I'm glad this is too far away...I have enough 21" eyeballs staring at me!


http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3056271544&category=15082

Here's the picture:

I wouldn't mind having it, but the picture looks like crap. It's hard to tell with the snowy pix, but it looks like the picture tube is bad.

If I were still living in my old hometown, which is only a couple miles from the Cleveland suburb of Willoughby, Ohio (and if I were in a house rather than an apartment) I'd probably bid on that Zenith TV, as I like all types of Zenith entertainment gear (I just recently scored a Zenith AM/FM wood table radio on ebay, and I scored a Zenith H511 there a couple years ago as well); in fact, thirty-plus years ago, fully half the basement of my former home was full of old TV sets, many of which were, you guessed it, Zeniths. However, since I now live in a small apartment, collecting old TV sets is out of the question anymore. My two Zenith radios are here, but that's all I have room for now.

That Zenith color console on ebay, however, looks like it is in great shape, at least on the outside. I can't help wondering if it works just as well. Since that set is a roundie, I'd say it is early-60s vintage. Looks to me as if it was well cared for, so I would say at this point that whomever wins the auction for it will not be disappointed. These old consoles looked as good in the living room off as when they were turned on.

As others have said in this forum, being Zeniths, these older consoles and portables (including radios) never seem to die--they go on and on and on. I had a 1963 Zenith 23-inch set in the late '60s I got from a neighbor's trash. The tubes, all but the HV rectifier and CRT, were missing, but it turned out to be well worth my while to retube the set, as it had a beautiful picture (even with rabbit ears in the basement on the three local TV stations, 30-odd miles southwest of me) and incredible sound (thanks to its 6BN6-6BQ5 audio system with a 6x9 oval speaker) when I turned it on for the first time.

Again, I feel very strongly that the winner of that auction will not be disappointed. Those early Zeniths were made to work well and to last, which is more than I can say for the company's current sets. At least in Zenith's early days no one had nearly as much trouble with the sets; certainly, faults did turn up in new sets once in a great while, but the Zeniths and RCAs of 1950s-70s vintage were not breaking down again and again, or as catastrophically, as the new ones seem to be these days. I have a good friend whose parents' late-90s-vintage RCA TV blew a picture tube after only two years. By contrast, they had a Zenith set for close to 20 years that never gave them much trouble at all except near the end, and they also had an RCA console in the '70s which worked very well for them for 15 or more years. The Zenith's CRT was still going strong when the set was finally scrapped, and I firmly believe the first RCA's (the console) was as well. These sets likely died from major circuitry problems such as defective flybacks or yokes, or other problems deemed too costly to repair given the sets' ages.

Originally posted by jstout66
I wouldn't mind having it, but the picture looks like crap. It's hard to tell with the snowy pix, but it looks like the picture tube is bad.

I wouldn't suspect the CRT just yet, js. The reason the picture "looks like crap" to you could very well be that it is so snowy. Color television requires a much stronger signal than monochrome to produce a good picture. The Willoughby, Ohio area is a near-fringe area for Cleveland television, being some 30 miles from the city's seven TV transmitters; one needs either a good outdoor or attic-mount antenna or cable to get consistenly good reception from every station in the city. I know this for a fact as I used to live near there, and I had cable on every set in my house from 1982 on, preceded by an attic-mounted antenna. Moreover, the further east you go in this area (northeast Ohio, near Lake Erie) the worse your TV and FM reception becomes. I recently moved to a village which is a fringe area for Cleveland television, just at the outer edge of the stations' coverage areas and over 40 miles from the city's TV transmitters; to get decent reception from Cleveland in this area one must have cable, as rabbit ears or even amplified outdoor antennas do not work well here or, in some cases and in some parts of the village, at all. (As an example, my own sets don't work worth a darn without cable.)

My best guess is that the person selling that Zenith roundie is trying to get by with rabbit ears, or even no antenna at all. I saw a coax cable hooked up to the antenna terminals through a matching transformer, but I have no idea where, if anywhere, the cable leads. If it goes nowhere, then it is no wonder the picture is so bad; coax is shielded, so very little signal will get to the set if the seller is trying to use the cable alone as a very poor excuse for an antenna.

In my opinion, this is a very poor way to demonstrate a television set he/she is trying to sell. If it were me in the same situation, I would have the set hooked up to cable through a converter so that it would be getting the best signal possible. Of course, there is always the possibility of weak or dead tubes in the tuner or IF strip, but I'd get a decent signal into the set first. That Zenith, with its deluxe SC400 remote and all, was a good set in its day; it can probably make a fairly good picture today, but it must have a decent signal at the antenna terminals to do so. I realize this sounds elementary, but there are people who think all they need is a coat hanger on the antenna terminals to get good color reception. If you are very close to the transmitters (say within a mile or two), this dodge might work, but in outlying suburbs or out here in the boondocks, miles away from the nearest TV station, you need either an antenna or cable or you just don't get much of anything.

I think the CRT is OK. If its bad you wouldn't be able to see it on a photograph! The red may be a little weak but you can touch up the screen controls to fix that.

Zenith....Space Command...Color roundie....Hi Fi sound..This has Dougs name written all over it! :D I like this particular model also. One of these days hopefully i'll have my own.
Tony

The set looks like it has a weak gun. Those round tubes were pretty durable tho, and I do agree that it could just use screen adjustments BUT I have seen enough bad picture tubes in my day and from the looks (what you can make out due to the poor signal) It looks like the red gun is either turned way down, or very week. If it were in my area I wouldn't pass on it. Those Zeniths were great sets. I wonder why the seller didn't try to display with a better picture? At least they didn't start the bidding at $500.00, which is one thing I HATE on eBay.

I think the seller may have made a small mistake in his/her description of that Zenith roundie we're discussing here. The round CRTs were only made in one size that I am aware of--21 inches. The seller quotes the screen size as 19 inches. I've been around televisions and electronics for over thirty years and have never yet seen a 19-inch round color CRT. RCA TVs of early 1950s vintage had 16-inch round monochrome tubes (16GP4), and Zenith's Great Circle Screen series used round CRTs as well, but to the best of my knowledge all round color tubes were 21 inches.

BTW, I think the seller is just trying to get the set off his/her hands as soon as possible, and doesn't know much or anything about TV or electronics. If, as some of you have said, the set has weak CRT guns or other problems in the chroma circuits, it is not "work(ing) well" as the seller said in the description. A color television with an off-color picture caused by chassis faults, including but not limited to defective tubes or a defective CRT, is not working well at all. IMO, the seller just wants to get rid of the set ASAP, and will do or say anything just to achieve that end.

The First RCA, Westinghouse and others used a 15" tube, Motorola had a 19" set but 99.999% of them were retrofitted with a 21" tube or were thrown out.

I think this one is still a 19" tube: http://audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=6434&highlight=motorola+color


Westinghouse had a rectangular tube in the 50's not sure of the size.

21" referred to the outside diameter of the glass, as always the viewable area is smaller.


Originally posted by Jeffhs
The round CRTs were only made in one size that I am aware of--21 inches. The seller quotes the screen size as 19 inches. I've been around televisions and electronics for over thirty years and have never yet seen a 19-inch round color CRT. RCA TVs of early 1950s vintage had 16-inch round monochrome tubes (16GP4), and Zenith's Great Circle Screen series used round CRTs as well, but to the best of my knowledge all round color tubes were 21 inches.

Several manufacturers made color sets with the 19 inch round tube but I don't think many of them besides Motorola went into production. I know of a Capehart which has a 19 inch CRT.

The Westinghouse rectangular was 22 inches.

Steve

Hoffman and CBS-Columbia also produced 19" Round tube color sets.

A quick diagonal measure of the 25MC33 behind me shows about 19 1/2", so to the uninformed 19" sounds good.

Also, the modern designation for the 21" round color tube is 19V. There is one round tube at least that has the 19V designation, meaning the viewable image area is 19".

Just wanted to drop a note to Doug, drh4683. I was snooping around on ebay just now and found another Zenith 1960s roundie console like the one he lost out on the other day, when the reserve was met. The bidding on the one I just saw is starting at $400. I don't have the link to it, but if he has the ebay toolbar it will be easy to find - just do a search on "Zenith TV" and it should be on one of the first five pages.

BTW, I saw Doug's pictures of the Zenith television plant in Chicago last night. Good to know Zenith still has a presence in Chicago, even if the company's televisions and such are now manufactured overseas.

Good luck.