I saved my first color roundie!

The story:

A friend of mine called me up on the phone, saying he found an old tube TV in the trash down the street from his house getting rained on. He pulled the tubes, and said do you want the tubes? or do you want me to get the whole TV, and he said that the picture tube looked broken, so thats why he didnt get the whole thing.

I told him to get the whole thing. So, I thought it was an old black and white 19 inch console, or something like that. didnt have my hopes too high.

Anyway, He came over the next day. and as soon as I looked out the door, I about fainted and fell to the ground. It was a zenith, console roundie color TV with a 21FBP22 CRT, no cateracts, or blown phosphor.

My first roundie! Now, I investigated the CRT, and the socket base is crushed into 3 peices. I looked real closely, and NO damage to the GLASS!! Which means the vacuum hopefully is still intact.

But, its pushing me away from it, because it has a CRT brightner hangen down on it, which comes to tell me the CRT is weak, if not dead.

I need the sams and the CRT pinout to test the heaters, for vacuum, and if they are open.

The pins are still intact, but the base is crushed, and I few wires are loose in the chassis.


It is a Zenith color TV, has no back, and the chassis number is: 24NC31Z

I will post pictures when I get batteries for the set.

Well, at least this set was saved from either getting munched into peices by a garbage truck, or getting woodchiped by rain, or turned into a fishbowl.

(I hope the CRT is good, because if not, the project will be condemmed).


And I saved it just in time for these punk kids with a baseball bat that were going to bash it in right before the frined of mine pulled up to get it.

Attaboy !! Good for you ! You done a good thing, even if you end up trashing it-you at least tried. Lets hope the CRT is still good.-Sandy G.

i need a pinout of the crt, and the sams if someone is willing to share....


pretty please with sugar on top

Lucky find! 24NC31 is the last roundie chassis zenith made, 1966. Look forward to seeing the pics

I managed to get the socket back on the tube, there was 1 broken connection between the socket and the glass, and it happened to be the green cathode, I tried to solder it, and I put the socket on carefully, and lets hope it stayed on tehre, and not popped back off.


Well, when I get the chassis working, and if the tube so happens to be still good, the green will be missing if that popped off again.

I hope not, because that socket was a b!tch to put back on.

Pics

I have a good question for you, Where in the blue blazes of heck is the power switch and vol control???

I cant turn the blasted thing on. lol.

CRUD!!!!!!

The CRT is gonde.


i can tell this, because I fired it up on the variac, there is high voltage, and there is a wierd smell throughout the set, not fried component smell, but something else, like a rotten egg smell.


Anyway, I looked at the gun of the tube, the filiments light, BUT there is constant blue/purple arc between the cathodes, and the other electodes, and you can see a constant blue stream down the entire gun in the center.

This is a bad CRT isnt it?

i let it run for a bit, and now the HV is gone.

Because if it is, its going right back out into the trash.

I cant afford another CRT. aint gonna happen.

As I recall, the on/off/volume came through the center of the UHF knob. But then again, I might be having a flashbact to the '60s.

GAGGAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Dam, my life sucks.

pop. goes the filiments in the CRT. Means No Vacuum.


crap crap crap crap crap crap.

Just when I thought I had something, im back down to nothing.

---

just for the hell of it, I popped off the vacuum seal stem in the back, and nothing. nadda. no vacuum. it leaked off over time. SHNIZER.

Well, how much does it cost to rebuild one of these?

Can you find used ones anyware?

Yes, the volume/power is usually through the center of the UHF knob on this age of Zenith. Don't be too discouraged about the bad crt...I found one where the CRT had lost its vacuum but just a little bit earlier found a round set with bad flyback...so was able to make one good set out of the two.
Don't trash that chassis...just be on the lookout for another set, which may turn up easier than you think.

I think it costs about 175.00 for a rebuild but you may not be able to rebuild one that's aired out. A salvage CRT from another set is likely your best bet.

Are you anywhere near Austin, Texas? I have a couple of the 22FBP22s in the garage that I will give you if you are. These both have vacuum.

I also believe that the emission is ok.

Heck, no.

im up here in hamilton ohio.

I would gladly take a CRT, but the problem is, shipping would not kill me, but destroy me, and possibly the tube. I really want to get this set going.

The only other tube color set I have is a portacolor, which I really dont even want. its been sitting for years, it still works I believe, it did work the last time I used it.

I would die to get this zenith going. but out of all things, the CRT had to go. The set did come on with no pic, and after the blue arc/ionization, the HV would shut down. Unplug, and plug back in, and it would take off again, until the filiment said pop.


I would rebuild the tube, but by the time I ship the tube and pay for it twice, along the rebuilding fee, it would go WAYYY over my budget, and well over what the set is even worth.

Anyway, im wondering if there is anyone local that has a CRT. im in the cincinatti area, just north of it.

Bummer!!!.

If you know of anyone comming yourway from Texas, please let me know.

---

the portacolor is kinda not so good condition, the channel knobs are missing. Thats about it.

BTW, How am i supposed to put something on ebay? I have no credit card and bank account. I used to, until mom screwed that, long story.

anyway, i just got into collage, and im broker than broke can be broke.

I have one of those jetsons black and white TVs too, I think its the panasonic TR-005 or something like that. It works good to, but again, its by far in mint or decent condition, hell, this one was found in an attic somewhere, where someone was trying to fix it. I got my hands on it, replaced the faulty cap, and put the top back on.

the antennas are gone, the power and band knob is missing, one of the side pot knobs are gone. its by far means ment, but electronically, it works again.

The thing about eBay is that almost anything in any kind of conditon will sell, the worse shape it's in obviously the less you'll get for it.....but it will sell (as long as you put a very low starting price and no reserve on it)

Anthony

thats not a bad looking set. Sooner or later one will come along. I had a crt go to air on me this summer but luckily had a spare from one I parted out. One idea is that when the etf convention takes place in spring maybe somebody will have one they could bring & you could meet them to pick it up? It would be ashame to see the whole set scrapped but as others have said, at least save the chassis. Wish I had saved all the ones I threw away years ago.

I was just mad yesterday. Anyway, i chilled off now.


I am just going to have to save money to crate and ship one. There is no two ways about it. Do you honestly think that I would toss out a halfway decent color TV for the garbage man just to destroy? I aint that cold hearted. lol.

I worked my tail end off getting that thing, and I aint letting it slip away like that.

too bad the filiment is open now, because if it still was good, I would toss a vacuum pump on the sob, and see if it works. lol.

I aint got anything to loose. I used to hook a vacuum pump up to VFDs where the seal would pop, just to play with it and see if it would work again, and beleave it or not, they would. Just not as bright as it would normally be.

i will see if my friend in trotwood is back.
he offered me some round color tubes he stashed in his attic.
said there are perhaps 6.
when i get them i will holler.
they are usable or he wouldnt have kept them.
and without a fresh getter and an oven to bake it out you will never get a good enough vacuum to work.
btw i am in the dayton area.

im in hamilton, so thats not far .

i have a vacuum pump thats used to pull a vacuum on air conditioners. It has its own compressor in it in a way.

If you are closer to buffalo ny i will give you a 21FJP22. my crts have good emission but need cateract work done on them.
ED

I cant do cateract work, I dont know how, nor do I have the supplies to.

Also, im far far from buffalow.


Just to give you a general idea where I live, If you know where cincinatti is, im just 20 miles north of it, the southwest portion of ohio.

I just hope that the dude from daton comes through with those 6 he said he was going to get. Thats the closest guy, and I can have a friend go pick one up, because I still cant drive yet. I just turned 19, and im a half time collage student at ITT tech norwood, so I never hardly have time to get a job, or get a license or anything. Im just getting going on my first step, and most of you know how its like if you been through collage before. That first step is hard, but after awhile, you can get things done and get a job.

Thats my situation, which makes it hard for me to do anything. :(

and heck, im having problems getting to collage now, because moms car broke down, and im in the process of changing the timing belt, and redoing the valves. I still get to collage, but its harder to get me to collage, because my friend that gives me a ride is less dependable.

Mike,

Great find! Don't worry about the CRT... one might pop up for you somewhere else. From your photo, the cabinet looks like it's in pretty decent condition... much better than some of the sets I've found in the past. Also, it will give you something to study in the meantime. You could always pull that chassis and get it cleaned up for the day when you come across a toob for it.

i have a Zenith with that chassis.... different cabinet, though.

tried to return your pm but it locked up the browser?
anyhow the crt donor is still away and likely wont be back till mid march.
cataract surgery is easy if you need help holler.
i go to r&l in hamilton regularly and can stop by.
btw mendelsons has the nichrome wire at the 3rd floor counter.
i use a length of nichrome and a car battery to make a flexible hot knife.

Does he hibernate or something? does he not like the cold?

no problem, i dont like cold either. I dont think anyone does.


In the meantime, Does anyone have the sams to this zenith chassis of mine they could scan me?

That would be really appriciated. Something told me this crt was gone in the first place, because it had a brightner on it, which opened up too.


whats the hot knife for, to get the glue off? I have a hair dryer?

The hot wire or hair dryer are used to delaminate (heat up) the plastic layer that bonds the outer safety glass to the acutal face of the tube. This plastic layer gets funky with age and begins to seperate....that's the cataract you see. I've got a CT16 that needs this same operation, if I ever get my buttocks into gear.

Anthony

And I have not been able to get much net access, till NOW. a new hard drive and new load of XP, and it is up again. Anyway, i see that you have a Zenith 24nc31. I have THREE. I do NOT know the operational condition of them, but they ALL have physically intact CRT's, and good cabinets. I am not far from you, and the TV's are in Middletown, at my old storage garage.

Perhaps, you may be interested in one of them, i would be quite reasonable, as long as I knew the set would go to a good home, and not be "mutilated", or abused,, in some way.

I dont drive. Thats one of my issues. I could get my friend to get it though.


Anyway, I need the CRT. Do you have a tube checker? Also I need a scanned copy of the sams or something, so I can check voltages so we dont ruin a good CRT.


Thanks!!! Email me.

And I have not been able to get much net access, till NOW. a new hard drive and new load of XP, and it is up again. Anyway, i see that you have a Zenith 24nc31. I have THREE. I do NOT know the operational condition of them, but they ALL have physically intact CRT's, and good cabinets. I am not far from you, and the TV's are in Middletown, at my old storage garage.

Perhaps, you may be interested in one of them, i would be quite reasonable, as long as I knew the set would go to a good home, and not be "mutilated", or abused,, in some way.
you mean i cant install a fishtank in one??(just kidding)
i wouldnt mind getting one for my collection.
and if mbates needs one i will have an empty van when i come.i am not in shape to carry these monsters though as my back is giving me crap lately.

I dont drive. Thats one of my issues.


Anyway, I need the CRT. Do you have a tube checker? Also I need a scanned copy of the sams or something, so I can check voltages so we dont ruin a good CRT.


Thanks!!! Email me.
2 things that can damage the crt are excessive hv(shunt regulator not working)
excessive beam current(too bright for long time)
btw i have a b&k 467 tester with all adaptors and a clip lead attachment.

I dont need the TV, I already have the TV. I just need a good CRT.

Because, i just dont have a weak CRT, my CRT is toast. history. I cant even see a picture to even tell if the set works or not.

Anyway, I did notice strong ionization in the tube, blue everywhere, and then the filiments went. but the HV would shut down a couple of times before hand. I had to turn off and back on to get the HV back up again.

I can carry just about anything. I just dont drive, nor have a license to.

Im at collage right now, and that eats most of my time.

I have to get rid of that blasted CRT brightner before I power the set back up again. I avoid those brightners at all costs. My 24yp4 in my silvertone finally gave way. but, it was a good ride. never had a chance to restore the chassis before the picture tube died. some ideot before I had it sprayed tuner cleaner all over it, it seeped into the yoke, made some arcing, and a loud pop and blew a hole in the picture tube, I heard it pffffffffffffst. all vacuum gone. O well, ill find one of those eventually too I guess. I just want to get that color TV going again. This would be my first early color TV other than that GE portacolor I got, that just collects dust. I never use it, i prefer bigger CRTs.

i have 9, and STILL want more, like a pre-1960's set, such as an rca ctc5 or 7. My sets are(IIRC), 3, Zenith, 24nc31's, from 1966, a Zenith 24mc32, from 1965, A Zenith 25mc33, from 1965, an RCA ctc 16, from 1965 an Rca ctc-11, from 1962, And A Zenith 29jc20, frmo 1962,(working) and a Zenith Roundie combo,chassis 25lc20, from 1694, with a hybrid stereo. (working)

Only 3 years ago, I only had the RCA ctc-11. Since then, I have acquired the others.

I DO have a roundie tube, with a VERY bad cataract problem, that would fit your set. I do NOT know how good it is, otherwise.

I'll check some of my sets this week, and maybe the crt, and see what I find out.

Thanks!!

---

@mbates14. Good job :thmbsp: Unfourtnely I camed to late for some old tvs (black and white & color). :thumbsdn: Someone smashed an 1967-68 "Rubin (Rubie)" 401 soviet color tv set (color television was introduce in Europe in 1967). The set looked like this:

Telecolor, if you can, maybe it wouldn't be a bad idea to gather up as many of those "Soviet-era" artifacts as you can. They COULD be very valuable one day. Trabants, I understand, command a pretty good price nowadays. People get nostalgic for some of the strangest things... I don't know if a good clean Dacia would ever make you rich, but you could possibly turn a nice profit on one...-Sandy G.

I need a CRT!!!!! lol.

Mbates14

I have the same chassis as you except without the Z at the end. Mine is in a different cabinet. I can also scan the SAMS I have for it which is SAMS 803 Folder 4.

Ross

Could you scan those for me? Thanks!

Comrades, I would very much greatly like to purchase either a Zil or Zis as I find a pseudo copy of a capitalistic pig Packard built by a Communist country most ironic. Dank you.

Anthony

....I want a Zaporozhets...the Ruskie answer to the Corvair...Hey Anthony,'member a few years back, some dude in Canada was gonna import Zils-the current models that look like stretched "Blues Brothers" 1974 Plymouths-and give them the stretch treatment? Of course the deal fell thru, 'cause there was NO WAY a Soviet car could be made to comply w/Western safety & pollution regs...but interesting cocept, nonetheless.-sandy G.

? What are you talking about ? lol. That came out of nowhere and was way off topic. hehe.

This strange interlude brought to you by message #46

"Lada" is Russian for "Let's get FIAT to build us a giant factory so we can make an obsolete car for 30 years and then screw them on the deal and kick them out of our country"

For those who don't know and probably don't care. Packard sold or gave their pre-war (WWII) body dies to Russia who then built a cobbled up version with a tractor engine for many years. I saw Gorby driving thru San Fran in the late 80's while he was in his 60's Chrysler clone limo. Last I heard, Russia stopped building any of their luxury cars as they couldn't compete against Mercedes etc.

Anthony

? i know nothing of what your talking about.


Im over here in the electronics world right now. lol, get back down from mars and back to the usa. hehe.

Don't laugh at "Z.I.L (Z.I.S.)". I konow a woman who owns a 40 years! old "Z.I.L." refergerator ("Z.I.L." is most known to Romaninans for the refrigerators, not everyone knows that "Z.I.L." manufactured cars) at the refrigerator was never repaird in it's whole life.
By the way, Z.I.L.=Zavod Imeni Lihaciov former Z.I.S.=Zavod Imeni Stalin (Lihaciov was a director at the "Z.I.L." plants).
2 "Z.I.L."-155 buses where used as reportage vans in the '50's (maybe in the '60's too). They where fist used February the 5th, 1957. The fyrst subject of the first reportage made oustide the Romanian (State) Televsion was the French singer Ives Montand (he also was the first singer broadcasted via satelit in 1962!!!)-he had a concert at "Floreasca (today Lucian Grigoresco)" sport hall in Bucharest in that day.
On the pictures "Z.I.S." 155, "Z.I.L." 111 and "Z.I.S." 110.

By the way, the soviet color picture tube where disatrous!!! A guy that I know went to Moscow in the '80's and sow in a shop some Soviet color tvs.
The image wasn't identical at none of the tvs.

@Sabdy G. Have you ever been in Romania?

WHat happened to this thread??!?!?!? we skeeeered off topic abit.

mb, just trying to take your mind off the bad crt! While we are screwing around maybe one will turn up!

Tele-I like that bus!

Car & Driver or somebody had a good article last year about a couple guys in the old Soviet bloc who were building all sorts of cool custom cars. They had this one real smooth looking beast, had a BMW drivetrain or some such, but it was built from a car from Romania or someplace. Sorry, Tele, if this sounds like I'm "dissing" Romania-feel free to make fun of Maryland in return!

mb, just trying to take your mind off the bad crt! While we are screwing around maybe one will turn up!

Bryan is right, Mike. Don't worry bout your pix tube... one will turn up. Have some patience and some faith. In the meantime, clean up the old chassis. You could also change your lytics, then fire it up to see if it's getting audio from the speaker. Lots can be done for now. A tube will surface. :yes:

Telecolor,

Awesome pics! Thanks for showing them. If you have any more, could you post them in the off-topic section?

That 50s Zil limo looks like a 56 Packard in front, and a 56 Chrysler Imperial from the side. The older one looks like Packard mixed with '42 Chrysler!

What are the cars in the background of that 50s limo? The second one looks like a 59 Cadillac mixed with '61 Ford!

I love old Soviet luxury cars... They look like they're from some kind of alternate time-line! (in a good way, lol) If Hollywood was at all creative, they'd use a bunch of those Soviet cars in a time-travel movie.

Could you imagine the stares at cruise night if you rolled up in a Zil limo??? :wtf:

well, anyway. rca2000 might maybe have a good one, he has to check. lets hope he does :thmbsp:

Anyway, I am missing a tube, and I substituded one similar, which is probably the reason I dont have sound. I need the sams, and that one dude is going to scan them for me, which I appriciate that. Well, the reason my mind is still on that tube, is because I browse around, and i see you and a few other people say, I brought home another 21fjp22, or all 3 guns test good, and all of these people finding good CRTs, and im stuck in the cold, unable to get around to find any of this stuff :(

Don't worry, Mike. Two years ago, I didn't even know where to start looking for roundies. Now, they find me instead, and I'm up to my armpits in them! Good thing I use deoderant! :saywhat: :screwy:

You've found #1... before you know it you'll have #2... then 3. Your folks will make you move out before you know it! :yes: They tell you to take all of those wood cabinets and build a house to live in, and fire up the toobs to keep warm! Your day will come, and when it does, you'll be da man! :)

I wouldn't mind sending you one of mine... I think I'll be getting at least a couple more during this week. I'm just afraid of shipping it to you and then it shows up busted after it's journey. That wud really suck! :worried:

ive been there before. Heck, im moving out anyway, thats one of my issues im going to have. This is my #1, and hopefully that stays that way.

Mom drove us into foreclosure, looong story, but anyway, I would enjoy getting this roundie fixed.

the last picture tube someone sent me, it was a 16rp4, and I paid and made the guy go over to staples to have them box and pack it. it arrived, it took me two garbage bags, and an hour of packing penuts to just to get to the pins of the CRT. I knew it made it, and it did.


just get a dryer size box, and heavy rock solid packing, with about 6 inches from the face of the tube to the box, and 6 inches from the box to the CRT pins. :scratch2: :sigh:

@Carmine: the car near the "Z.I.L."-111 is an "Z.I.L."-111G, and the last one is an "G.A.Z."-13 Ceiaka (Seagoul). "G.A.Z."=Gorvski Avtomobilni Zavod (Gorky Automotive Plant). "G.A.Z." manufactured the famous Soviet car M21 Volga.
Let's make a separate theard with old Eastern-Europe things-in the way will let mbates14 to resolve his problems.

Good deal, see you in Off-Topic!

But, it is SNOWING here bad, and at this moment, I can't go anywhere. SO,I will try again tomorrow.

i know. it is here too, oh wait, we in the same county. lol :yes:

And it SEEMS to be pretty good-- all three guns seem to have reasonable emission, asuming this old b and k tester I am using is working right. Of course, I had to "wake up" the tube, after it's long slumber, but now, the guns seem to hold emission , pretty long, after I cut the filaments down, to say 3 or 4 volts.

Remember, the safety glass is going to need to be re-bonded-- something I have not done before, but others on this site have.

ok. I guess a blow dryer for a long period of time will loosen the glue, so I can take the glass off, and sit it back on the tube while I put the tube in the chassis right?

I dont have a pix tube tester/rejuvinator, so im not sure what "pretty good" is. Ive never tested a CRT before, so I dunno. I have a regular tube tester, but not CRT tube tester.

Seems that you didnt have anythign to do at 3:40 in the morning when you posted. hehe. Hows the ice?

Heck, no.

im up here in hamilton ohio.

well, if you could travel to parkersburg west virginia (three hour drive from columbus), i know of a shop that has closed down a long time ago & recently a whole bunch of sets were set out to the front of the building, free to take away. i know that there were at least four "roundies" & two of them had new CRTs installed. i have no room at my house at all for them or i would have grabbed them all. afaik, they are all still there.

It was lucky, that I got anything, when I went over there.or, Are they still there today?

As for those roundies, the 3 Zenith ones, are not there any more, they are in my garage. I hope those are the ones, you talked with new crt's!!

As for those roundies, the 3 Zenith ones, are not there any more, they are in my garage.

Man, you lucky.... Why can't something like this happen close enough to me? <grin> Congratulations, I'm glad to see that these were saved. I'm still hunting a color roundie myself, hopefully something comes along a little bit closer to home. I hope you're going to post pictures of your great score!

-Ian

As I recall, the on/off/volume came through the center of the UHF knob. But then again, I might be having a flashbact to the '60s.

Fixed a few of these as a kid working in a Zenith shop. Wish I was still there :D Seems like times were better. Maybe that why I am buying up Zenith Transoceanic 3000's and Dual 1009 turntables :D Great fun!

Too bad about the roundie. Would like one :yes:

Eric

YAY!! RCA2000 stopped by today, and dropped off a tube.

he said the emissions are strong, so im going to try it when I get some time.

he said that two of the guns test like brand new. and i forget which color, i think it was red, he said was lagging behind a little bit, but still strong. i dont use alot of red anyway.

THANKS RCA!!

Anyway, I need some help, or advice on cateract sergery. The only heat mechanism I have is a blowdryer. Any ideas, or can someone point me to a thread that explains how to do surgery without blowing the tube?

Hey, RCA, and others. The cateract surgery went well.

i took off the mailing tape around the edges, and the only thing that was holding on the safty glass, was teh center, and its not holding it well. so i took my finger, and just peeld it like tape. no heat needed. none.

the stuff turned white. the center looks like the stuff the make hoses out of, and its clear and feels like plastic. like hose material or something. smells like old elmers glue.

So, Im gonna clean off the safty glass and face of tube. and install it into the cabnet.

Its an admiral picture tube. The tube is are FJP and FBP interchangable? the one he got me was an FJP, and I think the one in this one was an FBP, but im not sure. the base is gone, so I dont know.

---

get the glass spotlessly clean along with the crt face.
i use tiny rubber self adhesive feet about 1/4 tall and diameter.
i place 6 at the edge equally spaced to support the safety glass while the silicone cures.
support the tube in a plastic trashcan that will hold it by the funnel but not allow the neck to bottom out.
apply the clear silicone in a bead a tiny bit taller than the bumpers at the outside edge.
carefully place the safety glass without sliding .
this means you get on shot as moving more than say 1/2 in will cause smears that will show outside the bezel.
allow to cure 24 hrs.

ive got it all taken care of, ive started a new thread.

ive posted lots of pictures in anohter thread. I cant post anymore, because my digital camera got stolen. like usual.