__________________
Tom C.

Zenith: The quality stays in EVEN after the name falls off!
What I want. --> http://www.videokarma.org/showpost.p...62&postcount=4
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 08-05-2018, 02:03 PM
julianburke julianburke is offline
VideoKarma Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Knoxville, Tennessee
Posts: 644
The 29JC20 chassis delivered very nice color pictures with a sulphide (green) screen. Back in the '60's I used to go to the Zenith schools when they would come to Knoxville and Graybar Electric would host these as they were the regional Zenith distributor. The Zenith field engineer we called "the Dutchman" would tutor these classes. He would always refer to the 29JC20 and his young son was touted to be a 29JC20 expert!


As for the "cloverleaf" convergence plastic mount, it was always a problem even way back then. Its' main drawback was that is was not "adjustable" with a screw clamp mount and it was the dickens to reinsert the coil & magnet components in this plastic ring that was not flexible. In doing so it always felt that you were going to break it. The worst part was to replace the completed assembly on the neck of the tube as it was VERY VERY TIGHT! If you had a loose CRT socket, you could also crack the tube or break one or more of the wires underneath to further the hindrance. Time, age and heat would always make it brittle and break as it had a short life span.


As for removing the faceplate on a bonded face, a rebuilding plant that I would work at on nights and weekends, we would place a clean scrubbed tube facing a large (2' X 2') natural gas radiant heater (about two feet away) and after about 10-15 minutes we would place it face up on a wooden box with a one foot hole and take piano wire with a wood dowel on each end then place your knee against the tube and pull the wire between the faceplate and tube and pull. Be sure to wear heavy gloves when doing this not to mention handling the hot tube from the radiant heater. It would slice through with ease. I DO NOT recommend using a hair dryer or heat gun as this will create hot spots on the glass as the heat applied must be uniform throughout the whole glass area and can be dangerous as if you get a very hot spot on the tube itself as it likely can cause the tube to implode depending on the ambient temperature of the area. Moving the heat gun around on the face is usually a losing battle as when you move it around, the spot you just heated will cool rather quickly as there is a large mass area on the face.

I hope this answers a few questions here.
__________________
julian

Last edited by julianburke; 08-05-2018 at 05:14 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 08-05-2018, 03:44 PM
reeferman's Avatar
reeferman reeferman is offline
VideoKarma Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: St. Louis
Posts: 583
Julian,
You nailed it. I had forgotten what a "joy" those hard plastic convergence assemblies were! The original cloverleaf was much easier to work with, for sure.
Phil
Reply With Quote
Audiokarma
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:59 AM.



Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
©Copyright 2012 VideoKarma.org, All rights reserved.