A friend just dropped off these three sets he picked up in Indiana for $75.

The RCA console has a KCS-47A chassis and 16GP4
The middle set is a 10" Westinghouse H-196. I think it has a couple RCA knobs stuck on it.
I figure it's gonna be tough to find a full set of correct knobs for it :(

Finally, a 12" Sonora 302 on the right. It also has no knobs.

All the sets are rough and the condition of the CRTs is unknown.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7252/7580131044_6f7a41cfdf_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/7580131044/)

Here are some more photos of the Sonora. I'll investigate further tomorrow when I have some daylight.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8003/7580134844_ae120f82c3_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/7580134844/) http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8293/7580132718_ac18e14b65_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/7580132718/)

And here's the back of the H-196.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8164/7580133726_fe1068c083_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/7580133726/)

Neat old sets-
Are you fixing them for your friend, or are they yours now?

They're mine now for better or worse. I'm not sure what I'll do with the RCA, but I will try to restore the other two. The Sonora is especially interesting.

Here's the Sams schematic: http://www.earlytelevision.org/images/97A-13-Sonora-302-303-Sams.pdf
I also found it in Riders vol 5 which has a little more info including alignment instructions.

I've got that same Sonora, a pretty decent performer with an oddball variable tuner.

Great, I was hoping someone else had a Sonora. I haven't been able to find very much info online and no pictures at all. Do you have any pics of your set ?

I'm especially curious about the knobs and the speaker which I think is missing from mine.

Sharp tvs i like them all

Me Likey !

For what it's worth, I think that the cost of them is what our hobby costs us. Whether we restore them or not, in today's $$$s, $75.00 isn't a lot of dough. I often buys stuff just to mess about with it and never, never feel that I am even breaking even. I often strive for good cosmetics first because that is what is so hard to find. (except COLOR television flybacks which are scarce ;)) etc. Think that they were $25 each and surely, there are at least parts worth that much...

Here's a picture I snagged off eBay a while back.

I'll get you some more detailed pictures of the knobs later.

Y'know, what DIFFERENCE does it really make what this stuff costs ? It gives so many of us PLEASURE to restore & keep these old sets- & how can you put a price on that ? Plus, if you believe as I do, that we really don't "Own" these sets, but are merely "Stewards" of them for awhile, we should to the best we can to keep them in tip-top shape...The good folks in the year 2525 will prolly thank us...Assuming we're not back to living in caves by then...

Here's a picture I snagged off eBay a while back.

I'll get you some more detailed pictures of the knobs later.

Thanks for the picture. There was a little bag of knobs stuck in the back of one sets with a couple of those knobs I think.

A friend also found some Sonora photos on this neat website (http://www.lopatka.net/oldendays/index.htm).

http://www.lopatka.net/Missing/oldendays/bw0013.jpg http://www.lopatka.net/oldendays/greg-TV_small1.JPG (http://www.lopatka.net/Missing/oldendays/greg-TV.JPG)

I tried in vain to figure out which episode of What's My Line that is in the color picture. It's from 1955 or 6 anyway.

I like the nifty antenna and Numechron clock :yes:

I went out to the garage and took a closer look at the knobs.
It appears that I do have three of the Sonora knobs. The channel plate is gone though.
I figure that will be impossible to find, but maybe I can replicate one :scratch2:
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8286/7585095082_c7521f9641_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/7585095082/)

The Westinghouse channel plate is present but very worn.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7269/7585094814_317fcaae93_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/7585094814/)

Here are the rest of the knobs. Looks like RCA and one random knob.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7123/7585095454_fb969db56d_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/7585095454/)

The channel plate is actually a rotating part and a rather odd one at that. here's a pic or two.

Here's a couple of the Westinghouse.

The small knobs are especially difficult since there are two different shaft sizes on this set, also it's nearly impossible to find two the exact same color.

I believe this swirled reddish brown is correct for mine since the channel selector is the same color.

The rear knobs are a little easier, they come in two types though, Reverse painted Plastic and real Brass over Plastic.
The real brass ones look a lot better.

Thanks. I'll keep my eyes out for them, but I expect it won't be easy.

I brought the Sonora inside for a closer look.
It's one weird set for sure. Continuous tuner using variable capacitors and a voltage doubler for the HV.
A 12LP4 only needs 11 KV so I don't see why they bothered with a doubler.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7138/7587524350_afd918945a_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/7587524350/) http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8292/7587523564_d38032ac51_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/7587523564/)

It looks to be in very good original condition.
I sure hope that flyback is good.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8016/7587521892_a93f2bd62c_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/7587521892/) http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8004/7587522730_6a6bf4dfa2_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/7587522730/)

The cabinet is pretty cheap, but in OK condition.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7266/7587586008_c4a007a8bd_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/7587586008/) http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7250/7587586682_1be4650c37_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/7587586682/)



Just one big problem so far. The NU-Video 12LP4A has excellent emissions, but a stubborn G1 short. I've tried blasting it a few times with my CR70 to no avail.
I'll let it go for now and try again another day.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8017/7587524786_c89fec2588_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/7587524786/)

Now as for the Westinghouse, it's really well built. At least the chassis is anyways - the cabinet is a little flimsy.

The 10BP4 showed an H-K short at first but it seemed to clear itself out and has excellent emissions and life test now :)

I also found another Sonora knob hiding inside.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8148/7587763042_9f753504cf_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/7587763042/) http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7115/7587762254_30131c61f1_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/7587762254/)

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8025/7587760642_11b7c75a19_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/7587760642/) http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8158/7587763978_7b49dc9671_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/7587763978/)

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7112/7587761422_7f8a15202b_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/7587761422/) http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8157/7587759722_19f7c8058e_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/7587759722/)

Bob,

The Sonora has filter and bypass caps that just SNAP into a holder!!! Wow Now that makes recapping and restuffing unbelievably EASY!

Nice sets, I really like that Westy!

Another series of videos will be forthcoming I am sure.

Keep up that good work!

Matt

The rubber corner mounts on that Westy may indicate that Philco built the chassis, though it appears to be unique to that set.

We know from Phils experience that at least one Westinghouse has an actual Philco chassis inside.

I had my H196 a long time before I realized the lower front trim pulls off to access the adjustments!

By the way, the schematic for the Sonora is posted at the ETF Site.
http://www.earlytelevision.org/images/97A-13-Sonora-302-303-Sams.pdf

It's only the schematic but that's all Sams has for it.

Yes, I recorded some video while poking around these sets.

Thanks for the link. I also found the Sonora in Riders Vol 5. Four pages of info including a parts list and alignment instructions :)

I was thinking Philco too as soon as I noticed the rubber mounts and perforated chassis.

That's interesting that the Sonora uses 1V2 for HV rectifiers. I thought those were only used in color TV as the focus rectifier. The schematic is really easy to read too

BTW the building that Westinghouse had in Sunbury later manufactured Celotex insulation.

That's interesting that the Sonora uses 1V2 for HV rectifiers. I thought those were only used in color TV as the focus rectifier. The schematic is really easy to read too

BTW the building that Westinghouse had in Sunbury later manufactured Celotex insulation.

I think my 12 inch Westinghouse set uses the 1V2 as a high voltage rectifier...

Am I seeing things or does that Westinghouse have 27 tubes? :scratch2: Far out that is a lot for a mono set! Impressive :D

I think my 12 inch Westinghouse set uses the 1V2 as a high voltage rectifier...

The 1V2 can only take around 7,000 volts so it must be using a doubler too.

Am I seeing things or does that Westinghouse have 27 tubes? :scratch2: Far out that is a lot for a mono set! Impressive :D

Yep, 27 tubes and 260 watts :)

27 tubes and 260 watts perfect for making this summer more enjoyable! Now you just need an RCA TK-30 camera chain to go with it :)
Matt

No kidding. I just survived another round out in the baking garage and brought the RCA guts inside.
The 16GP4 immediately had excellent emissions, no shorts and rock solid life test :D I dig the bright red coating - do not touch!
The chassis looks OK too.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7127/7599603538_c9cc1c119d_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/7599603538/)

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8157/7599638190_50477da8a3_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/7599638190/)

You've been getting some neat sets lately, I look forward to seeing 'em running. The bright red paint indicates that 16GP4 is a rebuild. Are you gonna restore the RCA too?

You've been getting some neat sets lately, I look forward to seeing 'em running. The bright red paint indicates that 16GP4 is a rebuild. Are you gonna restore the RCA too?

Thanks for the info. I hate to admit it, but I do plan on parting out the RCA. The cabinet is really beat up and stinks :yuck:

If someone would like it, feel free to contact me. I won't be holding on to it for long.

We know from Phils experience that at least one Westinghouse has an actual Philco chassis inside.Yah, my Westinghouse H-181 is a rebadged Philco 48-1001. The Philco number is rubber-stamped on the back of the chassis.

http://antiqueradio.org/art/WestinghouseH-181ChassisBack.jpg

Phil Nelson
Phil's Old Radios
http://antiqueradio.org/index.html

Bob, do you or anyone else know if a 16GP4 can sub for a 16AP4? I know the 16AP4 is longer so maybe not. If it will, I'd be interested in that tube.

The deflection angles are different so I think you'd need to modify the yoke.

16GP4=70 degrees
16AP4=53 degrees

I went knob hunting and came up with just a few. Oddly, I found the channel knob for the H-196, but only one of the cheap plastic knobs and nothing else.

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8423/7611809820_620f1fea98_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/7611809820/)

There was/is a guy Over Yonder, Mike Koste, "Gobs of Knobs", who claimed to have a LOT of knobs...Never have used him, though.

Sadly Mike dumped most his TV stock a while back. Julie (Radiopup over at ARF) has some TV knobs.

Not anymore. She sent most of them to me a few months ago. There were very few 40s or 50s knobs in the mix though.

I never heard back from Mike about a tv a year or so ago, If he dumped his knobs, i may have to dump the tv... :(

SR

i have a westinghouse like that one ,besides white paint someone got on the tuner knob its in pretty good shape.

Nice sets! I wonder what the "DX" above the picture tube means ? Deluxe, distance ? Mine doesn't have it.

Nice sets! I wonder what the "DX" above the picture tube means ? Deluxe, distance ? Mine doesn't have it.

Interesting the snelsons set had a double D screen mask while your set and mine have a rectangular mask.

My set has the DX, but I noticed that particular part of the mask is painted on the front of the glass and not on the inside, it would be possible to scrape it all off without touching the Westinghouse logo which is painted on the inside.

The painted area on the front of my sets glass is somewhat deteriorated, I bet yours was too and someone just cleaned it all off.


From Wiki: "DXing is the hobby of receiving and identifying distant radio or television signals"

I'm guessing the DX on these sets was to indicate it had good long distance reception, something all the Hams at the time would have known.

Give me a few days and I will take a look in my old knob stock. I think I have some Westinghouse knobs, just not sure if they are for that old a model.

Interesting the snelsons set had a double D screen mask while your set and mine have a rectangular mask.

My set has the DX, but I noticed that particular part of the mask is painted on the front of the glass and not on the inside, it would be possible to scrape it all off without touching the Westinghouse logo which is painted on the inside.

The painted area on the front of my sets glass is somewhat deteriorated, I bet yours was too and someone just cleaned it all off.


From Wiki: "DXing is the hobby of receiving and identifying distant radio or television signals"

I'm guessing the DX on these sets was to indicate it had good long distance reception, something all the Hams at the time would have known.

Interesting. I hadn't noticed the double D screen
I don't see any trace of a DX on my set, but I bet you're right.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8001/7613178962_7a591e3998_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/7613178962/)


Here's the back of the chassis. I don't see any Philco markings.
Could this be the 9,740th set produced ?
Does anyone know what the extra blocking is for on the left side ? Antenna terminals ?
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7278/7613171302_835498952a_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/7613171302/)


Give me a few days and I will take a look in my old knob stock. I think I have some Westinghouse knobs, just not sure if they are for that old a model.

Thanks!

I spent a few hours digging through knobs at the ARCI swapfest today and found a few :D There might well have been other good knobs, but the heat was really getting to me :drool:
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8146/7707142514_8d35ef3eab_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/7707142514/)

I'm not sure these are the right inner knobs, but they match the channel knob and fit well.
It seems the 2nd knob from the right has a slightly larger shaft than the three to the left :scratch2:

I can probably enlarge one I picked up today which just leaves the fine tuning knob.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8003/7707141986_8379b0c531_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/7707141986/)

I also scored the faux dual knob for the power/volume control on the Sonora :)
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7280/7707143058_4c1eb6c346_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/7707143058/)

I really don't need the Philco, GE or Motorola knobs on the right so let me know if you do.

I never, ever, ever thought I would find that weird Sonora channel plate but there it was just sitting on ebay for $7.95 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/221218642840?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2648)

The same seller had some nice looking Gee-Lar NOS knobs that I think will look nice on the Sonora too.

I never would have even known what it looks like if it hadn't been for Eric's help :thmbsp:

They just arrived in the mail today :banana:
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7409/8716465528_df979d894c_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8716465528/)

HI All;
If I remember correctly, from my reading Sonora had a Television Repair School.. Possibly based in Chicago..
THANK YOU Marty

That's an amazing find.
I think I saw that channel plate on eBay, it didn't click in my head what it was for or that someone needed it, glad you found it.
Those NOS knobs look like exact replacements?

These sets seem fairly uncommon today but they must have been somewhat popular back in the day.

The boxes say they're radio knobs and they're not all quite the same size or shaft type, but some did fit. I think I have seen other non-Sonora tv/radio sets that use similar looking knobs.

Anyway, between the old knobs I dug up before and these new ones, I have a complete set :D That power/volume on the far left will look better after a good cleaning.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7444/8716890892_d875b7ae3a_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/70039806@N00/8716890892/)