View Full Version : 1960 Panasonic
David Roper 04-08-2013, 04:21 PM This set is illustrated (http://panasonic.net/history/corporate/products/inp1960.html) on the Panasonic site's 'corporate history' timeline
http://panasonic.net/history/corporate/products/img/inp1960.jpg
...with a caption that's definitely in error. The model number is given as K21-10 and it is described as a table model with a 21" screen. No way, right? Is it 14" like the early Sears consoles? Anybody know for sure?
Dangler 04-08-2013, 06:40 PM The ad says "Table-type", whatever that means. At any rate, you'd need a sturdy table. Don't know it I'd be able to pick it up!
Sandy G 04-08-2013, 08:19 PM That looks a LOT like what I remember the c. 1964 Sears "Console" color set that my Dad bought was made in Japan & was SO lousy...
old_tv_nut 04-08-2013, 08:41 PM There is no indication that the table set is the 21 inch set mentioned in the text. I think they are two different things, and it's just a case of poor captioning by not including the model number of the table set.
jr_tech 04-08-2013, 10:06 PM TV history shows a similar looking Panasonic set as 17", 1962:
http://www.tvhistory.tv/1962-Japanese-TV-sets5.JPG
jr
David Roper 04-08-2013, 10:11 PM I think they are two different things, and it's just a case of poor captioning by not including the model number of the table set.
That makes sense. I first found the pic through Yahoo Image search, which manages to make the photo caption appear to be part of the text:
old_tv_nut 04-08-2013, 10:20 PM TV history shows a similar looking Panasonic set as 17", 1962:
http://www.tvhistory.tv/1962-Japanese-TV-sets5.JPG
jr
Aha - obviously, the "table model" turned into a "consolette" when screw-on legs were added.
NewVista 04-09-2013, 12:15 AM Big cabinet/small screen = 21" round masked to rectangular (so actually 17")
But they can call it a 21" because there is a 21" (RCA?)(or RCA clone) tube in there?
They say:
"The model used the company's unique 21-inch 70-degree deflecting three-color CRT"
David Roper 04-09-2013, 12:23 AM It's a rectangular tube. Look at the position of the screen; they'd have to cut a hole in the top for the tube to stick out.
Charlie 04-09-2013, 04:43 AM Kinda reminds me of a CT100... small screen with a whole-lotta cabinet.
NewVista 04-09-2013, 09:54 AM If you mask a 21" round (w/ actual 19.5" phosphor) to 4:3, what resultant Diagonal picture would you achieve?
kx250rider 04-09-2013, 11:19 AM Those Sears sets were Toshiba-built, and I bet this Panasonic is a similar design and possibly the same 15" tube (400EDB22 if I recall).
Charles
jr_tech 04-09-2013, 11:20 AM " If you mask a 21" round (w/ actual 19.5" phosphor) to 4:3, what resultant Diagonal picture would you achieve?"
19.5 inches.
jr
Kamakiri 04-09-2013, 11:22 AM ...and looky what's on Craigslist.....
http://philadelphia.craigslist.org/atq/3719097237.html
zenithfan1 04-09-2013, 11:26 AM Wow Tim, I'd love to have that! I've been looking for a Panny like that for as long as I've been into color tv.
Dave A 04-09-2013, 02:53 PM Email sent to seller.
zenithfan1 04-09-2013, 03:20 PM Good luck Dave!
Sandy G 04-09-2013, 04:13 PM Good luck Dave!
Absolutely !! Hope it works out well...
Dave A 04-11-2013, 01:20 AM Nothing yet. Tried another email ad. Did anyone here go for it?
Dave A 04-11-2013, 08:33 PM I got it! My first email is stuck in a network switch somewhere. The second worked this morning. I now have it at home for $90 untested. My thanks to our admin for finding this in my back yard.
The sellers were two old girls moving out. They are the original owners from 1965 or so as they remembered. They bought it in St. Louis and then to Denver and on to Valley Forge, PA where it went to the attic 33 years ago until today. They claimed it was the first Pana color sold in the states. I will let others decide. They also have the paperwork somewhere and will send it when they find it. 17" CRT marked as 490HB22. Cabinet is fine but for a few scratches I can fix. Clearly a tabletop for most markets and screw-in legs to make it a console.
Google does not help much other than a Life magazine ad from early 1967;
http://books.google.com/books?id=XlYEAAAAMBAJ&pg=PA92-IA3&lpg=PA92-IA3&dq=panasonic+ct-66l&source=bl&ots=kRKPZ5tAEM&sig=IG2qXgtUnIediX-yMNteAoU3Nl8&hl=en&sa=X&ei=cVBnUebmDdLh4APoroEQ&ved=0CF0Q6AEwBQ#v=onepage&q=panasonic%20ct-66l&f=false
Same set but the tabletop version.
It is a Panasonic CT-66L which gives me a 1966 clue. The L is probably N. America. The Life ad from early 1967 fits. A trip home in the back seat of the 93 Caddy with the legs off was good. They helped me load it.
The chart shows two filament strings. The first glowed at 50v on the Variac. The second at 80v. Then I got a line at 100v and it stayed a line at 115v. V troubles somewhere. Service switch did its job. The line pic was for a few minutes to take the pic. The bright and contrast controls did their job. Moving the H control would bounce the line. Shut down after that and no damage. I will save the Beltron for later when I see a a picture. There is a cover under the cabinet for chassis service. The fly looks fine. On-off is shot. Line switch used for years.
The CRT is not a 21" type. More modern. The chassis pic shows a convergence coil leaning over. Very old damage and it still ohms out. I will leave it alone and secure it with glue. There are red and blue cutoff switches at the bottom on the convg panel. The line was fine to almost the edge of the screen. Tubes are too odd for my tester. May have to shotgun replacements and I will be back to you for replacements.
Tubes are mostly Matsushita with a few Sylvania replacements. Matsu shows codes of 6F and 6G. Not sure about that coding. The dipole is an aftermarket add-on and in perfect shape. Plastic bezel is a wonderful chemically degraded pale yellow.
Stay tuned.
NewVista 04-12-2013, 06:25 AM crt marked as 490hb22.
= 19"?
zenithfan1 04-12-2013, 07:19 AM Yeah, the Japanese and european sets used a different number system that seemingly makes no sense to me. LOL!
Dave, very glad to see you got it. It looks good too. These are fun because they're so different from our designs. I hope to find one someday.
Sandy G 04-12-2013, 08:02 AM VERY hppy & proud of/for you ! There can't be many of thease Bad Bois still out there...Hope to see Glorious Lollipop Color eminating froim it soon...(grin)
Kamakiri 04-12-2013, 09:01 AM These are fun because they're so different from our designs. I hope to find one someday.
You're braver than I, good sir! To this day, I still won't work on a European tube radio. Fortunately, I've never come across any that actually NEED work :dunno:
dieseljeep 04-12-2013, 09:19 AM I've seen and worked on the very same set, badged as Pennrest, Bradford and Singer.
The antenna on the set is original factory issue.
The last one I worked on, belonged to a neighbor and was a low hours set. It still had a good picture after eighteen years.
A heavy beast for a table model. Some of the tubes are in series, but it is a cold chassis.
dieseljeep 04-12-2013, 09:30 AM [QUOTE=zenithfan1;3066561]Yeah, the Japanese and european sets used a different number system that seemingly makes no sense to me. LOL!
I discussed the European tube numbering system with a radio tech from Holland, that had a repair shop that specialized in German radios.
He explained that it made more sense than the American system. Each letter had a real meaning to it. :yes:
zenithfan1 04-12-2013, 09:36 AM I was looking at the picture of the tube layout, it looks like the one in my CTC11 Abington. It seems to be a bit moth eaten or something, I can see on mine where something was munching on it lol! It's plenty legible though, like yours is.
dieseljeep 04-12-2013, 10:16 AM I was looking at the picture of the tube layout, it looks like the one in my CTC11 Abington. It seems to be a bit moth eaten or something, I can see on mine where something was munching on it lol! It's plenty legible though, like yours is.
Possibly Silverfish damage. Better than a mouse house. :sigh:
zenithfan1 04-12-2013, 10:37 AM You got that right!! It's almost impossible to get rid of that mouse piss smell. I have a set that has a "California car scent" can in it. When it warms up, the room smells like cherries. :D
jr_tech 04-12-2013, 01:42 PM Originally Posted by dave a
"crt marked as 490hb22."
= 19"?
I believe so, in this time frame IIRC, the number represented the exterior diagonal of the CRT bottle in mm, so 490 would be 19.29 inches... likely the screen display diagonal was about 18.5 inches.
Example: an early 12 inch Trinitron CRT was the 330ab22. 330 divided by 25.4 equals 12.99 inches... the screen display diagonal was slightly less than 12 inches.
jr
Dave A 04-12-2013, 05:46 PM The visible area checks in at a fraction under 18". And does anyone have Sams 838-3 they could part with? If not I will hit Kutztown. See you there.
Dave A 04-12-2013, 08:11 PM Diesel,
That may be where I remember this set. The ex's grandparents may have had one of these under one of the badges. The set would have been only 5 years old at the time. Her other grandparents had a Philco barberpole. Where is the Wayback machine?
BigDavesTV 04-12-2013, 08:57 PM Nice looking Panasonic! Cool & compact looking cabinet design, room for cooling air around most of the tubes! I will check tomorrow afternoon to see if I have the Sams, 838-3.
Telecruiser 04-12-2013, 10:27 PM Those Sears sets were Toshiba-built, and I bet this Panasonic is a similar design and possibly the same 15" tube (400EDB22 if I recall).
Charles
Yep. I actually had one of the Sears sets. It was built by Toshiba and had a 15" rectangular tube. As I recall, the chassis was very similar to an RCA CTC-10. Mine worked quite well until the CRT crapped out. As a hungry college student, I transplanted the chassis into a Curtis Mathis cabinet that had a working 21" CRT, but the chassis was toast due to a lightning strike. It worked reasonably well.
I wouldn't be surprised to learn that the Panasonic was very similar to the Toshiba/Sears set. Back in the 1960's, there was a lot of "cross-pollination" in Japanese electronics.
Dave A 04-15-2013, 06:57 PM Some looking at the Sams listings of the era shows my set as 838-3 in late 1966 and the lowest number in the Sams scheme among the Panasonic listings. The rest are 200+ above this set. Not sure what to look for under other brands. Perhaps the first Pana import? The Tom Genova pages are far before mine and probably domestic only.
I'm thinking that the early Toshiba/Sears/others had the 21" delta CRT build via RCA license on smaller CRT's. Mine does not. Panasonic "Just slightly ahead of our time." as they used to advertise.
BigDavesTV 04-15-2013, 09:06 PM Hello, Dave A,
II checked yesterday, and found that I DO have an extra copy of Sams 838-3, for the Panasonic Model CT-66! Send me a PM if you still need it!
Dave A 05-18-2019, 08:41 PM Kicking this back alive as I got back to the set today in porch cleaning. Powered up and still same no vert. Line only. I want to check the crt before I go further. It's acting dim. It is a 490HB22 and I cannot find it nor does my Beltron go near this. If anyone has a pinout I can go there with my adapter clips.
damen 05-18-2019, 08:57 PM Sams tube substitution book shows a 490HB22 crosses to a 19EXP22
dieseljeep 05-19-2019, 11:25 AM Some looking at the Sams listings of the era shows my set as 838-3 in late 1966 and the lowest number in the Sams scheme among the Panasonic listings. The rest are 200+ above this set. Not sure what to look for under other brands. Perhaps the first Pana import? The Tom Genova pages are far before mine and probably domestic only.
I'm thinking that the early Toshiba/Sears/others had the 21" delta CRT build via RCA license on smaller CRT's. Mine does not. Panasonic "Just slightly ahead of our time." as they used to advertise.
I worked on one of those sets in the mid-80's. IIRC, it was badged "Penncrest". They were badged, Singer, Bradford and possibly Arvin.
The tube, valve compliment are European types, seldom used in US products except for some Motorola models.
ESRC has a lot of those tubes for a buck each. :thmbsp:
Telecolor 3007 05-19-2019, 02:58 PM Nice score that 1966 "Panasonic". I think it's extremly rare!
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