A friend of mine is telling me that Admiral was first with their color television. I say it was RCA.

Am I right, or is she wrong?

There might be money riding on this!!

Thanks, guys!!

Almost certainly RCA....

After all, They made the CRT's and licenced out the design to other makers--even in other countries like to Mullard here in UK!

--Having said that, Maybe I'm wrong--what do I know, I live in the UK!

Do you mean "first to market" a CRT type color set ? Westinghouse:
http://www.earlytelevision.org/westinghouse_color.html
RCA was a few weeks later:
http://www.earlytelevision.org/rca_ct-100.html
jr

This lady is insisting that the Admiral came on 12/30/53. I've never heard of this before.

Almost certainly RCA....

After all, They made the CRT's and licenced out the design to other makers--even in other countries like to Mullard here in UK!

--Having said that, Maybe I'm wrong--what do I know, I live in the UK!

I was born 3 years after this event!!

Not sure, but from what I've read, the first color set was CBS (color wheel), but RCA came to market like 2 seconds after with a color CRT set.
It had to have been RCA. I don't think Admiral would have had the money to beat RCA to the market. I could be wrong, but most other color sets of that time-frame were of an RCA design. (licensed from RCA)

There definitely was an advertisement for fuses published around New Years of 1954 that illustrates the Admiral 15" set (an example of a big thing protected by Littlefuse). That's proof that the set had already been designed and at least a pilot production built, but it isn't proof that any had been sold yet.

While RCA played a primary role in developing the CRT and some of the technology for the NTSC color system, they were NOT the first to market with a set.

Zenith claims to have sold the first color TV in the fall or '53, but as NTSC had not yet been approved, and all the other 15" sets they build were not offered for sale, I don't think this counts as first to market.

Admiral announced there set December 31 1953. Here is the announcement (thanks Steve Dichter!)

Subject: Admiral 15" intro
Date: Tuesday, August 2, 2005 10:47 PM
From: Steve Dichter <stevetek@webtv.net>
To: <ereitan@novia.net>
Conversation: Admiral 15" intro

New York Times: Thursday Dec.31, 1953
Page 22, Section L.

"First Admiral Color TV"

Admiral Corporation Introduced yesterday its first color television
receiver. It has a fifteen-inch tube and will retail for $1,175. Also
added to the company's line were several new black-and-white receivers,
including a twenty-one-inch model to list for $179.95. Joe Marty Jr.,
general manager of Admiral's electronics division, said the company
expects to turn out 30,000 color television sets next year.

I am not sure when Admiral actually had set in dealer showrooms for sale, so I am not sure if they can really claim to be "first". Anyone know?

This is quoted from Steve's website

http://community.webtv.net/stevetek/StevesCT100

"... Starting in early 1954 NTSC 15" color receivers were first offered for sale to the public. Westinghouse in Feb. '54, $1200. And RCA Victor's CT-100 in April, 1954, $1000. Other companies soon followed with very limited pilot runs or prototype demonstration units. Sales were dismally low. Few color programs were available. "

So technically RCA was not first. But RCA did produce 200 prototype sets (the Model 5) in the fall for 1953, but they were not marketed to the public.

RCA and Westinghouse were the only ones who produced 15" color sets in any quantity; RCA about 5,000 CT 100s and Westinghouse about 500 H840CK15s.

Not everyone agrees with me, but it is my belief that if you had a fist-full of dollars you could have commercially purchased the Admiral. Or soon thereafter the Westinghouse. Where I insist upon RCA being first, even though production did not begin until late March 1954, is in the true-production quantity argument:

Where millions and millions of b&w sets were manufactured by then, an unknown pilot production run of a few sets, even if it were a few hundred in the case of Westinghouse, does not override the true production run by RCA in Bloomington of over four thousand CT-100's. I believe it is RCA that deserves the credit for producing the first 'production' NTSC color television set.

Pete (and okay, yes I did once work for RCAS.)

Thanks John Folsom for including my posts on Admiral's intro of color tv. And David Roper's mention of the Admiral tie in ad with Littlefuse. I did extensive library research that included back issue newspapers from both coasts. Other than the Admiral Corp. article cited by Folsom. And the tie in ad cited by Roper, I could not find one ad in any of the newspapers I searched that offered that Admiral color set for sale or available to the public. I did find one Jan.'54 ad for a Philco color set demonstration at the Wanamaker Dept. Store in NYC, but conclude that was a prototype set that shows an artist's rendering of a TV set. Taking Pete Deksnis' argument that RCA produced several thousand CT-100's starting in March, 1954 and were available to distributors & dealers by late April,'54 does not trump the fact that the public could could go into a Westinghouse dealer and purchase a color tv in Feb. 1954. There are dept. store. newspaper ads that feature the Westinghouse color set for sale from that date. The very set that is currently the subject of a VK thread. I would have to conclude, IMO, that fact alone makes Westinghouse the 1st color TV available for sale to the public. In fairness, stats show that in the 1st 30 days, only one Westinghouse color set was sold.

-Steve D.

I think that a few field sequential sets were sold to the public. If so, they would beat the Westinghouse.

I've won $3.

I love this site!

Let's go to Biltmore Dairy, you can buy me a chocolate shake ! (grin)

My first boss, Amelio (Mel) Fragassi of Deerfield, Illinois had worked for Admiral during the early days of Admiral's color TV development and production. RCA was very anxious to involve other manufacturers in color TV production. According to what Mel told me, RCA actually lent engineers to Admiral to help Admiral launch its production of color TVs. RCA also sold major components such as CRTs, yokes and convergence yokes. It's my conjecture that Admiral was not the only TV manufacturer so assisted by RCA. The Admiral color sets I am personally familiar with employed the 21AXP22 CRT. I suspect that RCA recruited competing manufacturers during the earlier era of the 15GP22.
The 21" Admirals were unique in that the 21AXP22 CRTs were chassis mounted.

[QUOTE=jr_tech;3062903]Do you mean "first to market" a CRT type color set ?

Steve McVoy,

I guess, technically, holmesuser01 does win the $3.00. Just wish he had answered jr_tech's question quoted above. As to which was the 1st NTSC color receiver marketed to the public? I stand by the Westinghouse or was it the Admiral?? To be continued........Lol.

-Steve D.

I'm sorry guys. I told her that Westinghouse had the sets in their showrooms but didnt sell any. It was the RCA's that started selling, as you all know.

She agreed. She read everything we've posted here.

I hope I haven't caused any more confusion than normal here.

SandyG: I **think** the Biltmore Dairy Bar is still there, but am not sure. I know that TGI Fridays is over there in that building now. Very expensive and touristy. The locals dont go there, much.

Bruce, THAT was where we'd Pester my daddy to take us when we were kids...On the few times we went to Asheville... We DID print the labels for Gerber's Baby Food, & Daddy had to go to Asheville reasonably often...But rarely did we get to go w/him...

No holmesuser01, that is not correct. Westinghouse did sell sets to the public before RCA, but not as many as RCA.

They did sell sets? I believe you, sir, as you know more about them than I do. I was under the impression that Westinghouse had them in dealer showrooms, but didnt sell any.

I have now lost the bet. It's what I get for thinking I know it all. I grew up with RCA reps telling me that RCA invented and sold the first color televisions, and other stuff like this.

Yes, they sold sets, though not many. 20 of them exist today.

I remember reading an article (NY Times?) that mentioned that only a few were sold in the first few weeks. Anyone have that article?

Here is a nice summary by Tom Genova. He says that in the first month of sales only one was sold:

http://www.tvhistory.tv/advertising3.htm

Bruce and Sandy,
The Dairy pops up on the net, so I'm going to do my best to stop by while we are in Asheville next month. If we do I'll file a report.
Phil

I know that years and years ago, Biltmore Dairies, Inc. sold their operations to Pet Dairy, Inc. Before that, we got our milk delivered every week or so, and was left outside the back door in a little metal box. It must have been insulated, somehow, as we never got bad milk.

Hope that the Dairy Bar is still as good as it was when Sandy and I used to go there.

I doubt if there is a factual answer. There are so many definitions for "first on the market"... Just as some might call the Saturn EV-1 the "first electric car on the market" in 199-whenever it was, but one could argue that in the early 1920s, Franklin and others produced electric cars sold to the public too. And the EV-1 was never sold; only leased, so that would default the "first electric car" to the Toyota Rav4-e, which was in fact sold and not loaned or leased to the public. But you had to be in the right place at the right time, and pay up front, and go in a lottery. So was the Rav4-e really "available to the public"? Same goes for color TV. If you had the $$$, I'm sure you could walk into some lab someplace, and buy a color set in mid '53, but if you were a householder and wanted to go into a dept. store and have a new color TV delivered that week, you probably had to wait for the CT-100 in 3/54.

Charles

[QUOTE=holmesuser01;3063004]I know that years and years ago, Biltmore Dairies, Inc. sold their operations to Pet Dairy, Inc. Before that, we got our milk delivered every week or so, and was left outside the back door in a little metal box. It must have been insulated, somehow, as we never got bad milk.

When we had milk delivered to the house, it was three time a week. Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday. The milkman also collected the money on Saturday.
Other dairies followed a slightly different schedule.

We had one of those little galvanised metal boxes outside our back door. too...Pet Milk Dairy. Seems like that lasted up til at least about '71 or so, when I went off to McCallie...We had the local dry cleaners', but the "Good" one was from Kingsport, the guy came 'round once a week...Funny how you remember this stuff...Biltmore Dairybar was REAL impressive place over in Asheville, sort of colonial style bldg, w/a 2,3 story picture window....Well, it was impressive to a little kid, anyway...And IIRC,it was fairly close to Biltmore estate, hence the name, I guess. If any of you ever get the chance to go to Asheville, you simply MUST see Biltmore House & Gardens...No radio or TV stuff, but it has a "Wow !" factor of about 15 on a 1-10 scale...When Mr Vanderbilt looked off this back portico, EVERYTHING he saw was HIS...They later made most of the Pisgah National Forest out of that part of the estate...The house was built in 1895, yet had electricity, & quite a few of what we'd consider modern conveniences...It takes the better part of a morning-or afternoon-to go thru...If you get the guided tour. They can have 2500 people going thru, & you WON'T feel crowded. It is obviously a major tourist attraction, yet it does NOT feel "Cheap" or "Touristy". It is still owned by the family, & is a fairly major local employer, & is EXQUISITLEY maintained.

We had one of those little galvanised metal boxes outside our back door. too...Pet Milk Dairy. Seems like that lasted up til at least about '71 or so, when I went off to McCallie...We had the local dry cleaners', but the "Good" one was from Kingsport, the guy came 'round once a week...Funny how you remember this stuff...Biltmore Dairybar was REAL impressive place over in Asheville, sort of colonial style bldg, w/a 2,3 story picture window....Well, it was impressive to a little kid, anyway...And IIRC,it was fairly close to Biltmore estate, hence the name, I guess. If any of you ever get the chance to go to Asheville, you simply MUST see Biltmore House & Gardens...No radio or TV stuff, but it has a "Wow !" factor of about 15 on a 1-10 scale...When Mr Vanderbilt looked off this back portico, EVERYTHING he saw was HIS...They later made most of the Pisgah National Forest out of that part of the estate...The house was built in 1895, yet had electricity, & quite a few of what we'd consider modern conveniences...It takes the better part of a morning-or afternoon-to go thru...If you get the guided tour. They can have 2500 people going thru, & you WON'T feel crowded. It is obviously a major tourist attraction, yet it does NOT feel "Cheap" or "Touristy". It is still owned by the family, & is a fairly major local employer, & is EXQUISITLEY maintained.

Also had central heat in that monster house Now, it's set up for wood heat, oil heat (a huge Iron Fireman -branded furnace,) and natural gas. I would advise the guided tour. The main buss lines that feed power between the floors of the house are totally original solid bars of copper in trenches. I also got to see the original generator distribution system, not working, and the site of the first Carrier air conditioning system in the sub basement. There is work going on there every day. Not a speck of dust anywhere, either.

I live, as the crow flies, about one and a half miles from the Biltmore House to the west. From close to my own house, with binoculars, I can see the big back patio of the home.

Used to call my house, Biltmore House West. My dad called my house, Biltmore House Worst. :thmbsp:

Since this thread is already pretty far off topic, I have a question... Every time is see "Asheville", an old folk song starts running through my head about Asheville Junction and the Swannanoa Tunnel. Is this the same Asheville? is the tunnel still "all caved in"? does any of this make any sense?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4v-UuePEvgw

thanks,
jr

Edit add: Hoyt Axton version, with tunnel pix: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mS8iPHLz-SA

Well, Swannanoa is near this Asheville, along the railroad line to the east. The line is open to Old Fort, NC at the bottom of the mountain range, and continues on towards Winston-Salem, and points east, so the tunnel must have been reopened at some point.

Maybe we can drag this back on topic kicking and screaming, somehow?

Well, we could start talkin' about WLOS...THEY had color kinda early on, as well as I remember....We had 'em on our Cable TV system, & they had network color as far back as at least '64...Even Mr Bill was in color...This is SORTA back on topic...Moreso than talkin' about Biltmore..You prolly don't appreciate Biltmore, growin' up w/it being right there & all, but I grew up hearin' "The Sight to see in Asheville, Is Biltmore House & Gardens..." Never got to see it til I was grown up..

Well, we could start talkin' about WLOS...THEY had color kinda early on, as well as I remember....We had 'em on our Cable TV system, & they had network color as far back as at least '64...Even Mr Bill was in color...This is SORTA back on topic...Moreso than talkin' about Biltmore..You prolly don't appreciate Biltmore, growin' up w/it being right there & all, but I grew up hearin' "The Sight to see in Asheville, Is Biltmore House & Gardens..." Never got to see it til I was grown up..

I've toured the house twice. I did audio-visual work up there for many years, and got to know alot of the behind the scenes people there. It is a beautiful home. Mr Vanderbilt had all the forests planted allover the ranges to the mountains, as this was all well-used up pasture land, for the most part.

WLOS got a new color film chain around 1964, when they started running the individual Hanna Barbera cartoons on Mr. Bill's show. Before that, they played black and white prints of the color Warner Bros. Cartoons, Storybook cartoons, and The Stooges. Wonderful time in our lives, getting to see all these great old cartoons before we were off to school!!!