Picked up a pretty big Philco roundie yesterday from an ad in the local paper, along with a blonde retro styled Motorola B&W console on legs. It's still in (the wife's) SUV. It's complete and looks to be in pretty nice shape, chassis is spotless! :D

What I'm a gonna do with this stuff, I dunno LOL!

Pics to come when I get it unloaded later tonight. Got them very reasonably ;)

Here's pic #1 of an ugly Motorola that once was beautiful :(

Yes, that'd be dirt on the screen.....

Now here's the Philco roundie. My neighbor helped me carry it inside, and for the heck of it we plugged it in. Can you believe the damn thing works? :yippy:

It needs a little height adjustment, but everything else seems AOK. Needs a LOT of cleaning, of course.....

The only thing that's left to question about the Philco is a hot, burning smell.....had it running for about 15 mins. No smoke, but I'm concerned that the flyback might be getting toasty warm. I plan to clean off all the tubes, they're pretty dirty now that I look at them, but is there a safe way of touching the flyback to feel temp without getting zapped? Should I discharge the picture tube and then just feel it?

Picture is on the dim side, so this weekend I plan to test the tube and maybe throw it on activate and let it cook for a couple hours.

Boy I'll tell ya....there's just something magical about watching color on a roundie! :D

After you have let the set on for a while, turn it off and feel the flyback compartment door. Compare the heat level with a similar test on known good sets. I have found that I can detect flyback overheating by just feeling the door. It will probably be a good idea to check horiz. output cathode current and adjust effeciency coil if needed, if overheating is suspected.

Nice Philco roundie!!!! I like the looks of the Motorola as well. The smell could just be all the dirt and stuff if it sat a long time. Never touch a flyback when the set is on!!!! When I get an old set I just clean it up, check all the tubes and replace the bad ones, and do all the adjusting I need and hope for the best! I can't solder worth a crap, so I never get into the set "too much". I just look for ones that don't take alot to get going. Do you have a high voltage probe? That would be a good way to check the output. If memory serves me the roundies were at 21K and the old tube square screens were at 25K. Good Luck!!!

Let me tell you all I'm thrilled to pieces. Yeah right :pistols: :wtf: Like we need more TV's in this house. Theres no room to put them. :bash:

Rather have audio receivers take up less room. :)

I think the honeymoon's over:rolleyes:

The basement is my domain....I will fill it up with whatever I want :D

ok :(

How about that? I got "I Love Lucy" on the screen of the Motorola tonight! :yippy:

You spelled Mrs. Kam...wrong!!!!!

haha gary. I know, but I didnt want to tell him.

:lmao: :lmao: :lmao:

guess no :smsex: for Tim. LOL

Tim,

I like the Motorola! It's so "Eames Era", so "Panton", so "Fred Sanford" :D


Is it all there, is there any hope for it?

It is all there, and it just might clean up well. I have the face glass and the brackets not shown in the photo. Powered it up for the heck of it, and no HV....big surprise. Chassis is clean though, so who knows, it might live once again :)

Originally posted by Kamakiri
How about that? I got "I Love Lucy" on the screen of the Motorola tonight! :yippy:

You cheating DOG! I call dibs on your sets after the divorce!

Anthony

Tim,

those sets are great! That Motorola is like one i saw on ebay this week...

http://cgi.aol.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3279692360&category=3638

That Philco knob arrangement sure does look familiar! Especially with the missing door. I looks like it may be a similar model to the Philco roundie hybrid I have. Actually, they look pretty damn close. Did you happen to look at the chassis number, or any date codes?

Looks like they might be related

Originally posted by heathkit tv
You cheating DOG! I call dibs on your sets after the divorce!

Anthony

:D

:lmao: :lmao: :lmao:

If I haven't left him by now, I never will. Ya kinda learn to live with all the changes here. Makes life interesting.

They sure do look like twin brothers of different mothers :)

I do have the control door for mine, the guy called me back about 20 mins after I left his house saying that he'd found it. I was lucky I mentioned about it! The control door is the thing that's sitting atop the set.

I'll get all of the codes and post them when I get chance.

I like the little guy sitting behind the roundie w/the control knobs on top.-Sandy G.

That's my old reliable RCA portable. Had that set since '89, only ever replaced a damper and a horizontal output tube since then, used it during the gulf war at work, during 9/11 at work, and countless times in between :)

Flyback seems to be cool as a cuke :)

Next thing this set needs is a convergence setup. How about one of you more experienced guys do a thread on Convergence 101? :) I'm sure a lot of dummies like me could use it :)

That is one area I sucked at!!! I remember my uncle (the tv tech) used to cuss when he had to do a "roundie" The main thing I remember is that you should be able to do most if not all of the touch up from the controls on the neck of the tube. It was a rare occasion when he had to use the controls on the board. Also you don't want to mess around with those too much or one can really throw things out of whack. Just make sure you have a large mirror and a good cross-hatch generator!!! Good Luck!

Tim,

If you have the instructions from a book or service manual, it's usually pretty cut and dry. Of course, reading instructions and doing what it says with good results are two different things! And usually it takes more than one try at it.

Do you have any convergence instructions with you?

No such luck.....I mean the convergence isn't horrible, but I do get a green shadow on some white things.

Here's a screenshot :)

another....activating the picture tube sure helped brightness :)

You can see what I'm talking about here....

Kam, I'd be inclined to agree with the person who said the burning smell in the HV cage near the flyback might be simply accumulated dust and dirt--this is common in TVs that are left sitting in basements, garages, etc. for extended periods of time. If the picture looks good, just dim, I wouldn't be concerned about the flyback. Since you say there is no smoke, just the smell, I'd suspect dust/dirt in the cage first. Clean it out thoroughly, then try it again. If you still smell something hot in there, then and only then should the flyback be suspected of being defective. Again, however, if you are getting a raster, the flyback is probably good. If the fly were shorted, it would kill the HV dead away (the HV fuse in the cage would blow immediately as well).

As to the dim picture, that could be caused by a weak horizontal oscillator or output tube, low drive on the grid of the latter, or even a weak CRT. If the set has a number of years on it (since it's a roundie it probably dates back to the early '60s), the CRT could well be on its last legs--especially if the set's former owner used it many hours a day.

Good luck. That Philco looks like a great set; it should work very well once it is cleaned up and restored. The original Philco Corporation made some excellent b&w and color TVs, both television alone and those fabulous 3-way theatre consoles. I had a 19" Philco portable from 1961, trash day find in my hometown over 30 years ago, that worked great as long as I had it, and I have known several people who owned Philcos in the '60s and had very good luck with them.

Kind regards,

This set is a Model Q5528WA, chassis no 17MT803. On top of the flyback cage is 3 44 67 (I assume this is a '67 model?). Any other dates I should look for?

I assumed that's what the smell was....I'm used to the hot dusty smell of an old TV strored for years, but this was almost acrid. Ran it for an hour today and the smell is gone, so I'm not gonna worry about it.

Upon testing, the picture tube showed dead, but after letting the filaments cook at 8.3v for about 15 minutes, it came back about 1/3 of the way into the green. Think I might let it bake a little more tonight and see what happens.

Here are some convergence instructions... perhaps they will help you. You'll first need to start out making the adjustments on the neck of the crt, then follow these. hope it's helpful.

If only I had a crosshatch generator.....

Can someone make a videotape of one for me? :)

.

Keep in mind that you will probably need to repeat the steps a couple of times. even if you dont have a crosshatch, you should be able to get some improvement as long as you have a still image to work with.

Also, if your picture looks dim, doing a convergence job might help brighten it a little since the beams will now be pointing in the right places. Seems I remember a good bit of difference in the brightness of one of my sets after performing a convergence tune up.

...

Yes, that's right, March 44th 1967 :D or more likely the 44th week of 1967 which would probably actually be a 68 model ?

The acrid smell was probably Mouse pee burning off :puke:


Originally posted by Kamakiri
On top of the flyback cage is 3 44 67 (I assume this is a '67 model?).

I assumed that's what the smell was....I'm used to the hot dusty smell of an old TV strored for years, but this was almost acrid. Ran it for an hour today and the smell is gone, so I'm not gonna worry about it.

Upon testing, the picture tube showed dead, but after letting the filaments cook at 8.3v for about 15 minutes, it came back about 1/3 of the way into the green. Think I might let it bake a little more tonight and see what happens.

My philco had date codes on the rear cover of the yoke... seems I remember they were from 68. The original Philco tubes had 68 date codes, and seems I remember dates on the degaussing coil assembly.

Other than the UHF tuner, is the set all tubes?

It is all tubes, although I didn't count them....doesn't seem like there are that many.....I'll take a chassis shot when I get to this next step :D

I bought an RCA WR64B dot/bar/crosshatch generator off eBay, but much to my surprise, it has clips for each color gun rather than going into the antenna, and a thicker gray bare wire. Have to figure out how to use this thing, is anyone familiar with this unit?

I use that same model RCA color bar generator. I never use the individual gun controls however. The gray wire sounds like the one that should go to the antenna terminals. I believe it is a shielded wire. There should be a small resistor network (using 120 ohm resistors if I remember correctly) at the end with three wire clips coming out of it, two for the antenna and one for chassis ground. I can send you a photocopy of the manual and schematic if someone else doesn't post with the info before I get home tonight.

Steve

...

Hey Tim,
Nice find. I have this same model in amost mint condition. And Steve K. is 100% correct. The wires with the red clips go to the antenna terminals and the black insulator cable clips on to the chassis as ground. I also have the eariler model WR-64A which doesn't have the seprate color clips. However, this unit, which I bought off of e-bay is totally mint in the original RCA box. It has the manual, warrenty card and has never been used. Even the cable bracket, unattached is wrapped in its original
paper. The unit will perform well but may not be as stable as newer solid state models.

Heathkit offered color bar/pattern generators....you see them on eBay all the time.

Anthony

Thanks for all the advice and help guys :)

I paid a whopping $5 plus shipping for this unit from eBay, and got this WR70 thrown in for $3 :)

Here is the schematic for the leads that go to the antenna terminals. The resistor network was housed in a small plastic housing with three clip wires coming out of one end. The wire in the schematic that goes to the top is just the one that clips onto the chassis.

Steve

I may go and pick up those resistors tomorrow, but here's my situation....

The kids may be asleep soon, the wife may be occupied doing some work, and I may have chance to hook this thing up tonight as everyone, myself included, is getting over a horrible flu.

If I were to use the seperate leads to the color guns, where do you plug them in?

The leads to the color guns go to the red, blue and green screen grids. The clips clip onto the wires going to the crt socket. Each clip has a small point between the jaws that puncture the insulation of the wire.

Steve

Sorry for the questions, I just want to get this right.....

The wires on the CRT plug, not the yoke, correct? Do you know which wires those might be exactly? And, where does the black wire go?

NOT the yoke! The black clip goes to chassis ground. The screen grids are crt pin numbers 3(red), 7(green), and 11(blue) on a 21 inch tube. The colors of the wires from the socket depends on manufacturer. Personally I never found these switches to be too useful, in fact I never use them.

Steve

Okay, we're rolling :)

I can switch the color guns on and off, but can't seem to get a pattern. What's next? :)

Tim,

You understand the three leads to kill the individual color guns are a separate function from the pattern generator. You must also attach the other clips to the antenna terminals and the other ground cable to the chassis as mentioned in the previous post. Also this is a very old generator and may not be functioning properly. Hope this helps.
The other Steve

Tim:

Try it on either channel 3 or channel 4, it should produce a pattern on one or the other. Set it to color bars first. Sometimes the dot pattern does not show up if the fine tuning is a little off. If that doesn't work you may have to open up the generator and test tubes in it. To take it apart you will need to remove the two screws on the bottom of the front bezel and gently pry it off. Once that is off there are about 14 screws to take off the front panel. I think that RCA wanted to make sure that the front panel never suddenly flew off during operation! You may be able to access the tubes by removing a panel on the back of the unit but I usually recap these units anyway.

I think that Andy was correct about the convergence. Using a broadcast or if you have cable, tune to a local access program that shows a community calendar (lettering), turn off the color and adjust the blue lateral magnet on the neck of the CRT until the blue edges disappear near the center of the picture. That should fix a lot of your convergence problems.

Steve

I've got one of these RCA pattern generators...have modulation but there is no pattern. Maybe needs caps replaced...I've not torn into it. I saw a portion of the schematic...anyway someone could post the whole thing, maybe in the picture gallery?

The round sets are easier to get good covergence on, just using the lettering from a community calendar or DVD menu, than the rectangular sets. Somehow the round sets are more forgiving with the adjustments. Like Steve said I would start with the blue lateral and the 3 center convergence red/green/blue magnets, often they can snap it back into good convergence.

Also make sure the purity/degaussing, vertical height/vertical linearity/vertical centering and the horizontal centering are set up to produce the best purity and best proportioned picture on the screen...all of these settings, if off, can aggravate misconvergence.

Also do not do any of the convergence/purity/degaussing in a remote location, do it only in the set's final position. If you can't get behind the set in its final location, move the set out in a straight line only. The round sets, especially those without built-in degaussing, are very sensitive to changes in the earth's magnetic field caused by moving the set...even turning the set side to side can cause purity problems.

They can be useful for setting the purity, you can kill whatever gun you want without disturbing the greyscale.

Originally posted by Steve K
Personally I never found these switches to be too useful, in fact I never use them.

Steve

So tomorrow I'll grab the resistors......got too busy screwing with a tube amp this afternoon :)

How well will 150 ohm work, as opposed to 120? It's all Rat Shack had.....

Tim:

Those resistors should work fine. In fact, you could test the generator by connecting the shielded wire to the antenna terminals without the resistors.

Well, perhaps this thing doesn't work....what are the odds of that? :p:

I'll check the tubes and have at it tomorrow. BTW, here's a temporary rigged up version of that schematic :)

One shorted tube. Brother can you spare a 12AZ7? :p:

Tim:

I'm not sure if I have any 12AZ7s but I think that you should be able to find one a lot closer than California! BTW, in the picture of the resitor network that you made I see something taped with black friction tape. It looks like an antenna transformer. You might want to take that off before you connect the generator. It wouldn't harm anything other than perhaps the image on the screen.

Steve

You might try a 12AX7 or 12AT7, 12AY7, etc. just for testing purposes, I think they all have pretty much the same pinout as the 12AZ7...

Direct sub is a 12AT7, also a 12AU7.


Chuck

If a 12AU7 will work, then I'm set. Back at it this evening :)

Getting better, now I think it's probably a matter of adjustment or calibration somehow.....

Decided to set the tester aside, and rip the VCR with on-screen menus out of the living room.

Seems that I only made things a bit worse, which is no big deal, but I notied that 2 or 3 of the controls (one was for blue convergence, where I have a problem) have absolutely no effect when turned. Is it possible that I have a bad convergence board?

I would check the caps/resistors on the board. Should be pretty easy since you can pull the board and set it on top or maybe on a chair near the rear of the set. Also, try spraying some cleaner in the controls.

Free to good home......come and get her :)

I just really need the space!

gosh darn it, one of us lives too far away!